VANITY: Global Priesthood Strong in PJ2's Reign

[dangus]

I've heard much talk from tradationalists about the tragic decline of the priesthood since Vatican 2. I do agree that priesthood is a good indicator of the health of the Catholic Church, so I decided to do some research (1996 is the last full year I could find data for on the web; I did find data for 1997 but it seemed incomplete; showing significant drops in all data, including even deaths)

Relative Low Secular 1970 1976 Year Number 1996 Europe 2548 1722 1980 1682 2458 LatAm. 414 476 1979 475 1434 N.Am. 890 798 1994 468 474 Africa 176 302 1970 176 1005 Asia 508 440 1976 440 1100 Religious 3075 2410 1984 1724 2957 Total 7611 6148 1976 4965 9428 Defect. -3504 -2878 1973 -4222 -1093

As you can see, the number of ordinations has sky-rocketed in the Pope's reign, for most regions. North America alone has failed to rebound. Even Europe has shown significant growth, which is something considering how Europe's population has declined. And this is not just do the liberation of Eastern Europe, which is mostly Eastern Orthodox, except for the Ukraine, Poland, Hungary, the Czecks, and Lithuania. Growth in Europe has been steady since the mid-80's.

The number of defections has also dropped dramatically, down 3/4ths. From what I can see, the church outside America was certainly NOT in a golden age prior to Vatican II; the preisthood was in serious decline throughout Europe, and outside Europe and the U.S., was mostly mission territory. The number of priests lobally has remained fairly stagnant. This is due largely to the pre-Vatican collapse of the priesthood in Europe, but also affected by the current dearth of vocations in the U.S. Are later vocations a possible cause, too?

I was surprised by how minimal the supposed rebound in vocations has been in the US since 1996. But I was also struck by one thing:

Several postings have been made lately -- and even Pat Buchanan has commented on -- statistics purporting to show that in 1965 the number of seminarians was 10 times higher than it was in later years. The Center for Applied Research in the Apostolate (CARA) shows that it was only three times higher, but mentions only graduate-level seminarians. If Buchanan's data is true, can roughly 2/3s of the decline be due to changes in the scoring of who's a seminarian. (As in, is he comparing graduate seminarians in 1995 with all seminarians, including undergraduate and secondary-school, in 1965?)

Major sources: CARA, Congregation for the Clergy -- Holy See (Clerus.org).

[dangus]

The rising ordination rate has overtaken the rising death rate. Worldwide priesthood is barely growing, but should take off soon. Catholic church in US still in dire straits, which is not surprising seeing how your average US bishop in the Bernadin years pretty much agreed with your average secular-humanist Marxist college professor on just about everything. But replacing Bernadin with Gregory is like replacing Clinton with Bush: Like Bush, Gregory might have some infuriating liberal affectations, but he'a of an infinitely richer faith.

[dangus]

OOps... the table using html is here:

Secular	1970	1976	Relative Low Point		1996
Europe	2548	1722	1980	1682	2458
Latin America	414	476	1979	475	1434
North America	890	798	1994	468	474
Africa	176	302	1970	176	1005
Asia	508	440	1976	440	1100
Religious	3075	2410	1984	1724	2957
	7611	6148		4965	9428
Defections	-3504	-2878	1973	-4222	-1093
Increase in Perm. Deacons	161	879	n/a	n/a	1062

[dsc]

I'm sorry, I still don't understand the table.

[LadyDoc]

usually those lamenting the "death" of the Catholic church are referring to the US and Europe.

I usually point out the same thing you do: The church is thriving elsewhere...

[sydney smith]

I guess what they meant by the 'springtime of Vat II' was a renewal of the Holy Spirit's work in Chad. I'm sure glad of that. For a minute there I thought our Church was in a period of decline. Now I won't worry as much about the liturgical abuses, GLBTQ Masses and support groups, homosexual attacks on kids because JP II has increased the numbers of ordinations in Ghana and Bangladesh.

[dangus]

>>"GLBTQ Masses"
Are you serious? When, Where?

[Hermann the Cherusker]

Great post. America is the epicenter of the Priesthood vocation problem. There is no problem elsewhere. That is why the Pope is confident. The American Church must come to grips with its problems. The increase in Europe is especially heartening.

[dangus]

I'm sorry, I still don't understand the table.

OK, here goes:

Categories are :
1-5: secular (diocesan) priests from each of the 5 continents, (Aussies and *real* penguins not included),
6: plus religious priests globally,
7: the total number of ordinations globally
8: less defections (laicization, etc.) from the priesthood
forget 9-- it's not worth explaining

For each category,
ordinations in 1970 (first year available),
1976 (year of the recent low in ordinations),
and 1996 (most recent year available).

In between 1976 and 1996, it shows when the category had its recent low point in ordinations, and how many were ordained at the low point.

I was prepared to comment about improvements in the US since 1996 that I had heard about, but frakly, I was less than impressed with the very modest uptick in the ordination rate.

[dsc]

Okay, I see now. Thanks.

Yes, it's a modest uptick, but it's better than a continued decline, eh?

