BREAKING: Bush Grants Permanent Trade Status to China

ABCnews ^

[hawaiian]

I'll post more info as I get it...

[Jhoffa_]

Well ain't that a kick in the pants.

Yes, and here's a bigger one.. It's a good thing.

Regardless of what you were taught in school, we do not live in a democracy and furthermore we do not wish to do so.

It seems unfair at first, and very Anti-American... till you think about what a pure democracy is.

A "pure" "perfect" democracy is Mob Rule.

The Representative Republic form of Government that we have now makes (or should make) our leaders accountable without being subject to the ever changing whims of our popular culture.

In a perfect democracy.. we would all vote on the bills before Congress and the Media scare machine would turn Americas stupid against us with fearmongering and lies to a much greater degree than they do now.

As it is, if a Congressman or a President wants to make a decidedly unpopular decision he is free to do so once in office.. And knowing that he will eventually have to answer for it at the polls.

[Askel5]

Another oldie but goodie: Red China and Dick Cheney

[Jhoffa_]

PS: HERE is a Link that deals (in part) with the problems associated with a "pure" Democracy. I just skimmed it, but it appears to go into much greater detail and does a better job of explaining the differences that I did in the above post.

(The Example of the Wolves is a good one, IMO)

"...democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths." ~James Madison

regards..

[zog]

--yes and no I worry some. I've relocated to where they would first have to get through 100 miles of whizzed off rural rednecks on their own turf. If they make it this far, then they get to meet ME.

[zog]

--thankyou,. I appreciate your writings as well.

The internet is helping to get people informed past the historical shamestream media. This is helping immeasurably, but it's a two edged sword. TPTB know this littkle fact as well, and they are seeking to fully control and adjust reality back to their favor. When they see this isn't possible, I fully expect them to pulloff MORE reichstagg styled events (or allow them to happen like I suspect the 9-11 attacks were allowed) to finish off the crackdown and armed stealth coup they are in the middle of.

[plain talk]

I do not expect Bush to figure that out. He is too much into business lala land while crooked and enemy advisors tell him to pick employees into radical activist pools such as the gay, environment, and other liberal/communist muslim agendas.

Crooked and enemy advisors? Come on. Now you are showing your true colors. You sound like another smarmy paranoid kook to me.

[middie]

Your concern about "child labor" abuse in relation to China may be well placed. But to be consistent, one might expect that you, and those who agree with you on the same basis, also object to dozens of American companies that have factory operations on Pacific American territories and protectorates.

In at least one class action pending in the U.S. Ninth Circuit Court region there has been developed extensive evidence of American companies exploiting child and indentured labor in their manufacturing and assembling plants in the far Pacific islands that are either U.S. territories or in a protectorate status. The companies to which I refer are those we see everyday in mass merchandising stores all around the country and who boast about low retail prices. They use labor contractors to import "guest" workers, pay them less than slave wages and house them in abject squalor.

The point being, if we are to be critical of internal Chinese labor practices---and it is certainly appropriate to do so, we should similarly do the same with respect to those American companies who, in taking advanatage of being able to sew a "Made in the U.S.A." label into a pair of jeans, also engage in the same wrongful practices. Perhaps the difference is that the American companies have been successful at keeping their practices quiet and the American public elects to look the other way because of the misleading label we see in the stores.

[PatrioticAmerican]

"also object to dozens of American companies that have factory operations on Pacific American territories and protectorates."

Yes, I do. America has given its production capabilities to children around the world.

[tgiles]

That doesn't sound right to me, although I could understand a healthy mistrust of the gubmint.

In a bad-case scenario, let's say that Swedes decide they hate America, start infiltrating, and suicide-bomb the shit out of all Ikeas and Waffle Houses. By the time all Ikeas and Waffle Houses are toasted, the Swedes are ready to move on to new targets, and we realize that we need to start fighting back.

If the bombing starts having a permanent impact on our economy and way of life, and killing thousands of Americans a week, and is getting worse not better, do you really think we shouldn't consider bringing in Swedes and holding them for questioning over extended periods of time without evidence? Do you really think the first trial of a Swede terrorist should take place in the public court system where security is poor and we are likely to lose valuable intelligence secrets to the enemy in the process of conviction?

I can't imagine you've thought this through completely if you've arrived at the conclusion you seem to have arrived at. Would you really allow a nation to be destroyed in order to preserve its liberties? And do you REALLY think this is a PERMANENT war on terrorism, especially considering that it's about three months old now?

[Mat_Helm]

I actualy agree with some of what you say and do not like trading with the enemy. But in the long run I trust GW's judgment in that for the long haul if more Chinese get a taste of capatilism it will eventauly wake up this dragon and it will kick out the communist rulers. If not than the only answer is an eventaul war and destruction. Yes, China has so many people in numbers that they are a tremendous market waiting to burst open with unlimited possiblities. Imagine 1 billion people all wanting to have a cell phone! That is a lot of phones. Presently one person out of 4 in CHina has never made a phone call of any type.

[Uncle Bill]

US told to make China its No 1 enemy - "The president was complimentary, he appreciated the policy discussion, and gave the indication that the topics were indeed what he had in mind,"

[Hemlock]

So much for American jobs, child & prisoner labor laws, and political relations.

