Posted on 12/30/2001 6:14:13 PM PST by Justin Raimondo
Edited on 09/03/2002 4:49:49 AM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]
The mob arrived armed with knives and clubs while Rev. Joy Punnose addressed the 120 missionaries gathered in the small town of Dohad in northern Gujarat, an Indian state where Christians have become almost daily targets for Hindu mobs.
The kicks, punches and slaps that followed were not unusual in the northern part of this country, the so-called Hindu belt, where dozens of Christian churches went up in smoke this year, an Australian missionary and his two sons were burned alive, another priest was beaten to death, nuns have been gang-raped, congregations terrorized and priests made to walk naked through village streets.
(Excerpt) Read more at media-watch.org ...
They did this because they resent proseletyzing. No one in any of the accounts I read said that Christianity was an evil religion.
Mohammedan clerics regularly call Christians idoloters.
No one who knows anything about the Koran says this. The Koran distinguishes between "people of the book" (Jews, Christians and Muslims) from idolators. The idolators were the polytheists that Mohammed overturned when he attacked Mecca.
The BJP party has said some pretty scewering things about Christians.
About Christians perhaps--those who are trying to teach Hindu children that the Hindu Gods are really devils, but not about the religion of Christianity.
So yes, go get a source.
I'm sure some Hindu will angrily reply that I'm oversimplifying things, which is true. One can't do a religion justice in a single post. But I think any disintersted student of Hinduism wouldn't quaral too much with above assesment.
Here an article I found some time ago. Please read it, or are you "predjudiced" about the way other people think?
Wondrous Treatment Of Kafirs In Islam
To understand this cruel treatment by the muslims one has to understand why islam was originated. As Anwar Sheikh, a free thinker has said in his book, islam is nothing but a Arab National Movement. This movement was the dream of mohammed who wanted everything under his control. Islam was a convenient religious excuse for him to do this.
For this movement to be successful, mohammed had to find a way to control mindless people and justify the brutal merciless killings. Thus islam was devised and propagated by a band of dacoits.
To start with, the "great mohammed" divided the Arabian society in two tight compartments:
- Momins
- Kafirs
The word "momin" means believer in mohammed and allah. In contrast a "kafir" is a non-believer. The "momins" did not have to be better men than the "kafirs" in terms of character or consciousness. "Momins" had only to recite the "Kalima" (incantation)- "there is no god but allah and mohammed is his prophet." By doing that the 'momins' become qualified to kill as many kafirs as they could or pleased, looting and burning their belongings and enslaving their women and children in the process.
The momins were not of course risking their lives for nothing. Four-fifths of the booty and prisoners captured in war was theirs in accordance with the law laid down in the quran by the prophet himself. The prisoners included quite a number of fair and young maidens who could set any momin's mouth watering. No wonder that the infant state of islam at Medina was able to assemble very soon quite a number of dedicated swordsmen without spending a penny from its own coffers. The principle of free enterprise applied to plunder an pillage was functioning with full force.
The prophet of islam proclaimed that allah has assigned the whole world to the momins. Not a patch was to be left for the kafirs to dwell. But it seems that allah's knowledge of geography was not so good. It looks like allah's prophet mohammed had not heard of many lands beyond Syria, Iraq, Persia, Ethiopia, and Egypt. Notwithstanding this lack of geographical knowledge, the prophet divided the world in two contending spheres -"darul-Islam" (the zone of peace where the mulsims were the dominant element) and "darul-Harb" (the zone of war where the kafirs or non-muslims held sway). Anwar Sheikh says,
"The philosophy that lies behind islam is stunning and proves the consummate political skill of the prophet mohammed: by declaring all muslims as one nation and the non-muslims as another, he created the Two Nation Theory, perpetually setting muslims against non-muslims. Again, he stressed that in this struggle the muslims would be victorious."
