Assault Weapon Ban extension PASSES (Senate amendment to gun industry protection bill)

C-Span ^ | 3-2-04 | Sen. Dianne Feinstein D-CA

[Atlas Sneezed]

The vote was:

52 -Aye in favor of extending the ban 47 -Nay opposed to the ban.

[Ichneumon]

It was the GUN vote that gave the Republicans ANYTHING AT ALL -THOSE MUTHER F'ING INGRATES!!!

Lest we forget, here was the political analysis in the aftermath of the 1994 elections, during which the Republicans took control of the House from the Democrats for the first time in many years, a few months after the original passage of the so-called "assault weapon ban" which is now up for renewal:

"The NRA is the reason the Republicans control the House. The fights that I fought, bloody though they were, cost a lot. The fight for the assault-weapons ban cost 20 [Democratic] members their seats in Congress."
-- President Bill Clinton

"As candidates who backed gun control legislation fell one by one across the nation Tuesday night, the National Rifle Association re-emerged as a high caliber political force that politicians cross at their own peril," reported The Hill on Nov. 10, 1994.

An astonishing 25% of all voters voted primarily on the gun issue.
-- Connie Chung, CBS News, November 10.

"Exit poll show data showed that more than a third of all voters who cast ballots Tuesday said they supported the National Rifle Association -- and two-thirds of those voters cast their ballots for Republican candidates."
-- Washington Post, November 10, p. A33

25% of all voters, nationwide, identified themselves as NRA or sympathetic to the NRA in exit poll interviews. 25% said the only reason they came out was to vote against gun control.
-- Dianne Feinstein campaign HQ

35% of the voters had a positive impression of the NRA and went overwhelmingly Republican.
-- MacNeil-Lehrer Report, November 10.

"The National Rifle Association...rebounded with a vengeance Tuesday (Nov. 8th) when at least a dozen of the gun-control supporters in Congress it had targeted were defeated by candidates who oppose weapons restrictions," reported Hearst News Service in the Portland Oregonian (11/10/94).

"They [NRA members and gun owners] alone may have well made the difference in this election," said Sen. Harris Wofford reflecting on his loss to Rick Santorum in the Pennsylvania U.S. Senate race (AP, 11/12/94).

"I don't want to destroy the good atmosphere in the room or in the country tonight, but I have to mention one issue that divided this body greatly last year. The last Congress also passed the Brady bill and, in the crime bill, the ban on 19 assault weapons. I don't think it's a secret to anybody in this room that several members of the last Congress who voted for that aren't here tonight because they voted for it." [Included the historic ouster of longtime Speaker of the House Foley -- Ich.]
-- President Bill Clinton

[BCR #226]

Don't be so sure. People are tired of being told that the government can play with our rights. If the 2nd Amendment goes, so do all the others. I choose to stand now rather than later. Now, I can do something about it, later, I'll wonder why I didn't do something if I don't now.

To you, it may not be the end all issue but to the rest of us, it is. I will not abide by any more trampling of my 2nd Amendment rights. There are three things you don't mess with regarding a man. his car and home, his woman, and especially his guns.

Mike

[MineralMan]

"You are assuming, of course, that the whole of the military would follow orders to kill their fellow Americans. Granted, some of them would, but I would bet that most members of the military would have a difficult time following orders to bomb and shoot their fellow Americans - possibly people they grew up with and members of their own families."

Civil War.
Kent State.
Waco.

In fact there are lots of cases I could mention that refute what you just said.

[xsrdx]

Yes, we all know the difference between semi-auto and select-fire. The bulk of the public does not, and does not care. They just want those ugly-looking military-style firearms out of the street and the schoolyard. It's an easy sell to the public to ban them.

But, what do we do? Tell them they're idiots and don't know what they're talking about? That seems to be the general run of things here and elsewhere.

Holy cow, I almost found myself agreeing with you there. But wait...

I wouldn't trade either for an AR-15 or anything similar. Not ever.

And then you go and display your true agenda.

Like the man said, the 2nd Amendment isn't about hunting, nor is it about what YOU think is appropriate weaponry.

While I agree that it's tough to argue in favor of ugly black guns, the REAL point is, we should'nt even have to...

[BCR #226]

Don't forget the Bonus Army...

Mike

[Henrietta]

"We need new arguments."

Many of us are out of patience, because we've tried using logic and reason, and it doesn't work. We've pointed out that the AWB has had absolutely no effect on crime (thank you, John Lott) and yet we still have people preaching the benefits of the AWB.