Well, one useful purpose is served -- the exportation of the inflation inherent in an economy based upon fiat money.

[Hemlock]

I fully expect them to pulloff MORE reichstagg styled events (or allow them to happen like I suspect the 9-11 attacks were allowed) to finish off the crackdown and armed stealth coup they are in the middle of.

Hey, ya Jew-hatin' bastid, the Establishment didn't allow the 9-11 attack. They wouldn't sacrifice such valuable assets, nor would they need to, to pull off what you claim. You call yourself "zog," meaning "Zionist Occupied Government," which is an idea based upon a body poorly researched literature which only serves to obscure the true relationship between the Power Elite and the continuing erosion of our constitutional rights.

[Hemlock]

I fully expect them to pulloff MORE reichstagg styled events (or allow them to happen like I suspect the 9-11 attacks were allowed) to finish off the crackdown and armed stealth coup they are in the middle of.

Hey, ya Jew-hatin' bastid, the Establishment didn't allow the 9-11 attack. They wouldn't sacrifice such valuable assets, nor would they need to, to pull off what you claim. You call yourself "zog," meaning "Zionist Occupied Government," which is an idea based upon a body of poorly researched literature which only serves to obscure the true relationship between the Power Elite and the continuing erosion of our constitutional rights.

[Uncle Bill]

"Former officials of the Bush and Reagan Administrations say that, in retrospect, the Government was remarkably lax about lab security in the 1980's, even during the Reagan Administration's arms buildup. "‘It is quite clear now that things were far too casual,’ James R. Lilley, the Ambassador to China from 1989 to 1991 and then a senior Defense Department official, said in an interview today. Mr. Lilley, who for years served as one of the Central Intelligence Agency's top operatives in Asia, including in China, said: ‘This has been going on for a long, long time. We had Ministry of State [Security] defectors and other Chinese who became agents, and they made it clear that this was a top priority of their industrial and intelligence apparatus.’"
"COX COMMITTEE TAKES A DIVE ON U.S. BUSINESS'S TREASONOUS BETRAYAL OF U.S. NATIONAL SECURITY INTERESTS TO PROFIT FROM TRADE WITH RED CHINA

You'll have to ask Congressman Chris Cox (R-Calif.), Chairman of the House of Representatives China Commission, why no one is being held accountable for the turnover of American defense assets and military secrets to the People's Liberation Army of Communist China.

Perhaps it's because both the Bush and Clinton administrations each are guilty of facilitating such transfers.

Perhaps it's because both Republicans and Democrats have benefited from campaign contributions by U.S. corporations doing business with Red China.

Perhaps there's some other reason about which it would possibly be unfair to speculate.

"TUT-TUT" FOR TREASON ISN'T ENOUGH

But the reality is that Mr. Cox and his colleagues have issued a largely irrelevant "tut-tut", when, in fact, a few treason trials would seem to be more appropriate.

---

Engaging Red China
"Whatever the price of the Chinese Revolution, it has obviously succeeded not only in producing more efficient and dedicated administration, but also in fostering high morale and community of purpose.... The social experiment in China under Chairman Mao's leadership is one of the most important and successful in human history."
David Rockefeller, 1973

[Askel5]

BTTT ... of the thread:

---

To: OKCSubmariner; Askel5

"Former officials of the Bush and Reagan Administrations say that, in retrospect, the Government was remarkably lax about lab security in the 1980's, even during the Reagan Administration's arms buildup. "‘It is quite clear now that things were far too casual,’ James R. Lilley, the Ambassador to China from 1989 to 1991 and then a senior Defense Department official, said in an interview today. Mr. Lilley, who for years served as one of the Central Intelligence Agency's top operatives in Asia, including in China, said: ‘This has been going on for a long, long time. We had Ministry of State [Security] defectors and other Chinese who became agents, and they made it clear that this was a top priority of their industrial and intelligence apparatus.’"
"COX COMMITTEE TAKES A DIVE ON U.S. BUSINESS'S TREASONOUS BETRAYAL OF U.S. NATIONAL SECURITY INTERESTS TO PROFIT FROM TRADE WITH RED CHINA

You'll have to ask Congressman Chris Cox (R-Calif.), Chairman of the House of Representatives China Commission, why no one is being held accountable for the turnover of American defense assets and military secrets to the People's Liberation Army of Communist China.

Perhaps it's because both the Bush and Clinton administrations each are guilty of facilitating such transfers.

Perhaps it's because both Republicans and Democrats have benefited from campaign contributions by U.S. corporations doing business with Red China.

Perhaps there's some other reason about which it would possibly be unfair to speculate.

"TUT-TUT" FOR TREASON ISN'T ENOUGH

But the reality is that Mr. Cox and his colleagues have issued a largely irrelevant "tut-tut", when, in fact, a few treason trials would seem to be more appropriate.

---

Engaging Red China
"Whatever the price of the Chinese Revolution, it has obviously succeeded not only in producing more efficient and dedicated administration, but also in fostering high morale and community of purpose.... The social experiment in China under Chairman Mao's leadership is one of the most important and successful in human history."
David Rockefeller, 1973