We see this philosophy in practice in the modern times. The partition of India was based totally on this. Here Pakistan and Bangladesh are darul-Islam whereas India is darul-Harb. The recent religious wars in Bosnia were also based on this.
Anwar Sheikh further says,
"I am referring to the prophet's declaration that allah has made him the Model of Practice for his followers. It has come to mean that the muslims must copy him in everything, they must eat, drink, walk and talk like him, even must look like him, that is, they grow beard like his, have a similar hair-cut and dress like him. This is what is called followings the sunnah .i.e., the prophetic: Model which is the guarantee of salvation. One can easily say that Islam has been designed to induce respect and love for Arabia. There are express commands of the prophet, which state that a person is not Muslim until he loves him more than his own father and mother. The idea is that people must be weaned from their own nationalities and motherlands, and attached firmly to Mecca. This is the reason that the Muslims of India call their own homeland as the battlefield and Arabia the fountain of peace and celestial glory. Now, it is perhaps, easy for you to understand why the muslims of India partitioned their own motherland for practicing the Arab cultural values in Pakistan (and Bangladesh)."
To ensure the superiority of darul- Islam the prophet, mohammed took the following steps:
When Adam was evicted from paradise, he came to Mecca where he built the first house of God. Thus, he identifies Godliness with Kabba, a sanctuary of Mecca where God lives.
For the purpose of imposing Arab psychological superiority on non-Arab muslims, he decreed that they must prostrate five-times- a-day facing Mecca. This is not only an act of submission to Mecca, the capital city of Arabia, but also proves beyond a shadow of doubt that God lives in Mecca, otherwise why should people prostrate in that direction?
A muslim must not defecate himself or answer the call of nature facing Mecca. It is a blasphemous act in view of the sanctity of Mecca.
When muslims die, they must be buried facing Mecca, which is the guarantee of their salvation.
To make sure that the Arabs enjoy economic opulence, the prophet made Hajj as obligatory ritual for his followers. It is a pilgrimage to Mecca. There are countless Indian muslims who sell their homes and personal belongings to undertake this journey.
The muslims must love Arabia because the prophet did so. They must follow him as the Divine Model of Practice. This is what islam expects of muslims. If they don't, they are sure to enter hell because the prophet will not intercede on their behalf. Intercession is the special power of the prophet mohammed. He will recommend paradise for his followers on the Day of Judgment. His recommendation is final and allah cannot deny it. It is available to all murderers, rapists, arsonists, cheats, thugs, pickpockets and pimps provided they are followers of the prophet. On the contrary, all Hindus, Sikhs, Jews, Christians will be cast into a flaming hell, no matter, how pious and God-fearing they may have been. Piety has no meaning and value without believing in mohammed and the greatness of his homeland. Intercession is the climax of the prophet's National wisdom--It is this muslim belief which gives them the hope of free sex and economic abundance, and they feel obliged to kill in the name of islam. This is why they are ever ready to stab their motherland. After all, caring about one's country entails sacrifices whereas the comforts of paradise are sweet and splendid. And it is especially so when they involve no moral responsibility.
After reading the above passages you should be able to comprehend the true nature of a muslim and the reason behind the countless killings, rapes, arsons, and loots done by muslims throughout history. Now I will quote from the quran below to support what I have stated above. The chapters and verse numbers are also stated here for refernce.
Verses from the Koran:
VIII/12: When thy Lord inspired the angels (saying:) I am with you. So make those who believe stand firm. I will throw fear into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Then smite the necks and smite of them each finger.
Here one can clearly see that the quran is openly saying to the muslims to give a torturous death to those who are non-believers of the islamic faith.
XCVIII/6: Lo! those who disbelieve, among the people of the Scripture and idolaters, will abide in fire of hell. They are the worst of created beings.
From the above passage you can clearly see that according to mohammed, allah has reserved a special place for non-mulsims--HELL!
IX/5: Then when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor- due, then leave their way free. Lo! Allah is forgiving, merciful.
