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¿Habla Español? Your kids may soon
The Skagit Valley Herald ^ | 12/01/2003 | Steve Howie

Posted on 12/30/2003 7:27:17 PM PST by MontN

¿Habla Español? Your kids may soon
By STEVE HOWIE

MOUNT VERNON — The school district is studying the possibility of converting one or more of its six elementary schools into dual language programs where the day is divided between lessons in Spanish and English for all students.

"Research says that's the best delivery model," Superintendent Mack Armstrong said. "Then the question is, Why wouldn't we do it?"

...

Armstrong's enthusiasm for the idea follows a visit to the district two weeks ago by Richard Gomez, bilingual education director for the state education department in Olympia.

In the last three years, Gomez has spearheaded efforts to create 17 dual language schools in the state, primarily in eastern Washington. In his previous job in Texas, he helped establish 50 of the schools.

Click here for the whole enchilada...

(Excerpt) Read more at skagitvalleyherald.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; Government; News/Current Events; US: Washington
KEYWORDS: aliens; bilingual; school; spanish
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To: FITZ
I tend not to believe that idea about the mind closing or becoming less able to learn once you reach adulthood.

You may be right.

I studied for 6 years, and got straight A's in school. A couple of years later I went to Mexico for the first time and was mortified to realize that I couldn't speak one intelligible sentence, and if I managed that (after rehearsing it to myself for 15 minutes) I couldn't understand the answer.

I put it on myself to go back and relearn all that I had supposedly learned, working my way back through some of the same textbooks I studied in high school, and then through some more advanced ones from the library. But the important thing is that I made a couple of trips to Mexico alone and forced myself to function in the language.

Later I convinced my company I was fluent and they sent me to South America where I understood precisely nothing (small differences in accent and cadence are enormous when your command of the language is tenuous) but I isolated myself from my American colleagues and surrounded myself with my own team of non-English speakers. It took several months but eventually it kicked in. When it finally did I was glad I had spent all those years studying grammar, but study alone couldn't get me there, you are right, I had to go and live it.

Most of the other Americans never got there because they associated mainly with each other, or with english-speaking people. This also meant that they never really knew what was going on, they only thought they did...

I was fortunate to go on from there to work several more jobs in Latin America, and did some technical training there, which also helped, there is nothing like being on your feet 8 hours a day, day after day, month after month, talking and thinking on your feet, to drill it into your head.

I also eventually went to night school and studied some literature, which makes a big difference as well...

My claim to fame is that people will ask me if I'm from (pick a neighboring Spanish speaking country)... the point being that my accent is hard to place... But of course if my Spanish was as perfect as I want it to be, no one would even comment... And anyway maybe they're just being polite...

I have some dealings now in my present life with immigrants whose precise legal status I am too polite to question... but knowing these people personally, and having lived in Mexico I see things a little differently than some do. I don't disagree with the need to control the borders, I am a hawk on immigration issues, but I have no personal animosity against the people personally, in fact the people I know, I like.

I never hide my conservative opinions from anyone, it is sad to say that most of the people I talk to have never heard our side of most issues. This is true whether in Mexico or anywhere else in Latin America, their news is identical to ours, which is to say that they have never heard our side of any issue explained. And when they hear it, its like a light goes on. Well, sometimes. Sometimes they just dismiss it, saying that would never work in our country...

81 posted on 12/30/2003 10:15:05 PM PST by marron
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To: MontN; nutmeg; rmlew; Yehuda; firebrand; Clemenza; PARodrig; RaceBannon; harpseal; A. Pole
I got away from Latin America and came to this country to become an American. That was over forty years ago. I escaped a culture that to this day is a failure politically, socially and economically. It was the third world then and it remains so today. They did not have bilingual education then, so I learned English the hard way. I speak it better than most natives do.

It angers me that since I have been in this country the left continues to do everything possible to turn the US into just another third world cesspool. Multiculturalism isn't about respecting other cultures, it is about destroying ours.

We have turned from a nation open to immigration willing to admit people who will assimilate, to a nation open to colonization admitting people who have no interest in becoming Americans.

The nihilistic scumbags of the left want to commit western culture and society to tghe path of suicide and want to drag the rest of us along for the ride.

The great shame of it all, is that the golf playing country clubbers of the RNC and the Multi-nationalist corporatists are conspiring to achieve this end. All with global "free trade" and amnesty for millions who never "earned" entry into this country.

