Curious About Freeper's Views Of Joyce Meyer

Any nation that upholds Christ is a nation where women are treated with more equality with men. It is because of Christ's influence on that nation's laws and the people who love Him.

Yeppers. All we have to do to see proof of that.. is to look at the Arab countries, China, South America, etc.

#556, Re Christ in Hell, see #112.

I believe that this is one of the most "popular" subjects of debate in the Bible. While no one save the Lord knows for sure, I would say that Christ may have very well gone into hell as 1 Peter 3:20 goes onto say that the spiritis He ministered to were those of the disobedient in the days of Noah. Hell is often defined as the grave or the pit. Depends on what word grave, prison, and hell is translated from. In Ephesians4:8-9 We see that Jesus led captivity captive and that He descended into the lower parts of the earth.

That is my understanding of that passage as well I was going to post it but could not give the description. Christ didn't enter hell to be punished I think this is what some assume is being taugh. He entered to minister to those of before his birth so they could not be found blameless.

Remember it's written every knee shall bow every tonge confess "Christ is Lord". That pretty much means you would have to either see him or hear his message to know him, except him, or reject him. Christ conqured Death ,hell, and the grave. It is finished meant just that. The Lamb of the sacrifice had been excepted. Christ withstood one last tempataion or test that he had not ever experienced or known.

He was cut off from GOD in his time on the cross. All his life he felt the Fathers presence. He knew it as a child he knew it up till those words "My GOD why has thou foresaken me" GOD turned away because of the sin Christ bore which was ours not his.

So often we hear the Lamb of GOD mentioned. In a very true since his life on this earth followed that of the customary lamb to be offered at the passover feast. The people had to know the lamb it was bought way before the slaughter. It dwelled among them. At a precise given time the lamb was slaughtered and offered as the sacrifice of atonement for the sins of the family the father or head of the house laid his hand upon the lamb and it was slaughtered.

The teaching that Christ went into hell is about along the lines of what happens to those even up to parts of 1900 who never heard the Gospel preached nor for that matter the Word of GOD in any form. My belief is they are unknowing children. You become condemned when you know sin as sin and do not seek forgivness and repent. Usually sometime in adolesants some before then.

Some persons and many preachers can't make their messages clear what is meant or thought in their mind is not how it comes out of their mouth or even in text. We've all done it in one form or another.

Bump for later...

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Actually Joyce Meyers teaches submission. She openly admits having had a problem getting there. Honesty is better than a lie. Testimony is often that of overcoming through GOD our weaknesses. I'll take it one step further Hagee teaches the wife is to be submissive to the husband as does his wife teach the same thing I heard those sermons. Her's though I think was actually done {recorded} in his study I think. My memory is failable. I've seen what can happen when that gets twisted just as I have the words Children obey your parents. Now if I am walking in the way I have a spiritual responsibility to be the spiritual leader or priest if you will of my home. My families spiritual well being is my responsibility.

That however does not give me permission to be a tyrant. I've had to undo the damage caused by some who used GOD's word for means outside it's intention. The damage was devistating. My say in the house in all matters is the final word. I will not make major decessions though without asking my wifes input. She's not stupid and I value her opinion and wishes. If I see danger I speak out. But that is an extreme rare event for us. As well we are one in the eyes of GOD. Being one you are united GOD, Man, Woman, united. A three cord string is not easilly broken if it remains as three. Look at a rope it is entwined cords not a single strand alone.

Christ himself was ministered to by a woman. A short exchange but she proved her faith and her daughter spared from death. The diciples were actually the ones wanting to turn her away. I think he let them speak as much to show the lesson.

As for preaching that many will be saved in the last days? Many will hear the Gospel an outpouring of Holy Spirit in the final days will bring the Gospel to all nations. I also think our technology boom fullfills Daniels prophecy in that matter. It doesn't mean all will listen and except it. It means many will be saved who do. But it will also be as in the days of Noah as well. Wickedness will abound hearts will turn cold. Confusing? No. The wheat is to grow with the tares or thorns till the harvest both will grow together till the time of the harvest. As a thief in the night so comes Christ return. I'm pretrib myself and was taught it not from any mentioned here but as a Baptist.