This verse tells us that muslims are free to convert non-muslims by force and brutality. If unsuccessful in doing so, they are free to kill.
IX/73: Oh prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites! Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end.
LXIX/30-37: (It will be said) Take him and fetter him and expose him to hell fire. And then insert him in a chain whereof the length is seventy cubits. Lo! he used not to believe in allah the tremendous, and urged not on the feeding of the wretched. Therefore hath he no lover hear this day nor any food save filth which none but sinners eat.
Here we get a description of how to punish non-muslims. This is in practice even today in islamic countries. In fact, the Sikh Gurus and their families were tortured by muslims as prescribed in the quran. For example, Sikh guru Tegh Bahadur on refusing to accept islam, was brought to the prison in a cage like he was a wild animal. Three of his disciples were murdered in front of him. One of them was Bhai Mati Das. He was sawed alive. The other was wrapped up in cotton and burnt alive. Bhai Dyala, the third one, was boiled alive. Guru Tegh Bahadur himself was brutally tortured and killed in a similar fashion. We see further support of these types of torments in the verses below.
XLIV/43-50: LO! the tree of Zaqqum (The tree that grows in the heart of hell bearing fruits like devil's heads) - the food of the sinner. Like molten brass, it seetheth in their bellies as the seething of boiling water. (And it will be said): Take him and drag him to the midst of hell, then pour upon his head the torment of boiling water. Saying: TASTE! LO! thou wast forsooth the mighty, the noble! Lo! this is that whereof ye used to doubt.
IX/123: O ye who believe! Fight those of the disbelievers who are near to you and let them find harshness in you and know that allah is with those who keep their duty (unto Him).
IV/144: O Ye who believe! choose not disbelievers for your friends in place of believers. Would you give Allah a clear warrant against you?
This verse clarifies the fact that a true muslim can never be a friend of a person of another faith. People who believe otherwise are under delusion.
IX/29: Fight those who do not profess the true faith (islam) till they pay the jiziya (poll tax) with the hand of humility.
This verse in quran gave birth to the law that all non muslims living in an islamic state have to pay the jiziya or poll tax for the privilege of being there. These people are called zimmis and are allowed to live and work in the islamic lands under the following 20 disabilities: (one has to wonder if apartheid was derived from this)
They are not to build any new places of worship.
They are not to repair any old places of worship which have been destroyed by the muslims.
They are not to prevent muslim travellers from staying in their places of worship.
They are to entertain for 3 days any muslim who wants to stay in their homes and for a longer period if the muslim falls ill.
They are not to harbor any hostility or give aid and comfort to hostile elements.
They are not to prevent any one of them from getting converted to islam.
They have to show respect to every muslim.
They have to allow muslims to participate in their private meetings.
They are not to dress like muslims.
They are not to name themselves with muslim names.
They are not to ride on horses with saddle and bridle.
They are not to possess arms.
They are not to wear signet or seals on their fingers.
They are not to sell or drink liquor openly
They are to wear a distinctive dress which shows their inferior status and separates them from muslims.
They are not to propagate their custom and usages among the muslims.
They are not to build their houses in the neighbourhood of muslims.
They are not to bring their dead near the graveyards of the muslims.
They are not to observe their religious practices publicly or mourn their dead loudly.
They are not to buy muslim slaves.
Here again I have stated another handful of facts which expose the true nature of islam. Any logical person by now should have realized that Islam is meant for the lowest of the low. The followers of islam are mindless tyrannical demons who know nothing better than killing and torturing people in the name of allah. And they do this because a pervert named mohammed, among other things, promised his followers 72 houris (beautiful virgin women) and virility of 100 men in 'jannat' (heaven). This is very puzzling--why virility of 100 men and only 72 houris? Why not 100 houris? The answer is very simple--the prophet mohammed promises these "pious" muslims that they will also be given 28 young boys in addition to the 72 houris for their sexual pleasure.