[dangus]

Well, yeah, but when the fever hits 108 degrees, you don't call of the ambulance because it drops to 107.9 degrees.

[Salvation]

Source? I'd just like to get a better print-out.

[dsc]

Hey, I'm not saying that everything is wonderful. Just that it looks like movement in the right direction.

Optimism is true moral courage. So I'm trying to develop some.

[dangus]

>>Hey, I'm not saying that everything is wonderful. Just that it looks like movement in the right direction. >>

O, I *do* agree with you. While some trads overstate their case, I see the growth of the trad movement as a positive sign. (although I think their negativity on this thread isn't always healthy). The trads are the most extreme (not meaning to call them "extremists!") edge of a movement towards authenticity in America. There is definitely an increasing *potential* in America for renewal.

I remember in 1996, the Yankees were getting creamed in Game 4 of the series vs. the Braves. The Yankees stanched the bleeding, and when they scored 3 runs in one inning, I went to bed confident of their victory, even though they were still way, way behind. (I had to get up very early the next day.) I got hopeful even when they had just gotten a few runners on, demonstrating they had figured out Atlanta's pitching. That's about where we are in the American Church: way, way behind, but with a history of miracles, inspired resilliance, a couple runners on base, and the bad guy's arm is getting worn down.

[dangus]

>>Optimism is true moral courage.>>

Although I must say this: HOPE is moral courage. The case has been made to me that hope and optimism are dang near antinymical. Hope exists where optimism is dead. (Think of Frodo!)

[dangus]

My sources are listed, but I created the chart myself, after analyzing the statistics.

[Salvation]

This isn't exactly what you had there but it gives a look at the U. S. statistics. It may have been posted already.

CARA gets many inquiries from Church agencies and the media about the numbers of vocations, seminary enrollments, and priests and vowed religious. Below are comparative statistics for the past 37 years, since CARA began. The data reflect the situation at the beginning of the calendar year listed. Sources are The Official Catholic Directory, the Vatican's Annuarium Statisticum Ecclesiae (ASE), and CARA research. All data are cross checked as much as possible. The numbers reported here include only figures for those 194 dioceses or eparchies who belong to the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops. This includes the 50 states, the District of Columbia, the U.S. Virgin Islands, and all U.S. military personnel stationed overseas.

..Catholic Ministry Formation Statistics   The Permanent Diaconate ..Priestly Life in Chicago ..Statistics on Religious Life .. . ..To view these documents you may ..need to click here

U.S. Data	1965	1975	1985	1995	2000	2003
Diocesan priests	35,925	36,005	35,052	32,349	30,607	29,285
Religious priests	22,707	22,904	22,265	16,705	15,092	14,349
Total priests	58,632	58,909	57,317	49,054	45,699	43,634
Priestly ordinations	994	771	533	511	442	441
Graduate-level seminarians	8,325	5,279	4,063	3,172	3,474	3,414
Permanent deacons	--	898	7,204	10,932	12,378	13,635
Religious brothers	12,271	8,625	7,544	6,535	5,662	5,499
Religious sisters	179,954	135,225	115,386	90,809	79,814	73,316
Parishes	17,637	18,515	19,244	19,331	19,236	19,081
Without a resident priest	549	702	1,051	2,161	2,843	3,040
Catholic population	45.6 m	48.7 m	52.3 m	57.4 m	59.9 m	63.4 m
Percent of US population	24%	23%	23%	23%	22%	22%

[Salvation]

And World numbers from CARA:

World Data	1970	1975	1980	1985	1990	1995	2000
Diocesan priests	270,924	259,331	257,409	253,319	257,696	262,418	265,781
Religious priests	148,804	145,452	156,191	150,161	145,477	142,332	139,397
Total priests	419,728	404,783	413,600	403,480	403,173	404,750	405,178
Diocesan priestly ordinations	4,622	4,140	--	4,822	5,938	6,444	6,814
Graduate-level seminarians	--	--	33,731	43,476	51,603	54,154	55,968
Permanent deacons	309	2,686	7,654	12,541	17,525	22,390	27,824
Religious brothers	--	70,388	73,090	65,208	62,526	59,515	55,057
Religious sisters	--	968,526	960,991	917,432	882,111	837,961	801,185
Parishes	191,438	--	206,503	212,021	215,805	220,077	218,196
Without a resident priest	--	--	94,846	105,586	107,566	110,502	105,530
Catholic population	653.5m	709.6m	783.7m	852m	928.5m	989.4m	1.045b

[dsc]

>>Optimism is true moral courage.>>
"Although I must say this: HOPE is moral courage."

I think we're in agreement on the substance of the matter, with just a semantical quibble.

[Romulus]

The increase in Europe is especially heartening.

A few weeks ago I read that in the entire city of Paris there are 17,000 children receiving catechetical instruction. The fact that we're asked to receive this as good news shows just how bad off we are, and how deeply ingrained is the official culture of happy talk that inhibits a forthright approach to the Church's failures and shortcomings.

[dangus]

"I think we're in agreement on the substance of the matter, with just a semantical quibble."

O sure, I agree totally. But I thought the point was worth making that there *is* a distinction between hope for rebirth, and denial that there's a problem.