Platoon defies orders in Iraq; cites safety concerns

The Drudge report ^ | Oct. 15, 2004 | Drudge

[blogblogginaway]

A 17-member Army Reserve platoon with troops from Jackson and around the Southeast deployed to Iraq is under arrest for refusing a "suicide mission" to deliver fuel, the troops' relatives said Thursday.

The soldiers refused an order on Wednesday to go to Taji, Iraq — north of Baghdad — because their vehicles were considered "deadlined" or extremely unsafe, said Patricia McCook of Jackson, wife of Sgt. Larry O. McCook.

Sgt. McCook, a deputy at the Hinds County Detention Center, and the 16 other members of the 343rd Quartermaster Company from Rock Hill, S.C., were read their rights and moved from the military barracks into tents, Patricia McCook said her husband told her during a panicked phone call about 5 a.m. Thursday.

The platoon could be charged with the willful disobeying of orders, punishable by dishonorable discharge, forfeiture of pay and up to five years confinement, said military law expert Mark Stevens, an associate professor of justice studies at Wesleyan College in Rocky Mount, N.C.

No military officials were able to confirm or deny the detainment of the platoon Thursday.

U.S. Rep. Bennie Thompson said he plans to submit a congressional inquiry today on behalf of the Mississippi soldiers to launch an investigation into whether they are being treated improperly.

"I would not want any member of the military to be put in a dangerous situation ill-equipped," said Thompson, who was contacted by families. "I have had similar complaints from military families about vehicles that weren't armor-plated, or bullet-proof vests that are outdated. It concerns me because we made over $150 billion in funds available to equip our forces in Iraq.

"President Bush takes the position that the troops are well-armed, but if this situation is true, it calls into question how honest he has been with the country," Thompson said.

[Squantos]

That's what I was waiting for.......eye on the ground in country !


Thanks !

BTW have ya seen this ?


US investigation finds 28 soldiers guilty over deaths of two Taliban suspects in Afghanistan
By Nick Meo in Kabul

http://news.independent.co.uk/low_res/story.jsp?story=572664&host=3&dir=71

16 October 2004
A US military criminal investigation has found 28 American soldiers culpable in the deaths of two Taliban suspects at an interrogation centre in Afghanistan.

The case has echoes of the later Abu Ghraib prison scandal in Iraq. Personnel from one of the units involved were based first at Bagram air base, near Kabul,and were later sent to the now-infamous Iraqi jail.

A Pentagon report has found that army regulars and reservists may have been guilty of involuntary manslaughter, maiming, battery, maltreatment and conspiracy in the two deaths which happened days apart in December 2002, well before the Iraq abuse. The military has ruled they were homicides.

Two men were found dead in interrogation cells at Bagram, the US military's Afghan base, after being beaten on the legs. One, the 30-year-old brother of a Taliban commander, died as a result of blood clots in the legs and and the other, a 22-year-old taxi driver detained after a rocket attack on US troops, suffered a heart attack after an apparent beating exacerbated an existing coronary condition.

Investigators found evidence that numerous soldiers had beaten the two Afghans, using their knees to hit the mens' legs apparently because marks would not then be obvious. Reports said both men had apparently been chained to the ceiling, one by the waist, one by the knees.

US army commanders will now decide whether to court-martial 27 unnamed soldiers.

The only one named so far is Sergeant James Bolan, a reservist who was serving as a guard at Bagram, who is charged with dereliction of duty and assault. Many alleged Taliban and al-Qa'ida prisoners have been held at Bagram, sometimes before being transferrred to Guantanamo Bay.

The units involved are the 377th Military Police unit and the 519th Military Intelligence unit. The 519th was later deployed at Abu Ghraib, where at least one Iraqi inmate died and prisoners were sexually humiliated.

Human rights campaigners have argued that harsh treatment of alleged Taliban prisoners in jails in Afghanistan - which independent monitors are denied access to - set a precedent for Iraq and may have contributed to the most damaging scandal to affect the US military in decades.

Jumana Musa from Amnesty International USA told The New York Times: "The failure to take prompt action over the prisoners' deaths indicates a chilling disregard for human life and may have laid the groundwork for abuses in Abu Ghraib and elsewhere."

[Terp]

I didn't realize that women worked on the flight deck of carriers.

They do.

[Eagle Eye]

There are those who do their duties no matter how distasteful and there are others who enjoy distasteful duties.

I can respect the former but the latter always concern me.

[Terpesman]

Yeah, Marines are the problem. It doesn't have anything to do with the fact that the insurgents are more organized and supported by outside forces, does it?

Now, who was running the escorts for the troops who refused to go on the mission? Was it the Marines? I also read last night that other soldiers from the unit went on the mission. The article also stated that it wasn't just the fact that they refused, it was the way they acted when they were told to go.

The Marines don't just have a good PR machine, we have earned our reputation through our actions, time and time again. If you want, I can give you a history lesson and we can talk about Belleau Wood, Tarawa, Iwo Jima, the Chosin Resevoir, and the battle at Khe Sahn.