The problem, MM, is that these people want our guns, period. And nothing we do or say will have the least bit of effect on them. You can say that we are alienating folks with the "no compromise" talk, but the truth is that they have already alienated themselves with their blindness to the truth.

You seem to be saying that we should soften our stance, to appear more reasonable. I think we've been reasonable, and patiently tried to explain the error of their thinking, and backed up the assertion of error with cold, hard facts. So if they won't listen to reason, we don't need to be more "reasonable", we need to be more resolute.

There is nothing more unreasonable than a gun-hater; they simply are too blind to the facts to argue with them. So we must be resolute in asserting our rights. If we waver, we'll just continue losing. And then we'll be forced to do whatever unreasonable things our goverment demands, except that we'll be on the other end of the gun.

[dixiepatriot]

"The answer is that the government is not afraid at all."

True. The government is not afraid of the people. But they should be.

"What country before ever existed a century & a half without a rebellion? & what country can preserve it's liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon & pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it's natural manure." -- Thomas Jefferson to William Smith, Paris, November 13, 1787

[rintense]

Excellent point. I'd rather have both gun and voice. ;)

[El Gato]

Some of you folks come off not as constitutionalists, but as gun-happy goofs.

That's us. Just like Thomas Jefferson and George Washington. Both of whom are known to have had large gun collections. Way more than necessary for "sport" or "hunting", and way too nice to be intended merely for keeping their slaves in line. While there are lots of questionable quote from GW and TJ floating around. Heres one from the U of VA, founded by Jefferson:

"One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them." --Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796. ME 9:341

This one is interesting as well, and probably on point:

"If our fellow-citizens, now solidly republican, will sacrifice favoritism towards men for the preservation of principle, we may hope that no divisions will again endanger a degeneracy in our government." --Thomas Jefferson to Richard M. Johnson, 1808. ME 12:10

[Texas Federalist]

This issue is NOT the end all, BE all, MAJOR issue of all time and will not affect any thinking persons view of what Bush stands for and where he is leading this country.

Every time Bush sells us out - the AWB, CFR, Medicare spending, affirmative action, immigration, etc. - all I hear is that it is only one issue and it shouldn't affect our view of where Bush is leading the country. It's about time you realize that those "single" issues have added up and have become the direction where Bush is leading the country.

[Henrietta]

"The government's not scared."

Right. That's why they keep trying to disarm us.

[RockChucker]

Could someone tell me what was JUST voted on and what the results were?

Thanks.

[Joe Brower]

What you say is true, if the tactics you assume are followed -- a head to head confrontation.

A low-level, prolonged insurrection, with asymetrical, hit-and-run tactics on soft targets (like politicians), is what I believe our "leaders" are wary of. Have you considered this?

[Cboldt]

You're at fault[?] for giving us the opportunity to have a Firarms Liability Protection Bill in the first place.

Actually, my point was meant to be denigrating toward Collins and Snowe for voting to extend the AWB. In a small way, I contributed to that, by voting GOP instead of lesser evil. GOP has my vote. I'm not happy with the GOP.

[Henrietta]

"Two words: Kent State."

I doubt that the National Guard would have been so bold if the protesters had had rifles in their hands.

[Ichneumon]

Three things are very clear from today's press briefing:

1. Bush actually didn't want the ban extension to pass.

2. For political reasons, he said that he did want to extend it.

3. Rather than helping him, that ploy is now biting him on the ass.

His maneuver was so transparent that even the liberals see through it.

[Badray]

"Nice freeper pickup line. I'll have to remember that one."

Damn. I knew that I should have had it copyrighted. LOL

[MineralMan]

"Holy cow, I almost found myself agreeing with you there. But wait...

I wouldn't trade either for an AR-15 or anything similar. Not ever.

And then you go and display your true agenda.

---

Nope. What I said is that I would not trade my scoped .30-06 and Mossberg for an AR-15. Not in a million years. The two firearms I have are useful today and would be useful in the unlikely event that I had to repel some sort of invader on a broader basis than just my home.

Demonstrate to me how an AR-15 would be more useful to me than the two weapons I mentioned. I do not think you can do that.

In the unlikely event of a revolution or an invasion of foreign troops, I will be far more effective with either of those two weapons than I would be with an AR-15 or its equivalent.

No agenda. Just practical thinking.

[MineralMan]

"Don't forget the Bonus Army..."

Yes, indeed.

[MineralMan]

"Right. That's why they keep trying to disarm us.

"

And that's why they continue to succeed in doing so. You think the government's scared? Nope, not a chance.