The Hebrew customs match prophecy. Think about it. These are secrets hidden till the end times. You take a person from lets say 1950. The prophecies can be read but mysteries abound. Jerusalem ? All nations eyes seeing her at once what is this? 1940? Israel in one day reborn as a nation and prospering? It was a waste land. Prophecies are hidden till it is time for them to be revealed. Many I would say most are not understood as such till they come to pass. Not till the past few decades have we had the abilities to even properly translate the origional text to the actual origional local variations of laungauges.

Prophecy intrest me somewhat but is not the focal point of my study or reading when I can. I can appreciate it more having the customs explained but it still does not take away from it. Anyone who says Christ is coming tomorrow at noon is either a heritic or has a mental problem. I can see from what goes on around me it's close. Simple logic tells me that except for devine intervention we would not be here now. We do not possess the wisdom needed to take it much further. We are at the tower of Babel in our technology once again minus any wisdom to use it wisely.

Wormwood is used in The Revelation. That description is now a very real possibility. A nuclear exchange would be seen as a star and yes would do the carnage described. I'm not proclaming to understand that book. But I can see it's reality. But I find comfort in it as well. Chapter 4 verse 4 the 24 elders are seated, crowned, and clothed in white before the judgements of earth take place. My understanding is judgement to them has taken place. Meaning the church is home with Christ. The dispensation of Grace is at that point over. When Christ returns people will still be having weddings it is mentiones a normal time. The Great Tribulation hardly seems a festive event. This passage explains it well.

1 Corinthians 15:50

50 What I am saying, dear brothers and sisters, is that flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God. These perishable bodies of ours are not able to live forever.

51 But let me tell you a wonderful secret God has revealed to us. Not all of us will die, but we will all be transformed.

52 It will happen in a moment, in the blinking of an eye, when the last trumpet is blown. For when the trumpet sounds, the Christians who have died£ will be raised with transformed bodies. And then we who are living will be transformed so that we will never die. 53 For our perishable earthly bodies must be transformed into heavenly bodies that will never die.

Ok they key to understand this teaching is the tradition of the Hebrew wedding it is very important. The first Trumpet was the announcement of Christ to be born. A betrothment announced by GOD the father. The father of the groom announced the wedding as well only the father of the groom could tell the son when he had prepared a place suitable to him so he would tell the son to bring home his bride for the wedding. No one knew when he would announce this. That announcement was by a blast of the trumpet. The last trumpet as it is called. This passage with 24 elders seated, crowned, and robed, in Revelation 4 show the wedding feast has begun. The bride groom indeed came and took her home. The earth those who rejected it will realize it when it's too late.

No, no one can set that hour, day, or year not even decade. But you can after that event has taken place and Israel signs the deal of 7 years with the Anti-Christ know to the day when Christ returns to earth.

I can understand the various tribulation views and respect them all. They are not the key to salvation. I can as well be wrong in my reading of it. If so I must still keep faith GOD will deliver me. Guess I got a long ways from women teaching in the church huh? :>} I would not have had even the ability to grasp this much scripture had I not listened to many different persons teachings and decided through prayer and faith which reading I hold to be true. What I am wrong in GOD's Grace will see me through it. Sorry for the grammar and structure errors. This post took a lot for me to do it. It's too much for me to proof read and correct.

personally I don't believe in women preaching. period.

amen sister.

Want to hear the Charismatic's critized? Listen to some of Hagees sermons. He as well will do the same to other churches on specific points of scripture. I find it difficult at best to classssify either Hagee or Meyer as being absolute Charismatic's. Good grief even a Baptist church can experience the spiritual gifts. He was raised in the Pentecostal Church. As well his association with ORU isn't something I would want to admit to :>} but then again I haven't heard him say send me money or GOD will call me home either.

If a person is Pentecostal and can hold to the teachings which I personally find too demanding more power to them. I've seen many in it though have problems feeling they fall short of what they are to be.

As well some other churches even choose to take up snakes in an act of faith. A man named Wendy Bagwell put that one into it's proper perspective. The story "Here comes the Rattlesnakes" is one I think any Christian could enjoy and relate to. His last word to a church memeber where he was preforming went something like this. Brother Wendy now do you mean to tell me that if the Lord told you to pick up the serpant you wouldn't. Wendy replied: Yes Mam I surely would but he didn't and I ain't. A good meaasge in a humorous way. I think the practice is very misguided. I live in the part of the country where it occurs. Are they going to hell for doing it? I honestly don't think so but I will say I believe they will die if they keep it up long. Especially if bitten and deny medical help. Now to me this is an extreme of Christianity. It's based soley on the last chapter of Mark of which many question. I think the verse is real but context misplaced. This was addressed to the 11 disciples the way I read it. In short it is a second confirmation or witness of The Great Commission.

