Poll: Will Bush's proposal to grant amnesty to millions of illegal aliens affect your vote?

CitizensLobby.com ^ | 1/9/2004 | CitizensLobby

[YoungKentuckyConservative]

Will President Bush's proposal to grant amnesty to millions of illegal aliens affect your vote in the 2004 presidential election?

"Against the insidious wiles of foreign influence the jealousy of a free people ought to be constantly awake, since history and experience prove that foreign influence is one of the most baneful foes of republican government." ---George Washington, 1793

[petercooper]

Hey, I've done plenty of crappy jobs in my life (while putting myself through school), and now don't have to.

The NYC municipal unions have Bloomberg by the balls, and they know it. They pay next to nothing for their medical care, retirement benefits after 20 yrs, and absolutely no givebacks during this latest NYC budget crisis. You can start sanitation in the 30's and with OT after 5 yrs be at $50-$60k. And they pull the scam the cops and firemen do - load up on OT the last 3yrs so your pension balloons. I'm not saying it's not hard work, it is, but it's a racket. And these unions with their promised pension obligations which will skyrocket in the next few years will bankrupt NYC with 5 years.

[Unadorned]

From Steve Sailer's blog today ( www.iSteve.com ; scroll down):

"A much admired Republican leader emails me: 'Here are about four issues that I am concerned about as a citizen: 1) government is too big and too intrusive: I would like to see it reduced; 2) race preferences need to be totally eliminated; 3) immigration needs to be brought under control; and 4) the education establishment needs to be reduced and contained. [To this, I would add the crying need for fundamental tax reform at the federal level. -- Unadorned] With regard to these four issues, I would ask anyone to tell me whether any of them have been improved as a result of the Bush presidency. I think not. Although I could never bring myself to vote for any of the candidates currently running against Bush [I could -- I'm voting for Howard Phillips, though I could never, it's true, vote for a Dem. -- Unadorned], I am not convinced that with respect to the issues that are of concern to me, things would be demonstrably worse with any of them serving as president with a Republican-controlled Congress."

I say AMEN to that excellent statement!

[riri]

What do you consider to be an outragous salary?

On this board, most think anything over $15 an hour is an outrageous salary. $20 dollars an hour is obscene even though it is only $41,000 a year before taxes.

Ofcourse, the people who say this are all worth this and more. It's just that no one else is. And try living on the obscene wage of $41,000 a year.

[Unadorned]

Sabertooth makes an excellent point, one which gets made way too seldom:

"Since conservative judges are better than liberal judges, why does it make sense to risk more liberal judges by having President Bush sow division in the party over his desire to Amnesty millions of Illegals?"

How come no one blames Bush-the-Backstabber for risking splitting the anti-Dem forces with his psychotic/compulsive need to worship and deify all things Mexican, always placing them over and above the interests of his own country and people? Can't someone get this second-generation Tranzi-in-good-standing traitor to a good shrink or something, instead of sitting by while the nutcase puts the country straight on the path to the election of a Dem president? I mean, why is this guy so sacrosanct in the eyes of so many -- are they mere groupies or something? Why no reprimands by his supporters? Why is on one on his side trying to knock some sense into him?

[Unadorned]

This letter to "View From the Right" ( www.amnation.com/vfr ) explains lots of things:

"Shrewsbury brings up spiritual pride, and this strikes a cord with me regarding GWB. Bush was, from what I can see, something of a drunk and frequent cocaine user who at 40 had a come-to-Jesus moment. Like his worthless brother Neil, he was something of a joke to his Dad and the star of the family, younger brother Jeb. The GWB we see now is the strutting, cocksure, fallen-but-now-saved, inflexible gentleman who is going to save the rest of us from his fate. Posted by: j.hagan on January 10, 2004 03:09 PM"

http://www.amnation.com/vfr/archives/002076.html#12253

[Unadorned]

Sabertooth, I just scoped out your post of the 7th, listing eighteen ways to take care of the illegals problem. If you run for president, friend, you've got my vote, my hefty cash contribution as big as I can possibly make it, and my many months of volunteer footwork in the precincts.

