Sample of Larry Ellison's new National ID Card

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[Baseballguy]

I feel the idea is wonderful. Those that have never had a credit check show something wrong raise your hand. We are approaching the time where everything is going to be wired anyway. Do you think your phone calls are private? Do you know they know who is calling who. This data is already passed.

The Oracle Co is the greatest DB in the world. This company can do anything. By the way, the software needed to check an ID could be written in Java and anyone could verify the card. Which means anyone with the Internet could be helping keep our citizens safe.

[goo goo g'joob]

And, to think my husband made me buy him some Oracle stock in his IRA.....I'm going to convince him to disown it

Sold mine at a loss when they hired Joe Lockhart

[steve-b]

Those that have never had a credit check show something wrong raise your hand.

So, now you want to give the people who f^(# up credit checks the ability to similarly f^(# up a system that determines whether or not citizens are to be permitted to live in their own country.

I'm starting to see why Aristotle thought that the brain was simply a cooling tower for the bloodstream.

[Wm Bach]

I would proudly display mine right next to my driver's license, and never ever feel like I was doing anything other than my patriotic duty to show my absolute right to be here as an American-born citizen. For everybody else, it's a privelege to be here, and with priveleges come responsibility and obligations.

Awww...What a good little german you are. You may board the bus to Dresden now where you'll be safe.

[borkrules]

These national ID boosters are a scary lot.

Thank God Bush put the kibosh on this idea right away. What is Ashcroft thinking, meeting with this turd? Shouldn't his calender be a little full right about now?

[Henry F. Bowman]

Give me the option to bring my passport or birth certificate to the DMV next time my drivers license is renewed, and they can put a "US Citizen" endorsement. Then, I could flash this at airports and the like to get into the fast line for anonymous unmolested travel without my info being recorded.

[bwteim]

From ErickOKC to Baseballguy:
"Seeing as how you have been a member here for a whole day, and your post states Oracle is the best DB in the world and the company can do anything, i am guessing you are one of Mr. Ellison's drones or perhaps Larry himself. Either way, either remain silent and learn, go away and come back when you have a brain, or simply go away. Your ignorance and trolling are truly unneeded.

PING

[jim35]

That is the most cogent, rational and brilliantly thought out response yet. You have summed it up exactly. I don't know why so many others are willing to base future loss of freedoms on the fact that we have lost many in the past. The opposite should be true.

[JenB]

Good call. Anyone who thinks Oracle is worth its bits is a moron. Then again, I think all database software is evil to one degree or another.

How come we have Microsoft bashing all the time and no corresponding Oracle bashing? At least Ellison and his product deserve it!

[NittanyLion]

I know I'll feel better knowing that my tax dollars go to support yet another bloated federal bureaucracy. That I could be stopped at anytime and forced to present my "papers", and if I forgot them at home I'll be detained until my identity is secure. That the government will know to where I travel and what I purchase. That one day the police may knock on my door and say, "You were buying a bus ticket next to the bank 5 minutes before it was robbed. Present yourself immediately for questioning".

Yep, I'm feeling a whole lot better.

[Quix]

I don't have his name handy any more. . . but there was a fellow who asserted that he had been consultant etc. for a number of CIA, FBI plans to establish a national implantable chip which would include credit cards, ID, medical records, work records etc.

He was reportedly discussing such with a close friend/colleague who happened to be an Evangelical Christian. The Christian noted that what he shared about the ID chip fit very well the Biblical prophecies about a mark of The Beast being placed in the palm or forehead. Supposedly of all the places experimented with for implanting the chip--the palm and forehead were the best for a variety of reasons.

The reason Christians are averse is because God says anyone who accepts the mark will be unable to be with Him in Heaven. But the government will say that anyone without it will be unable to buy or sell. . . . and evidently martyrdom awaits those who refuse the chip.

There have been many dreams and visions by disconnected individuals confirming various parts of such scenarios.

Much evil starts out looking beautiful and justified for seemingly admirable or at least pleasant reasons.

Freedom is priceless. Giving it away for chaff--whether insecurities or mindless submissiveness--will eventually be seen to be inexcusable IMHO.

[upchuck]

OK, fast forward 10-15 years...

