Backers say Bush plan goes beyond immigration

Washington Times ^ | 1-15-04 | Bill Sammon

[JustPiper]

President Bush's political strategists, taking note of the unpopularity of his immigration initiative as reflected in public-opinion polls, expressed confidence yesterday that the proposal will gain support as it is recast as an economic and homeland security issue.

"Once people have had a chance to educate themselves about the proposal and what it does, support for it will grow," said Christine Iverson, spokeswoman for the Republican National Committee.

[JustPiper]

He didn't stimulate it! He ignored us for a year! Now that this election year (which BTW we predicted he would use this issue) but problem is he is using it to Hispander. We've worked long and hard on this issue, Bush has not cared. Ridge has not cared. I wish you would read factual materials regarding Bush and his desires for amnesty. Yes it has come to the forefront. But it will haunt Bush and come back to bite him in the rear!

WE BEGGED HIM! WE WARNED HIM! NOW WE'RE FIGHTING BACK!

[JustPiper]

Tom Tancredo has won 18 write-ins

Wow! Bump to you all! I'm on about 1/2 dozen only!

[JustPiper]

Do you have any concept what working Americans have been reduced to in the workforce? Many of us here know firsthand! Do you have a clue 'what' work Americans have been 'forced' to give up and the wages we've been forced to cut in half? Many of us here have! Do you know how many jobs we must work now and our spouse's? We do! Some of our households have between 2-4 and more in order to survive!

[JustPiper]

BumPing my friend!

[JustPiper]

I expect to see class envy from DU posters

An admission?

[JustPiper]

Do you get out much? Do you even know how much the fastfood chains or even Walgreens, etc pay their employee's? Very little above minimum. Do you know how many seniors are 'forced' to supplement their incomes working these jobs? Are grateful for these jobs?! Bagging groceries etc whatever it takes to live! Do you know how many single mother's have been forced into the workforce because they did not want 'public aid' any longer? And now work 2 jobs to support these children?

You truly need a reality check on the real world the rest of us live in

Have you or your family benefitted hiring illegals?

[JustPiper]

I have two teens who have not been able to get the jobs once offered and $6 an hour is alot to them!

[JustPiper]

Heavy thoughts not by Jack Handy ;)

[JustPiper]

Thanks for that info , I added it to these on my homepage ;)

"I oppose amnesty, placing undocumented workers on the automatic path to citizenship. Granting amnesty encourages violation of our laws and perpetuates illegal immigration."
-President George W. Bush

"This plan is not amnesty," the president said of his plan to match workers with jobs. "I oppose amnesty because it encourages violation of our laws."-President Bush 1/12/04

[Solson]

Really, between 2-4 in ONE Household? Oh my gosh, I never realized that. Shucks...

With 5 kids and a wife who does an outstanding job staying at home raising the kids, I just might have a clue at what it takes to survive.

So what exactly are you hoping for? A government mandate that says you only have to work one job? A "living wage"?

Do you really think businesses will agree to doubling their cost of labor just to employ an American? Hardly. They'll continue to move offshore where the labor costs are much less. I don't blame them at all.

The concept of a "cheap American laborforce" doesn't exist anymore. We're too rich, too educated, and too unwilling to do menial tasks in order to survive. Frankly, we haven't had to "survive" since the Depression. We won't be anywhere near that point in the future either.

[Solson]

Yeah I get out plenty and in many parts of the country, including mine, $8 per hr is the average for fast food work. And all the places are hiring. I know how many seniors are working.

Yet, you seem to think that by shrinking the low wage labor pool this will do what?

Have I or my family benefitted from hiring illegals? Nope....not that it's any of your business.

[Solson]

An admission of what? That FR posters are increasingly jealous of what others make and thus engage in class envy? Sure!

[txdoda]

Bush's proposal has started the conversation. By adding things, like proof of recruiting in disadvantaged areas and no response, to show that "Americans won't do the work" is fine for me.>>>>>>

There's a thread today about LEGALS suing, because our INS remains up to 6 yrs. *behind* on the up-dating of their paperwork. The lawyers says this could involve some 50,000 LEGAL immigrants.