And you're right, I never read about an attack on a convoy before the Marines showed up. In fact, from what I heard, the Army had things just about wrapped up, there were going to be elections within a week, and Iran was going to give up their nuclear weapons... and then the Marines came in and ruined everything.

And for the record, I have spent time over there too and I know a little about the overall situation as well.

Maybe what you need to do is go up to the first Marine you see and tell him that he's arrogant and that the Marines haven't paid in blood. Then, when you can, write back and let us know how the food is in the hospital.

I'd apologize for the tone of my post but you make me sick to my stomach!

[theFIRMbss]

>...we have a RATbastardmedia which will do anything to destroy pro-American forces at home or abroad. And it will find these whiners to exploit particularly when the traitorous Black Caucus ...

Ranting, crackpot posts make Bush supporters look nuts. Or do you know that? Are you just a nut? Or are you a troll making Bush fans look absurd?

[Socraticus]

ping

[American Vet Repairman]

Sola,
You made the best point yet. I have managed and led men and there IS A DIFFERENCE between the reserves and active duty. People say there is not, but there is a difference in mentation and discipline. Moreover, bringing women into the front lines who have been the product of gender normed standards facilitates problems.
The entire country of Iraq must be viewed as a combat zone. For this is the nature of the enemy we fight. Were the reservists right in refusing? No they were not. However, we must fully investigate the claims, hand out dishonorable discharges but NOT hand out jail sentences that will discourage recruitment. Six months hard labor is enough to back off a rational person from making a stupid decision.
The last thing we need to do is hand the Kerryistas the Banner- "Join the Army! Lose your freedom!"

[Henchman]

I don't see a problem. What's yer point?

[zip]

Ping

[zip]

But I was never in the military, so this is just my opinion.

I was in the military and I agree with your "opinion".

[zip]

What's happening to you is what should be happening to a soldier who is disobedient, disrespectful, unwilling to do his/her duty, and has an attitude

I find it very difficult to understand the current Army personnel behavior as opposed to the Army discipline and leadership during my 6 years in the Army. We didn't think of war as a game, we knew the dangers involved and relied on our officers and senior NCO's to lead us. Sometimes the good of the unit was more important than the good of the individual. We lived with it.

[zip]

"They knew there was a 99 percent chance they were going to get ambushed or fired at," Hill said her daughter told her. "They would have had no way to fight back."

I guess the loyal soldiers that completed the mission without incident were lucky enough to be in that 1 percent group.

This is sounding more and more like an leftist, anti war commercial.

[ought-six]

"I agree. To order military personal to attempt a dangerous mission with non-op equipment, is the equivalent of a 19th. Century General ordering a cavalry charge with dead horses."

You must have never served in the military. I served from 1970-1974. I can tell you that if the military waited for all of its equipment and materiel to be in tip-top shape before embarking on a mission, there would be no missions.

[ought-six]

"This sounds more like a mutiny, not a failure to obey a lawful order."

I agree.

[zip]

Maybe what you need to do is go up to the first Marine you see and tell him that he's arrogant and that the Marines haven't paid in blood. Then, when you can, write back and let us know how the food is in the hospital.

Hey, that works for me. BTW, my Marine friends, mostly from the 60's, wouldn't give him the option of going to the hospital.

[xone]

'my ant-ice and de-ice gear was not working properly.'

Lucky bastard, you had de-ice? And it sounds like anti-ice worked some time. IFR in unavoidable icing conditions is stupid in a helicopter. You wouldn't have to guess whether you might be 'ambushed', you would know for sure. When the environment is gonna kill you, enemy disposition doesn't matter. I've flown some medevacs in marginal wx that I wouldn't have flown but for the mission. I agree with the poster re: brakes and lights. If it can go and you can stop, do your f*****g job. It is a two dimensional world on the road. Proven by the rest of the company.

[elbucko]

You must have never served in the military. I served from 1970-1974

U.S. Army, 1967-1973. CALARNG, 1973-1975. OCS, Fort Sill, OK. Army Air Defense School, Ft. Bliss, TX.

Now what did you want to tell me again?

BTW, if you read more about the incident, you will find it is a lipstick mutiny. The "Commander" of this unit put a 21 year old girl in a MG turret. There is something wrong with this unit, females in combat areas and extremely poor leadership. The kind that issues a "charge" with dead horses.

Apology accepted.

[elbucko]

I can tell you that if the military waited for all of its equipment and materiel to be in tip-top shape before embarking on a mission, there would be no missions.

This incident is not about the equipment, it's about female personel in a combat area and poor leadership/communications.

[elbucko]

Sometimes the good of the unit was more important than the good of the individual. We lived with it.

That was back in the days of no females in combat units. Think back on all the trouble Jessica Lynch was, and she was only support. We sent SF's to rescue her once the press got wind of her "plight". Things are different now. The women think they can fight. They can't. But the services have to give them the chance.

[Terpesman]

You're right about that, my best friends father was a Marine in Vietnam, he's getting old but he's still one scary guy.