We have a national ID card. The software to manage 300+ million cards was donated by Larry Ellison and Oracle Corp to the Federal Government. Oracle Corp has now eclipsed Microsoft in size, primarily due to the $10,000,000,000 per year fee Oracle is charging the Federal Government in maintenance fees for the software. The ID card is a "smart" card. It contains a chip that has all your demographic info, your fingerprints, face print, retinal scan and DNA sample. The card is interfaced to your banking accounts.

You don't need a credit or debit card anymore, you just use your national ID card (or NIcard as it has come to be known).

Everyone has a NIcard: citizens, students here from foreign countries, legal alliens, foreigners here on business or taking a vacation, everybody. You present your NIcard when you apply for a job, BUY A FIREARM, take out a loan, go to the doctor or hospital, buy a car and, of course, anytime you buy anything you don't pay cash for. As an added benefit, the government allows you to pay your taxes by using your NIcard to debit your banking account. Virtually all vendors accept the NIcard over the internet. You don't need paper checks anymore, you've got a NIcard.

In fact, so few people use cash any more there are a bunch a radicals calling for abolishing all paper and coin money. Studies are done showing how much money this saves (no more US Mint, etc.).

And, of course, everytime you use your NIcard the transaction is entered into the NIcard database powered by Oracle, the largest corporation in the world.

Now, to me this is a pretty scary scenario; for other folks it sounds like utopia. Leaving aside all the posibilities for fraud, blackmail, etc., let me ask a very basic question: How would the NIcard have prevented 911? Those guyz could have easily gotten a NIcard. (In fact, in this scenario, a NIcard is required to take flying lessons or to board a plane.) Bottom line: The NIcard allows the government to do lots of things (some of which are damned scary). But it will do NOTHING to prevent terrorists from doing their thing.

[steveegg]

It works in Europe, South America and other places around the world that have had to deal with terrorism on thier shores for a good number of years

Does it? Where would you rather be; Boston, Belfast, or Bogota? Hey, how's Beriut lately?

Or should we just continue to rely on our state issued drivers license that is easily forged (heck, there are 50 systems for them to pick from) - where states like Tennessee and others are already issuing to illegal immigrants ...

What, and allow them to perfect ONE ID card style?

Anyway, just how "voluntary" will this particular mark be? I seem to recall SS numbers being "voluntary" and "not for identification purposes", but now I can't even get a blasted fishing license without one. Have to keep those that would rather live off the land than on money (you can't get a job, credit card, savings account or a check cashed without one) in check.

[steve-b]

"Mother's Maiden Name: UNWED"

BWAAA-HA-HA!!

"Terrorist Risk: Reg. disobeys airport orders not to land."

I've got a "homeland security" proposal -- missile launchers. Maybe then he'd be more attentive to ground control.

[Baseballguy]

Seeing as how you have been a member here for a whole day, and your post states Oracle is the best DB in the world and the company can do anything, i am guessing you are one of Mr. Ellison's drones or perhaps Larry himself. Either way, either remain silent and learn, go away and come back when you have a brain, or simply go away. Your ignorance and trolling are truly unneeded. 24 posted on 10/18/01 8:25 AM Pacific by EricOKC

Well just because I finally verified to post does not mean I have been reading and learning.

If databases are bad why is the FBI using them to find the money trail and email trail. It is pure speculation that they could do it without DB. Think if instead of a stamp you get a barecode to send mail where would we be with this Anthrax scare. Identification is a tough call but if there is no log, then no history will be done.

I see the country thru rights of the honest and true and hope anyone that breaks the laws and are not caught an injust to me.

Americans should be afraid of those that can not be Identified and DMV and the rest of the agencies in our GOV do not pass data. All Oracle is suggesting is to make a common DB.

Lets find those that dont belong and keep America safe.

[Joe Bonforte]

"The Oracle Co is the greatest DB in the world. This company can do anything. By the way, the software needed to check an ID could be written in Java and anyone could verify the card. Which means anyone with the Internet could be helping keep our citizens safe."

After the first two sentences, I was prepared to read and enjoy a humorous, sarcastic jibe at Oracle. And then I realized you were serious...

[angry beaver norbert]

While it would be fine to card foreign nationals, it is against my religion (Christian) to accept any card or number such as the one discussed, due to text in Revelations.I can't help but wonder if 'voluntary' for citizens would remain so.

[mgc1122]

"All Oracle is suggesting is to make a common DB." The Gestapo enjoyed this efficiency as well.