Everyone here -- and every American patriot -- needs to read Sabertooth's post:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1053318/posts

Karl Rove and W need to have a copy of it glued to their faces, print side against their eyeballs.

[Unadorned]

Herewith a couple of comments chosen almost at random from among hundreds which anyone here could post, culled from all over the internet (these two happen to be from VFR, www.amnation.com/vfr ):

"Bubba writes that he does not follow Patterico’s argument. I think what Patterico is saying is that once illegals become amnestied, they will in many cases turn to welfare before taking any job at minimum wage or less [one-hundred percent damned right! -- Unadorned note]. The jobs they do not take will be taken by a new crop of illegals [all brought in by Bush, whom Bush would then insist on amnestying all over again, in their tens of millions. -- Unadorned note]. I don’t know if this is true, I just passed it along as an interesting comment. Surely many illegals have flocked to cities like New York where welfare benefits of all types far exceed in value the pay for entry level jobs. I believe this is intentional [of COURSE it is! -- Unadorned note], to create a client class for the Democrat bureaucrat/social service provider patronage machine [Bush works hand-in-glove with the Dems -- always has, always will. -- Unadorned note]. Posted by: thucydides on January 10, 2004 05:43 PM"

" [...] Which brings me back to [Sen.] Feinstein. She has always been decent on immigration, as have a number of other liberals [indeed: Joe Guzzardi; Brenda Walker; many others. -- Unadorned note] and even leftists. Meanwhile some establishment conservatives have been awful — think of Orin Hatch or Sam Brownback. As I mentioned in an earlier post, in LA it is the politically eclectic ‘John and Ken’ that are leading the talk radio charge against this idiocy, whereas the Rushes and Hannitys of the dial ignore it or make idiotic ‘Clinton was worse’ non-arguments. This is an issue where right will have to unite with left against the plutocrats and the ethnic activists. Posted by: Mitchell Young on January 10, 2004 04:01 PM"

[Both comments were in the thread accompanying this Lawrence Auster log entry:

http://www.amnation.com/vfr/archives/002076.html ]

[Ima Lurker]

I would gladly pay double or triple for my groceries to finally put an end to this ILLEGAL invasion of our Country, supported and helped by our leaders. Besides, we are paying anyway by means of increased taxes. No one can honestly deny that.

I think Bush is doing a great job with the war on terror. I wouldn't be quite so disappointed in him if he hadn't pandered to the illegals so much in his speech. All this talk about "a nation of immigrants" is hogwash! We are and should be a nation of LEGAL immigrants. Rewarding ILLEGALS will only cause more ILLEGAL immigration whether or not this passes congress.

As far as my vote, I'm not sure yet. Probably I will hold my nose and vote for Bush feeling like a hyprocrite the whole time.

[NittanyLion]

Then don't complain when your grocery bill doubles or triples.

Don't be absurd. In the absence of humans for labor intensive tasks, we'll invent machines to handle the work. It's always been that way; your statement shows a real ignorance of history.

[NittanyLion]

If one opposes government actions, which is a very general, solid, encompassing philosophy completely independent of the Constitution -- well then why would alleged conservatives be looking to government to solve immigration issues.

Eliminate government entitlement programs, and we're in agreement. But until you eliminate massive government involvement in benefits, one cannot legitimately advocate allowing unfettered immigration.

[Semaphore Heathcliffe]

He is a Christian first and foremost and everything he does bears that in mind.

Bush is also a Christian who will never live in a neighborhood demolished by an influx of illegals, he'll never be in the middle class watching his standard of living drop. He's insulated from the results of his Christian zeal. He might have plenty to explain at the gates.

[Lee'sGhost]

"He truly is a Christ-like role model and I find him very refreshing."

Not sure how this relates, but your comment reminded me of Bill Mahr's (sp?) comment on the O'Reily show the other night. Whined about how he couldn't understand why Republicans followed the personality rather than the actions of their electeds (or something like that). Of course, anyone in Amercia with an IQ over 10 would immediately wonder "huh? Aren't you confusing Bush with Clinton and liberals?" It was typical lib 2+2 = 22.