NOTE: The works of A. Ghosh and Anwar Sheikh have been used in this article.
{end}
Mohammed spread islam with killing. And what do I need to tell you about Jezus Christ (I do not believe you are a muslim)? Jezus Christ spread Christianity with his words and good deeds. His words are of tolerance, even towards Judas, who betraid him, and the Romans. For believing in Christ the people were killed by the Romans, but by showing that they did not fear death and kept their fate, the Romans themselves turned into Christians.
You need to know that apostasy in islam is the biggest crime, punishable by death. Muhammad was a fundamentalist himself therefore fundamentalism cannot be separated from true islam. Islam, which means submission, demands from its followers to submit their wills and thoughts to muhammad and his allah, a deity that despises reason, democracy, freedom of thought and freedom of expression.
This clearly shows that islam is the complete opposite of the USA! Why?
Here's a quote from a speech of Ronald Reagan (yes, the president who bombed the islam republic of Libia to stop it from exporting terrorism) that summs up what the USA us about:
Almost two centuries ago a group of disturbed men met in the small Pennsylvania State House. They gathered to decide on a course of action. Behind the locked and guarded doors they debated for hours whether or not to sign the Declaration which had been presented for their consideration. For hours the talk was treason and its price the headsman's axe, the gallows and noose. The talk went on and decision was not forthcoming.
Then, Jefferson writes, a voice was heard coming from the balcony:
They may stretch our necks on all the gibbets in the land. They may turn every tree into a gallows, every home into a grave, and yet the words of that parchment can never die. They may pour our blood on a thousand scaffolds and yet from every drop that dyes the axe a new champion of freedom will spring into birth. The words of this declaration will live long after our bones are dust.
To the mechanic in his workshop they will speak hope; to the slave in the mines, freedom; but to the coward rulers, these words will speak in tones of warning they cannot help but hear. Sign that parchment. Sign if the next moment the noose is around your neck. Sign if the next minute this hall rings with the clash of falling axes! Sign by all your hopes in life or death, not only for yourselves but for all ages, for that parchment will be the textbook of freedom the bible of the rights of man forever.
Were my soul trembling on the verge of eternity, my hand freezing in death, I would still implore you to remember this truth: God has given America to be free.
As he finished, the speaker sank back in his seat exhausted. Inspired by his eloquence the delegates rushed forward to sign the Declaration of Independence. When they turned to thank the speaker for his timely words he couldn't be found and to this day no one knows who he was or how he entered or left the guarded room.
{end}
Our flag still stands for freedom! Americans fought and died to make other people free. The last stand at the Alamo, where men died so others could be free. The figthing in Normandy in '44 and the liberation of my country during Operation Market-Garden. Many good men died here to make other people free. Their blooddrops poured on the ground and from that I sprang into birth, to also be free and to defend freedom! Kennedy once said: Freedom is indivisible, and when one man is enslaved, all are not free... And to put it in his words, as a free Dutchman: All free men, wherever they may live, are citizens of America, and, therefore, as a free man, I take pride in the words "I am an American."
"You shall know the truth and the truth shall make you free" John 8:32
Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord:
He is trampling out the vintage where the grapes of wrath are stored;:
He hath loosed the fateful lightning of His terrible swift sword::
His truth is marching on.
I have seen Him in the watch-fires of a hundred circling camps,:
They have builded Him an altar in the evening dews and damps;:
I can read His righteous sentence by the dim and flaring lamps::
His day is marching on.
I have read a fiery gospel writ in burnished rows of steel::
"As ye deal with my contemners, so with you my grace shall deal;:
Let the Hero, born of woman, crush the serpent with his heel,:
Since God is marching on."
He has sounded forth the trumpet that shall never call retreat;:
He is sifting out the hearts of men before His judgment-seat::
Oh, be swift, my soul, to answer Him! be jubilant, my feet!:
Our God is marching on.