You can only stretch a rubber band so far and I fear the snapping point looms on the horizon. Like the Balkans we are becoming we may soon find that the various groups will resort to arms to displace the others. All in the name of a policy of divide and conquer so the left wing elites can consolidate their hold on power and the delusional republican elites go along for the ride thinking they will share in it.

I am glad In have no children, I would fear for their future once I left this life.

82 posted on 12/30/2003 10:20:30 PM PST by Cacique
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To: marron
I have some dealings now in my present life with immigrants whose precise legal status I am too polite to question... but knowing these people personally, and having lived in Mexico I see things a little differently than some do. I don't disagree with the need to control the borders, I am a hawk on immigration issues, but I have no personal animosity against the people personally, in fact the people I know, I like.

I have dealings with some I know are illegals and I don't have any personal animosity against them either. I actually don't distinguish all that much between legal and illegal immigrants because around here some of the legals are worst than some of the illegals. I live in an area that is becoming less and less English speaking, more and more welfare dependent and there are some things I think are dangerous to this country and our unity as a people. America became strong as a country when we took the melting-pot approach and had a common language so we could speak with one another. Even back then foreign languages were studied --- Latin or Greek were required in many high schools because they are the classic languages --- but the American people aimed for a common language.

As far as the government --- the most it should do is encourage A foreign language be studied --- but drop the pushing of one particular one. The public schools have enough problem teaching math and reading --- they really don't need to take on something else they aren't likely to do so well.

83 posted on 12/30/2003 10:27:12 PM PST by FITZ
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To: FITZ
I tend not to believe that idea about the mind closing or becoming less able to learn once you reach adulthood.

I agree. I was just as useless at foriegn languages when I was a child as I am now. A lot of it is just personal inclination; we all have areas in which we excell, and others in which we are weak. As an army brat in elementary school in Germany, I was always one of the worst students in German class, even though I was usually near the top of the class in most other subjects. Right now, I'm a very mediocre Latin student in college, as I was in high school. I managed to get a B for the first 100 level course, but I know I deserved a lower grade. I'll have to take the course again as an audit if I'm to have any chance at all at making a decent grade in the next course. I'm just slow in that area.
84 posted on 12/30/2003 10:36:43 PM PST by Welsh Rabbit
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To: Lexinom
Red states and blue states, my friend. BTW, given a coercive choice, I'd rather lose my wallet here than in NYC (speaking of culture).

I would expect nothing less from someone with your perspective.

85 posted on 12/31/2003 5:28:16 AM PST by ClintonBeGone
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To: cyncooper
My eight year old has a spanish class, last year in second grade they had a German class. I think a second language is great for my kid. Next I hope they teach some Italian.
86 posted on 12/31/2003 5:30:45 AM PST by angcat
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To: MontN
Yet another reason why my children will go to a private Christian school. Costs be hanged!
87 posted on 12/31/2003 5:39:18 AM PST by RiflemanSharpe (An American for a more socially and fiscally conservation America!)
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To: MontN
Our cultural heritage continues to slip away to people who did not work for it, did not build it, do not respect it... In order to keep America strong, we need to continue to educate our students in the govenment schools in English only.

Our cultural heritage is based on the ideas that are expressed through language, not on the language through which they are expressed. However, it's evident that you are completely unaware of this by what you say in your second sentence:
In order to keep America strong, we need to continue to educate our students in the govenment schools in English only.
In light of the history of American public schools, this statement is simply ludicrous. English in the government schools has not kept America strong because various government edicts have prevented certain topics from even being discussed in English and have mandated that other doctrines be promulgated in English. Control, in English, over the public school curriculum has also dropped many important things down the memory hole. So English in government schools has served neither to preserve the cultural heritage of the United States nor to protect it from a deliberate assault--using the English language--started by The Gang of Twenty-seven back in 1913.

Neglect of social, political, religious, and economic history has probably done more damage to the heritage of the United States than anything else. Get your attention back to where it belongs, on intellectual content, not nativist jingoism. Otherwise you won't be doing anything different from what The Gang of Twenty-seven has been doing, mostly in English, since 1913.
88 posted on 12/31/2003 5:51:00 AM PST by aruanan
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To: MontN
I don't think you can force any child to learn spanish or any other language unless they have a desire to.

When I was in school, there was a big push for all the advance placement students to take 4 years of spanish.

I took the classes because I had to, while I have nothing against hispanics, I've never had a bit of interest in hispanic culture, radio, tv etc.

