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School Bus Driver's Prayers Run Into Church-State Flap
Charisma News ^
| 12/13/01
| Andy Butcher
Posted on 12/13/2001 12:51:16 PM PST by marshmallow
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Religious persecution, pure and simple.
To: marshmallow
Surely the driver will get muzzled in this one (sadly). What the kids should do is start a group recitation themselves.
To: marshmallow
If each child who participates in the prayer has the express consent and support of his or her parents, why is any of this the Reverend Lynn's business?
3
posted on
12/13/2001 1:09:24 PM PST
by
Mr. Lucky
To: Mr. Lucky
Because he wants to ban all prayer from all schools?
To: marshmallow
"A Maryland school bus driver fears that she could lose her job because of onboard prayers by her young passengers." That first sentence gave me the impression that the kids were praying on their own and some despotic administrator wanted to fire the bus driver. When I think of all the things I've seen and heard on school buses, I couldn't figure out what the big deal was if kids were praying. But my guess is that what got her into trouble was _leading_ the prayer.
To: marshmallow
If the bus driver tells the students that the must become Baptists, Jewish, Methodists, Episcopalian, Catholic, etc. that would violate the 1st Amendment. But saying non-sectarian prayers, even to the Christian God of our founding fathers, does nothing to violate it.
6
posted on
12/13/2001 1:17:25 PM PST
by
4CJ
To: marshmallow
But Barry Lynn, executive director of Americans United for Separation of Church and State Yep. And nobody hates Christianity more than the "Reverend" Lynn, too. This guy is a real jerkoff (pardon my french - hope the moderators don't get too upset! :) who will stop at nothing until America becomes a totally secular entity, devoid of ANY public expression of the Christian faith.
Multiculturalism is not about being "inclusive" of all religions.
It is about being "exclusive" of Christianity.
:) ttt
7
posted on
12/13/2001 1:19:51 PM PST
by
detsaoT
To: ConsistentLibertarian
But this guy isn't just saying that. Note that she stopped leading them and they decided to continue on their own.
When Tsourakis was told last month by school transportation officials she had to stop leading the daily invocation or risk losing her job, she complied. But pupils from Shiloh Middle School decided they wanted to keep praying themselves -- and students at North Carroll High School decided to join in, too.
His words of "poisoned" are the real problem to me. That shows his real agenda.
8
posted on
12/13/2001 1:20:24 PM PST
by
TXBubba
To: detsaoT
People who want to limit sexual expression in public places aren't necessarily anti-sex.
To: ConsistentLibertarian
People who want to limit sexual expression in public places aren't necessarily anti-sex. Hate to say it, bud, but Barry Lynn, no matter what the hell he CALLS himself, has proven himself to be rediculously anti-Religious. Look at his track record, if you don't believe me.
(And "Religion in public life" does not cleanly relate to "Sex in public life". Can you guess which one is a health risk, and which one is just irrational sensitivity?)
;) ttt (Unrepentant_r_epublican)
10
posted on
12/13/2001 1:26:33 PM PST
by
detsaoT
To: detsaoT
Multiculturalism is not about being "inclusive" of all religions. It is about being "exclusive" of Christianity.
How right you are. Walk into almost any school today and witness the Ramadan, Hannukah, and Kwanzaa displays. What? You didn't see a creche?
11
posted on
12/13/2001 1:27:36 PM PST
by
Ligeia
To: ConsistentLibertarian
People who want to limit sexual expression in public places aren't necessarily anti-sex.These kids have an absolute right to pray. The bus driver is not leading them. The school has no right to tell them to stop, or to harrass this bus driver.
12
posted on
12/13/2001 1:28:13 PM PST
by
Maceman
To: ConsistentLibertarian
I don't intend this personally, but your quip illustrates why libertarians aren't considered a particularly serious political movement.
To: Mr. Lucky
...libertarians aren't considered a particularly serious political movement. While I generally agree with your observation, I feel compelled to warn you that the wrath of every self-described libertarian will be upon you before you know what hitcha.
Good luck fielding the responses, though.
:) ttt
14
posted on
12/13/2001 1:53:34 PM PST
by
detsaoT
To: marshmallow
Had the driver stopped her bus while it was pointing towards Mecca and had she thrown down some prayer rugs, she would have been commended for her cultural sensitivity.
To: marshmallow
But pupils from Shiloh Middle School decided they wanted to keep praying themselves -- and students at North Carroll High School decided to join in, too. Now when the bus stops in front of the school, the doors are opened so that anyone who wants to can leave, while the rest wait a moment and recite the Lord's prayer, the "Sun" said.
How can the driver be responsible for this?
16
posted on
12/13/2001 2:25:20 PM PST
by
SGCOS
To: ConsistentLibertarian
"People who want to limit sexual expression in public places aren't necessarily anti-sex.
The worst attempt at moral equivalence ever. bravo.
To: All
And how long will the unconstitutional myth of "separation of church and state" be used to mean, "We will crush any vestige of Christianity on public property"? Public property is owned by Christians too!
To: marshmallow
As long as the students are initiating this, there is nothing wrong w/ it.
To: marshmallow
The 37-year-old led those onboard in reciting the Lord's prayer on Sept. 12, the day after the terrorist attacks. She sent a note home to parents asking permission to continue the brief prayer, and all but one approved. THERE'S the problem. As long as the school district is paying her check, she has no business leading the students in prayer on the bus route.
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