What 'monstrous' dept. is GWB going to create that will identify 8 million illegals, & verify & track them to 8 million employers ??? And how many YEARS will this take ??


Right now this seems to be an all or none discussion on FR with most unwilling to sign on to anything but "find em, take em and ship em out." >>>>>>>>

You need to read 'Sabertooth's 18 solutions, which are very workable, & also addresses a guest worker program.

[Solson]

I've read Saber's solutions and continue to debate the merits with him.

Bush's plan isn't to create a huge bureacracy to do this but to rely on illegals volunteering to register and pay because if they do not, they risk being pushed out for good.

Bush's plan, coupled with increase enforcement and strong border protection will create competition about temp workers to maintain their job or be deported in lieu of the person next in line to come in.

The INS has been terribly mismanaged for years. Addressing that situation should also be part of any package moving forward. That doesn't make Bush' plan unworkable.

[txdoda]

Do you really think businesses will agree to doubling their cost of labor just to employ an American? >>>>>>

Do you really think 'illegal employers' will pay a decent wage, withold taxes, & offer benefits, because GWB has *requested* they start obeying the law ??

Do you think illegals will give up 8/10 bucks per hour so they can register for a min. wage job, pay taxes & then leave in 3 years ??

Do you think a 'guest worker program' will END our illegal problem ??

[truthkeeper]

If we don't have the gonads to deport en masse then don't legalize these invaders. Let them live as serfs. Let them live in the shadows. Let them live second class. I don't believe in rewarding illegal immigrants who invade my country making the USA into Latin America's flop house.

You took the words right out of my mouth. BTW, 95% of all outstanding homicide warrants in Los Angeles are for illegal aliens. I'm sick and tired of hearing about all the harmless grape pickers and, worst of all, the "brave immigrants" who jump the border looking for work. Enough already...it's as credible as the "religion of peace" rhetoric that is always foisted upon us.
Southern California BUMP to the top.

[txdoda]

I have two teens who have not been able to get the jobs once offered and $6 an hour is alot to them!>>>>

Tell them to hang in there.......my 'last' teen finally got a part-time 'fast food', pays $5.15 ph, she's happy. However, it was much harder for our 'last' boy to find his first jobs, as our town has been invaded.


Thanks for that info , I added it to these on my homepage ;) >>>>>>>>>>anytime !!

[Solson]

Answering a question with a question...tsk tsk tsk...

Do you really think 'illegal employers' will pay a decent wage, withold taxes, & offer benefits, because GWB has *requested* they start obeying the law ??

Ah, most large companies, who seem to be the continual target of ire on these threads do everything they can NOT to hire illegals. Do I think that employers, if given the opportunity to still find willing low wage workers will legitimize their hiring practices? Yep!

Do you think illegals will give up 8/10 bucks per hour so they can register for a min. wage job, pay taxes & then leave in 3 years ??

Ah, why would they have to give up their current job? Do I think they would register in order to gain legitimate employment with the chance at upward mobility? Yep.

Do you think a 'guest worker program' will END our illegal problem ??

End? No. There will always be a problem with it as their is with everything else. Despite how hard you may try, you'll never end poverty, unemployment, nor illegal aliens. Utopian thought is not very productive.

[texastoo]

He didn't stimulate it! He ignored us for a year.

If I remember correctly, we were told in 2002 that immigration would not be on the table to talk about. I think Carl Rove was the one that ordered us to keep our mouths shut about immigration.

What Carl Rove and Bush didn't understand, much like Daddy Bush as being out of touch with the American people, is the illegal immigration issue has always been on the table. IMO, since the elite are so out of touch with the American people, they are having to consult polls.

[Solson]

BTW, Most experts agree that immigration has had no discernible impact on wages. The Cato Institute has plenty of info on this. You can find it here