In the beauty of the lilies Christ was born across the sea,:
With a glory in his bosom that transfigures you and me::
As he died to make men holy, let us die to make men free,:
While God is marching on.
Thanks to Knighthawk, from whom I have reposted this excellent material, not that dufus (codeword) will read or consider it.
Although this wasn't addressed to me, I'll try to say a little about it. The Vedas are the ancient sacred scriptures of the Hindu religion, dating from about 1500 BC.
The earliest ones contain creation myths and prescriptions for rituals and religious law. The last ones, called the Upanishads, are the most interesting and philosophical. It is here where the concept of Brahman or the ultimate reality is developed. Brahman, or God, is identified with truth, consciousness and bliss, and is the unchanging reality behind the veil of illusion generated by sense experience.
Through various kinds of yoga (means "union" in sanscrit) one can come to realize that Brahman is one's true self. Which is why people in India say hello and goodbye to you by folding their hands as if in prayer and saying, "Namaskar" or Namaste," which means "I salute the divinity within you."
That's what the flight attendants say on Indian Airlines instead of "Bubbye"!
You posted a whole lot of stuff. I doubt that you have read it yourself. You just wanted to spam us with it. But I don't see anything in there that says that Christianity is an evil religion.
The passage that comes the closest is /5: when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor- due, then leave their way free. Lo! Allah is forgiving, merciful.
According to you, or rather the writer you borrowed this from, "this verse tells us that muslims are free to convert non-muslims by force and brutality. If unsuccessful in doing so, they are free to kill."
Actually, "idolators" refers to the pre-muslim Arabs, who were polytheists and worshipped stone idols. Muhammed was very intolerant of these people, which is not to his credit. He was also intolerant of "people of the scripture who are disbelievers" as it says in an earlier passage. But this does not refer to Christians, either. It refers people of the book (Jews, Christians and Moslems) who choose not to believe.
You didn't "oversimplify" them. You massacred them.
NEW DELHI (APP)-India's ruling BJP may insist that Hindu zealots have no anti-Christian agenda, but their foot soldiers in Uttar Pradesh state make no bones about their intention to drive away Christians, "The Times of India" (TTI) reported Friday.
Bajrang Dal, a Hindu zealot group, said,"Christians were now bigger enemies than Muslims."
Dharmendra Sharma, the Bajrang Dal's leader,"declared that his organisation was ready to fight wherever church institutions were active," according to the report. "We are prepared to use violence. There is no limit," the paper quoted him as saying.
... Chaudhary said,"the Christians want to take over the country. What is the point of us targeting one or two? Our aim is to drive them all away."
"The day we start chasing them away, they won't be able to save themselves. Even the administration won't be able to help them." Sharma, on his part, freely recounted incidents where he and his associates have attacked Christian preachers around Agra for trying to convert Dalits...
The link for the full story is here: http://www.holocaustinkashmir.50megs.com/ka04005.html
The above clearly shows that Hindu Fundamentalists view Christian proselytizing as evil. Since Christianity commands its believers to proselytize, believing that Christian proselytizing is evil is the same thing as beliving Christianity is evil.
I am shocked at how many people consider the BJP's view on proselytization as reasonable. Christian proselytization is not coercive. All Christians do is speak a message; they don't force anyone to listen, and they don't force anyone to accept it. That Hindus object so strongly shows how insecure they are in their own (false) beliefs.
The Koran preaches in several places that the Christian doctrine of the incarnation is evil. Another Freeper has already posted this.
Answer me this: if Mohammedans don't view Christianity as evil, why is conversion to Christianity a capital offense in Saudi Arabia, Jordan, and numerous other Mohammedan countries?
Your response regarding the Jewish burning of the New Testament is laughable. People don't burn books unless they think of them evil.
Jews? Plural? You take an isolated case and you make it seem like its an official Jewish policy.
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