Who Needs Assault Weapons?

NY Times ^ | August 18, 2004 | NICHOLAS D. KRISTOF

[neverdem]

MERIDIAN, Idaho — If you've been longing for your very own assault rifle and 30-round magazine for the next holiday season, you're in luck.

President Bush, sidestepping a promise, is allowing the ban on assault rifles and oversized clips to expire on Sept. 14. So at a gun store here in Meridian, a bit west of Boise, the counter has a display promising "2 FREE HIGH-CAPACITY MAGAZINES."

All you have to do is purchase a new Beretta 9-millimeter handgun and you'll receive two high-capacity magazines - on the condition, the fine print states, that the federal ban expires on schedule.

President Bush promised in the last presidential campaign to support an extension of the ban, which was put in place in 1994 for 10 years. "It makes no sense for assault weapons to be around our society," Mr. Bush observed at the time.

These days Mr. Bush still says that he'll sign an extension of the ban if it happens to reach his desk. But he knows that the only way the ban can be extended on time is if he actually urges its passage, and he refuses to do that. So his promise to support an extension rings hollow - it's not exactly a lie, but it's not the full truth, either.

Mr. Bush's flip-flop is surprising because he has generally had the courage of his convictions. Apparently he's hiding from this issue because it's so politically charged.

Critics of the assault weapon ban have one valid point: the ban has more holes than Swiss cheese.

"The big frustration of my customers is that [the ban] removed things that were kind of fun and made it look cool, but didn't affect how the gun operated," said Sean Wontor, a salesman who heaved two rifles onto the counter of Sportsman's Warehouse here in Meridian to make his point.

One was an assault weapon that was produced before the ban (and thus still legal), and the other was a sanitized version produced afterward to comply with the ban by removing the bayonet mount and the flash suppressor.

After these cosmetic changes, the rifle is now no longer considered an assault weapon, yet, of course, it is just as lethal.

Still, assault weapons, while amounting to only 1 percent of America's 190 million privately owned guns, account for a hugely disproportionate share of gun violence precisely because of their macho appeal.

Assault weapons aren't necessary for any kind of hunting or target shooting, but they're popular because they can transform a suburban Walter Mitty into Rambo, for a lot less money than a Hummer.

"I've got a ton of customers shooting squirrels with AK-47's," said Kevin Tester, a gun salesman near Boise. "They're using 30-round magazines and 7.62-millimeter ammunition, they're shooting up the hills, and they're having a blast."

I grew up on an Oregon farm that bristled with guns to deal with the coyotes that dined on our sheep. Having fired everything from a pistol to a machine gun, I can testify that shooting can be a lot of fun. But consider the cost: 29,000 gun deaths in America each year.

While gun statistics are as malleable as Play-Doh, they do underscore that assault weapons are a special problem in America.

They accounted for 8.4 percent of the guns traced to crimes between 1988 and 1991, and they are still used in one in five fatal shootings of police officers. If anything, we should be plugging the holes in the ban by having it cover copycat weapons without bayonet mounts, instead of moving backward and allowing a new flood of weapons and high-capacity magazines.

The bottom line is that Mr. Bush's waffling on assault weapons will mean more dead Americans.

About 100 times as many Americans are already dying from gunfire in the U.S. as in Iraq. As many Americans die from firearms every six weeks as died in the 9/11 attacks - yet the White House is paralyzed on this issue.

Mr. Bush needs to live up to his campaign promise and push to keep the ban on assault weapons. Otherwise, we'll bring more of the Iraq-like carnage to our own shores, and his refusal to confront our gun problem will kill more Americans over time than Osama bin Laden ever could.

[Condor51]

Hey Guys, I need your HELP!

At my Village Board meeting tonight, they are going to VOTE on a bs Resolution on the AWB. They are going to send it to the Congress and Bush. And to the IL State House urging everyone to enact AND STRENGHTEN this stoo-pid ban. Oh and this Resolution was written by the one 'open' DEM on the Board and he's a lawyer to boot.

I've been writing to all the Trustees since Monday (including the lawyer Trustee) and the Mayor with arguments why it should not be passed but I need one more item....

I need your help as follows:

I have 40 pages of data BUT I can't find the latest Senate BILL or Amendment that will expand the weapons included.

I know the full text of the Bill and Sponsors were posted as a thread here last week(?), but I can't find it!!! HELP!!

That's all I need to send my final letter and to prepare my little speech before the Board tonight. Which btw, I was asked to attend by the Mayor! (he's ok)

I know you guys can do it, as you know everything :-)

Thanking you in advance
Condor

[Little Ray]

Ya shoots it 'cross their nose and they dies from heart failure... No damage to the carcass.

Besides, they're squirrels: fuzzy-tailed tree rats. You don't want to eat 'em - ya just want 'em dead!

[Condor51]

Never mind guys, I found the thread and the bill - it was written by Sen Lousyberg and cosponsored by every extreme RAT in the Senate.

Thanks anyway :-)

[Dead Corpse]

And if explosives and rockets are "arms" then I want my 2nd amendment rights restored!

It'd certainly make the 4th of July a LOT more fun. The heck with their itty bitty fireworks displays. ;-)

So when are we gonna get the Second Amendment Restoration Bill through Congress?

[P8riot]

All you have to do is purchase a new Beretta 9-millimeter handgun and you'll receive two high-capacity magazines - on the condition, the fine print states, that the federal ban expires on schedule.

Actually, it is a promotion that Beretta has going on nationwide.

[RogueIsland]

"I've got a ton of customers shooting squirrels with AK-47's," said Kevin Tester, a gun salesman near Boise.

