Pope John Paul II's World Day of Peace Message

fundamentalist bump.

Are you suggesting that Christ will return as a Presbyterian?

It matters not what a man would suggest that Christ will return as, but only what the Bible says His return will be like.

For the saints this will be the wonderful and Glorious return of the Lion (Revelation 5:5), who will have vengence upon all those who hated the saints and His Glorious Person (Isaiah 63, Revelation 6:10, and a host of other passages). We will see this and fear and shall laugh at those who did not make God their strength (Psalm 52). And we shall praise Him BECAUSE He has done this.

For those who hated Him He will trample them in His fury and tread them in the winepress of His wrath and their blood will stain all His garments (Isaiah 63) and their blood will spread out for one thousand six hundred furlongs (Revelation 14, Revelation 19); all for His Glorious Name.

What if God, choosing to show His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted for destruction; and this, that He might make known the riches of His glory on the vessels of mercy, whom He had prepared before unto glory, even us whom He hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?

If this is true, and it is, then unless a man repents and falls upon the Rock Christ Jesus with his whole heart and mind and body and soul, then He will perish. For all flesh will Glorify God either by delighting in Him or being destoryed by Him. And my hope is built upon nothing less than Jesus Blood and Righteousness. It is His covenant with me, paid by His blood, and established with a Down Payment of His promise to return; which was given to me by my Lord when I still hated Him. I have fallen at His feet and worshipped Him in awe and wonder because He has done this.

Luther ....The Birth Father of the Reformation always called on the psalms in times like this..

Luthers response

And my hope is built on nothing less than Jesus' Blood and Righteousness.

Nice use of this teaching from a superb old hymn.

Hey Happy New Year Mark!

Thank you, and same to you. I also got a good intellectual knowledge of the Lord, and for that I am thankful, but I agree, the personal relationship, is better than the intellectual knowledge. Later.

".... fundamentalism is an attitude radically opposed to belief in God."

There's fundamentalism and then there's fundamentalism, as Ethan North pointed out in his post on 11-17-01 HERE excerpted:

"...The Reformed scholars of the school defended historic Christian teaching against the anti-christian liberalism that was taking over much of the American church. The works they published defended the fundamentals of the faith, such as the inspiration of Scripture, the Virgin birth of Christ, the bodily Resurrection, the divinity of Christ and the substitutionary atonement of Christ. Those that held to historic Christian teaching were then labeled "fundamentalists" (it should be carefully noted that these "fundamentalists" should not be equated with or confused with the current dispensationalist fundamentalists, as they are strikingly different, whereas the so-called present-day fundamentalist is typified as being anti-intellectual, anti-historic, anti-creedal, which the great men that fought the liberals in the early 20th century were certainly not any of the above)."

Interesting to note my discussion with Judith last night has been censored by the monitors..It was polite .....it was not offensive ..it was the basis of her remarks where she accuses me of distorting her words...her posts were allowed to remain..my were pulled..so a reader might unfairly assume that I had not been polite in discourse.

I find this interesting in light of the fact I complained mightily about personal attacks and the monitor refused to censor them..but in the end pulled an entire thread to punish everyone that was enjoying the discussion..

This is not even handed and I would like all of Judith's response to me pulled if the original posts were also pulled

There is very definitely a pro Catholic..anti Protestant bias by some monitors!

"Free Republic is an online gathering place for independent, grass-roots conservatism on the web. We're working to roll back decades of governmental largesse, to root out political fraud and corruption, and to champion causes which further conservatism in America."

Free Republic

For those who hated Him He will trample them in His fury and tread them in the winepress of His wrath and their blood will stain all His garments (Isaiah 63)

Even a Unitarian hymnist, a denomination not generally regarded as strong bible students, was well aware of the wrath of the Lamb upon His return in an earlier godfearing era in America:

Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord,
He is trampling out the vintage where the grapes of wrath are stored,
He has loosed the fateful lightening of His terrible swift sword

These are, to any student of the Bible, not merely colorful phrases but are a fairly capable brief hymnal adaptation of teachings found throughout scripture in both Testaments.

How often the posts of some of those from the Roman church makes me think that when they try to describe the nature of God, they're actually describing their "invisible friend" from childhood. To know God and to love God is to fear Him and His power, something our forbears once knew from study of the Word and the ancient fathers of the church who wrote extensively on the subject. It is quite jarring to note that this concept is so utterly alien to modernists (this includes the modern camp of Rome as well). I wish I could say I was surprised. But the Bible told us that this would happen within the churches so we have no cause for complaint that God didn't warn us. More prophetic warnings fulfilled. Still, it seems inconceivable that literate people can read the Bible and so studiously ignore that which is so plainly written.

Rome has squandered whatever inheritance and authority it might ever have had in the Kingdom.

Grass roots conservatism follows the constitution..which was written by old white protestant men.

They saw God as an intergral part of any government and the right to discuss Religion openly as a right. Now JR has the right, since it is his forum ,to ban all religious discussion. But I do not believe he intends that one church or one set of beliefs be allowed to stay while another is censored. Like the Protestants that have loved FR and posted here he loves the constitution and its core values.

It is not right that Protestant speech is censored and Catholic speech not..and that is what has happen on this thread.

It is part of a general trend to bash Protestants ..the one group that still unwavers in its support of the founders..

bump to 271

It is part of a general trend to bash Protestants ..the one group that still unwavers in its support of the founders..

Lol! Bashing is in the eye of the beholder.