[dalereed]

"They didn't cross the Southern border illegally as many on this board would like you to believe."

Aprox. 20% of the illegals coming across the Mexican border are Middle Eastern or Asian. This came strait from a conversation with INS border patrol agents I had at Brown Field, San Diego.

They pay big money to be smuggled in here through Mexico.

15 years ago I was offered $1,000/head to fly chinese between 2 private air strips in Mexico (Guadalahara to Mexicalli), I turned it down but someone no doubt didn't.

[dalereed]

"And try living on the obscene wage of $41,000 a year."

Because the illegals have trashed the construction industry I can't charge people more than $20/hr and out of that pay all the expenses to perform work for them, $3,500/year for gas, provide $15-20k of tools and their maintainance and my net per year is about $20k and I live just fine.

The only advantage people have by hiring illegals is they don't pay any of the payroll taxes or compensation insurance because they are being paid in cash. As far as working cheap, they don't, they won't work for less than $8/hr plus transportation and a free lunch.

Use the INS personell to catch and fine employers the maximum and it will force the illegals to flee home.

[o_zarkman44]

Making 50 to 60K$ in NYC is not making money. Especially if working overtime to do so. Most of the retirees will have to leave the city to be able to afford to live on the pensions that they earned with hard work and sacrifice.
Obviously you have never worked in 100 degree heat or 30 Below 0 windchill every year for 30 years. Amazing what people do to make big money yes???

Now that you are educated and don't have to work the crappy jobs is part of the problem in America. Bloated egos leave the low skilled, unfilled, crappy jobs open to illegal immigrants, when we have American freeloading 3rd generation welfare people consuming your tax dollars. When the illegals move into your company and offer to work for less will you take a pay cut to keep your job?

Anyone who hires illegals is driven by greed. Saving a buck so to avoid paying the taxes that are consumed by the illegal immigrants for the problems they burden taxpayers with. Capitalism is good for America. So is making money. But only if our laws are enforced to keep the playing field even. Cheap labor does not have to be from illegal immigrants. Someday it could be you in a soup line signing up for day labor.

[Unadorned]

A draft Tom Tancredo movement has begun in the great state of Tennessee:

http://www.amnation.com/vfr/archives/002082.html

Why not in the forty-nine other states? I've decided that if they don't get one going in my state I'll just write Tancredo in.

That G.W. Bush is a backstabbing Tranzi who plans on merging Mexico and the United States into a single country is now beyond dispute. There's no reasoning with the man -- he's deaf to all contrary opinions. He'll NEVER stop, or listen to anyone else's opinion about what he plans on forcing down the American people's unwilling throats. Don't anyone even waste their breath trying to get through to him or his stooges and yes-men -- or, for that matter, to his starry-eyed groupies among the general public: they won't listen, and will only blame YOU for "splitting the Republican Party in an election year." This man (make that, this poorest imaginable excuse for a man, this pathetic decades-long drunk and former cocaine user) has to be kicked out of the White House.

[Unadorned]

Everyone PLEASE see the following article, a MUST read for those who are still perplexed by Bush's absolutely incredible, unfathomable behavior:

http://www.vdare.com/sailer/bush_thinking.htm

What we've got in the White House is a cross between a Tranzi traitor and a Mexican mafioso, no better or less criminal in his own way than Bill Clinton was in his. This Bush person is NOT a patriotic American and does NOT stand for Americans AT ALL, but for the interests of his family and ONLY the interests of his family. He must be gotten rid of -- must be driven out of office, and pray God he WILL BE driven out!

[petercooper]

Yes I have worked in 100 degree heat- thanks. And I don't have a bloated ego. I've worked all sorts of jobs, always striving to improve myself and my prospects. Whatever happened to ambition? Start at an entry level job, get some training, get some college, try to improve your lot in life. Work hard and look for the next step up. Look at Dick Gephardt, his father was a truck driver for heavens sake/

The American freeloading 3rd generation welfare people are consuming my tax dollars, yes. Cut back on welfare, and have these people get off their asses and work. Kick the illegals out, and slam the door shut.