Wimps. Real men use a quad-mount Ma Deuce .50 setup for that kind of work.

[P8riot]

I've got a Beowulf .50 specifically for squirrels

[RogueIsland]

I've got a Beowulf .50 specifically for squirrels

That's very smart thinking. You can go straight from squirrel to sausage casing without having to run it through a grinder. Mmmm... squirrel sausage.

[P8riot]

I go for efficiency

[DMZFrank]

Gun grabbers are increasingly trying to separate the right to keep and bear arms from its constitutional underpinnings. To everyone but liberals and gun grabbers the word militia implies a body organized for military use. The Supreme Court Miller decision of 1939 held that the militia was 'A body of citizens enrolled for military discipline.' And further that ordinarily when called for service these men were expected to appear bearing arms supplied by themselves and of the kind in common use at the time."

To begin with, only the national government was represented at the trial. With nobody arguing to the contrary, the court followed standard court procedure and assumed that the law was constitutional until proven otherwise. If both sides were present, the outcome may have been much different.

However, since only one party showed up, the case will stand in the court records as is. As to the militia, Mr. Justice McReynolds related the beliefs of the Founding Fathers when commenting historically about the Second Amendment. He stated that, ". . .The common view was that adequate defense of country and laws could be secured through the militia- civilians primarily, soldiers on occasion.

"The significance attributed to the term Militia appears from the debates in the Convention, the history and legislation of Colonies and States, and the writings of approved commentators. These show plainly enough that the Militia comprised all males physically capable of acting in concert for the common defense.

It is clear that the firearms that are most suited for modern-day militia use are those semi automatic military pattern weapons that the yellow press calls "assault weapons". Since nations such as the Swiss trust their citizenry with true selective fire assault rifles, it seems to me that this country ought to be at least able to trust its law-abiding citizenry with the semi automatic version.

Self-defense is a vital corollary benefit of the constitutional right to keep and bear arms. But its primary constitutional reason for being is for service in the well-regulated militia which is necessary to the security of a free state. WE must be prepared to maintain that security against even our own forces that are responding to the orders of a tyrannical government, and the only viable way to counter a standing army's qualitative advantage is with a huge quantitative one. Don't let the gun grabbers and their politician allies separate us from the constitutional reason for the right to keep and bear arms. Miltary pattern weapons are precisly the weapons that should be MOST constitutionally protected. Even defenders of the right often neglect the constitutional aspect of it, and concentrate on their near non-existent use in crime.

[endthematrix]

What town?

[chuknospam]

Index

[Condor51]

What town?

Woodridge.
However, WE won the fight!!!

The meeting was at overflow capacity of at least 200 - ALL NRA or pro-gun. Standing room only and the 'Resolution' was defeated 4-2 (maybe 5-2 I couldn't hear one vote). The TWO gun-grabbing Trustees are now guaranteed definite ouster in the next election that their 'seats' come up.

The gun-grabbers presents a slide show of BRADY CENTER propaganda and naturally catcalls and boos from the audience resulted. Especially when Kerry's name was shown as a backer of the AWB! 'We' had spokesman give presentations by the local Citizens for Firearm Safety group (pro-gun), the NRA and the ILRA.

One of the Trustees who voted 'Nay', also is an NRA member and owns most of the weapons covered under the expanded ban. He gave the verbal 'riot act' to his two fellow gun grabbing Trustees on this resolution.

And not to brag, but some of my correspondence (documentation) to the board over the last week was also effective. One woman Trustee quoted one of my emails almost verbatim. Another Trustee also referenced another point or two in some of my emails.

In addition, after the meeting I introduced my self to the president of the local Firearms group and he knew exactly who I was - the Mayor (pro 2nd Amendment) told him about my emails and the effort and solid facts I presented, and that they were definately effective in defeating this resolution.

So all in all it was a GOOD NIGHT.

[Wolf_Lochert]

The air groweth crisp.

Indeed.

The great guns slay from a league away, the death- bolts fly unseen,
And bellowing hill replies to hill, machine to brute machine,
But still in the end when the long lines bend and the battle hangs in doubt,
They take to the steel in the same old way that their fathers fought it out.

It is man to man and breast to breast and eye to bloodshot eye
And the reach and twist of the thrusting wrist,
as it was in the days gone by!
Along the shaken hills the guns their drumming thunder roll --
But the keen blades thrill with the lust to kill that leaps from the slayer's soul!

For hand and heart and living steel, one pulse of hate they feel.
Is your clan afraid of the naked blade?
Does it flinch from the bitter steel?
Perish your dreams of conquest then, your swollen hopes and bold,
For empire dwells with the stabbing blade, as it did in the days of old!

Donald Robert Perry Marquis, The Bayonet

[Lexinom]

That's worth a printout. Thank you.

[Dan from Michigan]

Kristof (Or is it Soviet Kristov..) is a damn liar. I picked apart his BS lies about Michigan gun shows once before(I know - I worked at booths there).

Assault weapons aren't necessary for any kind of hunting or target shooting, but they're popular because they can transform a suburban Walter Mitty into Rambo,

That's a real f'ing stupid statement typical of the paper of Jayson Blair - the NY SLIMES.

I'm not even going to waste any more time reading this crap.

[Dan from Michigan]

Nicholas Kristof must have been Jayson Blair's mentor.

You beat me to the Blair reference.

And I've caught him outright lying before on gun shows in Michigan.

[humblegunner]

Eeevil assault weapon ping.

[Eaker]

This just ain't right.

It should be: Attention Rambette! Christmas hint!

Bold text!!!

[Erik Latranyi]

Stop Global Whining!