I believe spiritual gifts are given but not a requirement or even proof of ones salvation. It's too easy to duplicate many of them and decieve others. Yes I think persons can speak in tounges. Those who need it may recieve it. I don't need it to redeem my soul. Nor have I done it to the best of what I remember. It's not the center of my faith. As well some gifts may be so simple they go unnoticed even by the person having them.

He was raised in the Pentecostal Church. As well his association with ORU isn't something I would want to admit to :>}

Not to be taken as a critization of the Pentecostal church. Just a poor sentence due to a change in thought mid way through.

My reading of the Scriptures is that women should not be ordained as ministers or pastors in a Church, unless there are no men to do so. Our country certainly doesn't have that problem. My reading of the Scriptures does not preclude women from otherwise fully participating in public worship, leading song, leading in prayer, leading in scripture reading. The scriptures most definitely allow women being teachers of the gospel to other women, to children, and also participating fully in home bible study groups (where women held church in their own homes during Paul's time) where they may freely state, to men, what the passages are telling them. Some of the scriptures which give women this freedom have already been posted. There are many more that could be posted, in both the Old and New Testatments, examples of where God either used women as prophets, or where Jesus and Paul, for example, have explicity encouraged women to continue their ministries. Viva, you continue to take Scripture out of context, and nothing further can be posted which will change what you have decided is right. May the Holy Spirit enlighten your mind rather than the doctrine of man which you follow.

Then there'd be no Christian church.

Re#573. Well stated.

I prefer to follow Jesus' example more than that of Pual. Paul was a great teacher, don't get me wrong. Jesus "suffered" women to minister. Paul did not. Notice Paul says "I suffer not a woman to teach. Paul was, as he himself admitted, with faults and was subject to err. Jesus was not. If the Holy Spirit is giving a message through a woman that is His perrogative. There are many instances in the bible where women were used mightily of God. Some in big ways and some in minor ways, but nevertheless USED of God to a level of importance worth reporting or in such a way that the outcome was worthy of being an example.

I love the worship song which says, "I ain't gonna let no rock cry out in my place". Again, I agree that we must obey scripture but we MUST have an understanding of the times and circumstances in which those scriptures were written. Gives a new understanding to the scripture in which God says that His people are destroyed for lack of KNOWLEDGE.

I dare ask if any of these women on this forum ever went to services while they were menstruating. Sounds obscene? Maybe, but the LAW says that a woman is unclean during this time. Did these women set themselves apart from their families for seven days as the LAW requires.If not, they were ignoring scripture and in sin. Did their husbands touch anything they touched during that time? If so, their husbands were unclean as well and required to be apart from their families and others for seven days. If you are "obeying" one part of the law you'd better be obeying ALL of it or you are no more than a hypocrite. I persoanlly thank God for sending His son and providing me the grace which frees me from the bondage of legalism.

We can be literalists and have a complete lack of understanding. If one so chooses then that is their perrogative. I choose to seek out the wholeness of scripture, including the original texts and studies of the customs of the people to whom they were written. If you wanna stay in Egypt murmuring and complaining then fine.

I choose to live in the freedom from the curse of the law as Jesus provided for me. And as Michael the Archangel wouldn't criticize Lucifer ( again, a case of recognizing the annointing that had once been upon him ) and would only rebuke him, so I choose NOT to insult another as I may be touching God's annointed which would not be profitable for me.

You can find websites all day long to insult or compliment any doctrine. Understanding the scriptures and seeking the wisdom ( as required of us according to scripture ) through the instruction of the Holy Spirit is the key to discernment. Not another man's interpretation or criticism of doctrine.

I've watched her sermons occasionally--she's good, but frankly, she really comes off like a masculine tough broad in her mannerisms. However, considering the horror of "Jan" (lady with the pink hair) on "Praise the Lord," Joyce Meyer is at least a normal person!!!!

Joyce Meyer reminds me of my Texas sister-in-law who is 5'11" and an ex-cop. LOL, don't mess with her, baby!!!!

I agree. She comes across as a no non-sense type of gal. Today she said it was good to have "A BALANCED" love for the Lord. LOL, kinda of a slap at those who take things to far. I like the fact that she is parctical.

I like cowgirls.