Long story short, I managed to trudge through the classes with respectable grades, but never could muster the desire to do anything more than learn the minimum required to pass the class.

That was 15 years ago, today the only thing I remember is a few sentences and the numbers.
89 posted on 12/31/2003 5:51:35 AM PST by apillar
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To: FreedomFarmer
I grew up on a reservation and didn't hear English until I was 10. Tell me, paleface, how you signed up tomorrow to spread homophobia today?

And I, speaking Spanish and Portuguese for more than 3/5 of my life, can go into any country in the Americas (minus Haiti) and comfortably survive.
90 posted on 12/31/2003 5:53:47 AM PST by aruanan
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To: marron
"I would be in favor of requiring 'x' number of years of Spanish for everyone."

You want to REQUIRE that EVERYONE learn and speak Spanish? Why Spanish? Are you one of those La Raza extremists? Why not German? Or Polish? Or Swahili? And what are you going to do to those who don't "learn" Spanish? Put them in camps? Start an Inquisition to punish them? Good grief. Go back to Mexico.
91 posted on 12/31/2003 6:19:15 AM PST by ought-six
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To: Lexinom
"Mexican family values in many ways put their American counterparts to shame: they generally care for their elderly, value all human life (born and unborn), and maintain a strong family unit." I guess that explains the huge number of Mexican gangbangers, violent criminals, illegitimate babies, etc. Yup, they really value all human life.
92 posted on 12/31/2003 6:29:04 AM PST by ought-six
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To: ought-six
You are talking about second-generation Mexicans - really, Americans born to Mexican immigrant parents. Huge difference.
93 posted on 12/31/2003 7:06:36 AM PST by Lexinom ("No society rises above its idea of God." -unknown)
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To: ClintonBeGone
Solamente un tonto temería un idioma extranjero.

Solamente un idiota no sabría que él había hecho una privada broma.

Español es la lengua hablada por los obvios.

Incluso un idiota lo sabe.

94 posted on 12/31/2003 7:53:37 AM PST by Cathryn Crawford (¿Podemos ahora sonreír?)
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To: FITZ
I've met people who studied 4 years of Spanish not be able to converse in that language in Mexico at all --- they may have all the rules of grammar down but they don't understand the spoken language -- and that includes slang and expressions they won't teach you.

That's absolutely depressing because I am starting my 4th semester of Spanish and stuggle mightily with listening comprehension of native speakers. I'm worse at speaking. But I do well on grammar and vocab tests. For dummies like me, it will take several years to become halfway fluent.

95 posted on 12/31/2003 8:02:42 AM PST by Ben Chad
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To: Cathryn Crawford
Touche
96 posted on 12/31/2003 8:05:20 AM PST by Ben Chad
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To: MontN
I think that teaching a foreign language early on is quite a good idea.

The fact that it's Spanish is what's causing people to think twice here.

97 posted on 12/31/2003 8:05:54 AM PST by jude24 ("Facts are meaningless! You can use facts to prove anything thats even REMOTELY true!" -- H. Simpson)
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To: FITZ; marron
Q. What do you call a person who speaks three languages?

A. Trilingual

Q. What do you call a person who speaks two languages?

A. Bilingual

Q. What do you call a person who speaks only one language?

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

A. An American.

98 posted on 12/31/2003 8:21:35 AM PST by MeneMeneTekelUpharsin (Freedom is the freedom to discipline yourself so others don't have to do it for you.)
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To: Cacique
I speak it better than most natives do.

Yes, you certainly do!

I have not read the whole thread yet, but speaking Spanish is not the problem. Bilingual Americans can use their language skills to promote American principles and conservative ideas.

This is what I hope my daughter will do someday. Growing up in a Latino/gringo neighborhood, where she could not understand half the conversations going on around her, and hearing me lament that with five years of Spanish I still never became fluent, she decided to become a Spanish major at Georgetown's Faculty of Language and Linguistics, spent time in Spain, Honduras, Mexico, and the DR, and speaks like a native. I am so proud of her ability and hope she will use it for patriotic purposes one day.

99 posted on 12/31/2003 9:11:05 AM PST by firebrand (card-carrying member of the copyediting underground)
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To: Ben Chad
Take a semester and go to Madrid or some place in Mexico or South America --- just jump in and you'll learn it fast. There's something about having to ask for food and basic necessities that gets you learning. Get on a bus with not a single American to talk with and you'll find yourself chatting away with the locals.
100 posted on 12/31/2003 10:03:17 AM PST by FITZ
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