As is the "depends what your meaning of IS, is" defense of human lives ... as evidenced most recently by Bush's decision to fund research on already-been-killed "EXCESS" human lives.

Buttressing same, of course, with a little Scripture from his "favorite philosopher".

"Protest" is the root word of Protestant. It's precisely Protestantism that resulted in the DEISM, not Christianity, of some of our key founding fathers.

".....Protestants ..the one group that still unwavers in its support of the founders.."

"We have (at least) two competing visions about how America should be Christianized. Mine is non-statist. I want greater liberty and greater obedience, not less liberty in the attempt to politically guarantee such obedience.

This dilemma is highlighted by the critics on the Left that we are “The American Taliban.” After all, some contend, don’t we agree with most of the Taliban’s criticisms of the decadent United States? Don’t we believe in a union of church and state? Don’t we advocate an enforced Christianity, as they do an enforced Islam?

In a word, no. The Taliban are (were!) godless political tyrants bent on protecting a murderous international cartel. The fact that they opposed Buddha and adultery and miniskirts and feminism and homosexuality and rock music and porno are coincidental. They practiced a medieval morality, not a Christian morality. I’ll take America’s low morals and free institutions any day over the Taliban’s high morals and tyrannical state because (a) we can address the moral problem by a full-orbed gospel as long as we have the political freedom to preach it and (b) a high morality that must be enforced by a tyrannical state is a hypocritical, godless morality."

Excerpted from: Commentary HERE

"Free Republic is an online gathering place for independent, grass-roots conservatism on the web. We're working to roll back decades of governmental largesse, to root out political fraud and corruption, and to champion causes which further conservatism in America."

All no doubt true.

And yet, I would make the argument that FreeRepublic is primarily a forum of people who truly and deeply believe in certain principles.

Political principles. Moral principles. And religious principles.

The greatest problem the Republic faces now, as at any time in our history, is that of apathy, of drift. You can't have a constitutional republic that is composed of moderates and the apathetic any more than a republic can survive if large numbers of the electorate are uneducated.

You seem to think that these battles are constant and unproductive. To the contrary. They help each of us to define who we are and what we really believe. What we're willing to fight for, to make a stink about that just won't go away.

The same spirit that sometimes animates these discussions is, in fact, the same spirit that made FreeRepublic such an powerful influence in the impeachment of x42 and in the Battle for Floriduh.

You won't get moderates to do that. You won't get a moderate to turn out and FReep Condit's office every week, rain or shine, like JimRob and his bunch does. And there are plenty of other examples.

Whether you like it or not, these are all a very vital part of FreeRepublic and what has made it work: the never-say-die, damn-the-torpedos attitude of so many differing people. And what makes it work is the committment to traditional moral values and a constitutional republic.

It isn't perfect but human beings only seem to come in a certain number of flavors. If you want a constitutional forum that can rise and accomplish something, you need some tough bulldogs on it whose jaws stay clenched even after they're beaten to death. And if the dogs growl at each other a little bit between the major battles, then a good doghandler knows that that is just their nature.

I think JimRob knows this better than some of you moderators. Over the course of time, I think you'll see it too.

I think that in policing complaints and unruliness on religious threads, gross insults and a constant pattern of baiting is what you should watch for. We Calvinists don't complain when others come in and give us a strong argument from time to time. And our RC friends, despite their constant we're-being-persecuted refrain, generally don't have constant trouble either on their threads.

But I say it's good to mix it up now and then so you don't get complacent. It shouldn't be constant and you moderators should watch for a pattern of constant stalking and disruption. But FR won't last if it becomes a haven from free speech either. The marketplace of ideas necessary to any democratic republic is not a series of closed inpenetrable rooms from which all other thought can be excluded.

FreeRepublic needs to let there be some challenges, even tough ones. But a consistent and unrelenting pattern of attack is unproductive. Let the RCs challenge the Protestants and the Protestants challenge the RCs. As long as they mostly have some peace and quiet on their own threads, there's nothing wrong with it. It's healthy. I'll tell you flat out that people complain about the religious bickering but it is a part of what draws people here, just as freedom of religion and expression have always drawn people to our constitutional republic. That's the truth.

Let's remember the value of free speech and the marketplace of ideas.

Nice post.

We agree on the President are you surprised? And for taking that stand I have been called a "talibornagain" ,crazy,daft.an old hag..mocked and dogged on other threads..I have a folder full of slander that came to me because I am a Christian ..that puts Christ first.I will be glad to mail some of it to you if you doubt me.It is one thing to strongly disagree on a topic and stick to that topic..another to turn it into a personal assult

BTW Those old white protestant men were running from Church states .Like England..but also seen in France,Spain,Italy etc..and those were your folks:>)

Thank you for editing this thread!

I was in the middle of research where the "flames" began and documenting some of the cruel remarks (from both Catholics and Protestants) by individual posters. I was going to post this research as an example.

I see now that my intended post would only have increased the tension. Yours was the far superior solution. Thank you again!

I hope in future posts, we can have a civil discussion. As for myself, I have no problem with people quoting from the bible, so long as they tell me (in their own words) exactly why they believe the particular quote is germain to the original intent of the thread.

Have a Happy New Year!

I think JimRob knows this better than some of you moderators. Over the course of time, I think you'll see it too.

The moderators act under the explicit instructions of JimRob.

We agree on all kinds of important things. Flag me next time you take heat ... I got your back.

As for "my people", I think yours is perhaps a simplistic view of history. I'll flag you to a quiet little Catholic thread sometime where you might see a more objective and genuinely historical account.

Regards, RnMomof7.