It’s not your mother’s Catholic Church

  “On more than one occasion I recall having worn toilet paper, Kleenex, a paper towel, and even a waist-long stocking cap when I’d forgotten my chapel cap,” recalls Anne Kwiatkowski of Perrysburg. She remembers fasting before Masses and how her brothers would pack both breakfast and lunch to eat at school after Mass on the days they were serving.
  “I think today’s Catholic Church is much more user-friendly,” says Mrs. Kwiatkowski. “The shortage of priests mandates more involvement from lay people, especially women.” She finds that being more involved makes her want to be at Mass more. And she sees that in her daughters as well. “I don’t know that I’ve ever heard them say, ‘Do we have to go to church today?’ When they were younger they loved the children’s liturgies. Now they enjoy being able to serve — something I wasn’t allowed to do.”

  At a recent bridge game, Anne’s mom, Barb Vanderkelen, and some of her friends reflected on the many changes they have witnessed in the church through the years. They remembered 40-Hour Devotions; praying when the Angelus Bells rang at noon and 6; and an endless stream of processions. “It seemed like we wore out our First Communion dresses with all the processions we were in,” says Mrs. Vanderkelen.
  The women also recalled Rogation Day, which was one of the three days of prayer preceding Ascension Day, and Ember Days, which were days reserved for prayer and fasting.
  Mrs. Vanderkelen also remembers her grandparents paying pew rental. “I think it was 25 cents,” she says adding, “They always sat in the same pew.”
  Although Mrs. Vanderkelen believes the Catholic Church is better since Vatican II, she misses some of the processions and other ceremonies that filled the church year. “I think 40-Hours was a nice thing,” she says. “It seems like we’ve cut back on a lot of meaningful services.”

  Ann Studer thinks her children miss out by not having sisters teach at their Catholic school. “Our school had Franciscan nuns,” she says. “They were so nice — so kind. I wish my kids could have the opportunity to have nuns for teachers.”
  Mrs. Studer remembers her mom telling how she had to go to confession every Saturday before Mass the next day. As a student at Alter School in Rossford, she and her classmates attended Mass twice during the school week and never missed a Sunday. “It’s too bad, but it seems like less and less time is devoted to church in many families’ schedules today.”
  On the plus side she believes that she and her children have a greater opportunity to learn more about their faith than her mom’s generation did. “My mom said she never studied the Bible in school, but I did and my children do now. It’s more of a two-way street now — learning process rather than just memorization. My kids understand more about what happened in the Bible and why.”

  When reflecting on how the church has changed since her mother’s day, Jan Nicholas of Sylvania recalled a conversation she had with her mom shortly before she passed away. “I remember talking with her about how differently people dressed for Mass,” she says. “When I was younger I would not go to church without a dress or skirt on. Today, you see so many jeans.”
  Although Mrs. Nicholas enjoys the relaxed attire, she says she wouldn’t mind going back to the more formal ways of the past, even wearing hats. “I remember how nice it was wearing chapel veils,” she says. Unlike Mrs. Kwiatkowski, Mrs. Nicholas never had to put a Kleenex on her head. “Oh some of my friends did,” she laughed, noting that she frequently carried extra chapel veils in her pocket to loan to friends.
  There are many parts of the Mass that Mrs. Nicholas really enjoys today. “I love the Sign of Peace and holding hands during the Our Father,” she says. “It gives the Mass more meaning for me.”

  You would never find Carol Stoll’s mom whistling a happy tune. “My mother told me she was never allowed to whistle because it would make the Blessed Virgin Mary cry.”
  Ms. Stoll recalls that the Fatima experience occurred when her mom was young and made a profound impact on her mom’s life. “It was fairly common for the first-born girl to be named after the Blessed Virgin,” she says. “My mom was the oldest of five. Her name was Anna Maria.”
  “Girls were encouraged to be Mary-like and wear blue,” says Ms. Stoll. “After all, the best girls got chosen to be Mary in the Christmas pageant and to crown the Blessed Virgin Mary (statue) in May.”
  Nuns were a big part of both her and her mom’s church history. “The sisters staffed the Catholic schools and along with parents were the primary teachers of Catholicism,” she recalls. She remembers nuns wearing the signature habit with a large dangling rosary and usually a crucifix. “They lived next to the church in convents, didn’t drive, and seemed to be in abundance,” she says.
  Although her mother attended a public school in Glandorf, Ms. Stoll says that sisters comprised the entire teaching staff.
  She remembers when communion was received from the priest’s hand to your tongue while kneeling at the altar rail. “You never touched the host. Oh, the things that could happen to you if you did!”
  As a young Catholic, Ms. Stoll abstained from meat every Friday and fasted every day of Lent. “We would fast from midnight before receiving Communion. The nuns would often cover the drinking fountains to help in this endeavor.”
  She remembers adult Catholics being encouraged to carry a card with them that said, “In case of an accident, please call a priest.” She also remembers how families were encouraged to have holy water fonts on the wall of each bedroom in the home.
  And, as a youngster, she was frequently reminded that she was always surrounded by both a guardian angel and the devil.
  “I am a product of both pre- and post-Vatican II,” Ms. Stoll says. “Pondering this makes me realize that I have witnessed tremendous changes in the Church over time. I have seen the Church evolve from the serious, less accepting, fire and brimstone institution of my mother’s era to the embracing, forgiving, gentler, more lay-involved and inclusive environment of today. There is no question that I am very happy to be worshipping at this point on the Church’s timeline. I enjoyed hearing about the Church of the past at my mother’s knee, but much prefer worshipping in the Church of the present.
  “Truthfully, I’m certain my mother would too. To live her religion meant to nurture, guide, support, serve, forgive, and love unconditionally. These all describe the Catholic Church today. I’ll bet like her daughter, Mom would enjoy being a current member.”

I am new to this and don't know how to include your request in italics as all of you are doing

You need to insert HTML markup commands into your post. They are pretty simple, about the only ones I ever use are for italics, bold, new paragraph, line break (for a return without skipping a line), and blockquote which indents a large block of text that you are pasting from some source.

The one thing I have forgotten is how to place HTML markups into a post as text so that I could show you how to do it.

I am still having problems with the "authority" of the USCCB in completely removing the discipline of our Holy Church as to the requirement of penance on Friday. The explanation as to it being purely ecclestical law and therefore allowing for the dispensation seems to open a Pandora's box for me.

This is an excellent question and one that does not have an easy answer. Consider also this: if it's bad enough to allow the episcopal conference to eliminate penance on Friday, then how much worse is it to allow the episcopal conference to tinker with the Mass?

You can read the instructions from FreeRepublic at the botton of the "Posting Comment" page regarding using HTML or not. I think I can give you a list of the most common commands if I insert spaces so FR does not interpret them as HTML. Just remove the extra spaces.

 Bold
 Italic
 New Paragraph
 Line Break
< Blockquote > Skip a line and indent to format large block

 End Bold
 End Italic
 End Paragraph (Not required -- happens by default)
< /Blockquote > Returns to stand indent and format

The most annoying part is that FR will automatically format a web address as a hyperlink if you don't use any HTML. But if you do use some HTML somewhere in you post, like bold or something, then you have to format the hyperlink as well.

< a href="http://www.xyz.com" > XYZ Website

The text "XYZ Website" will be formatted as a link to the URL that you put within quotation marks inside the HTML markup brackets.

"Catholics may not question the power of the Holy Father to implement another Rite."

Where did you get this truly crackpot idea? Why do you keep making such WRONG sweeping statements? OF COURSE we may question the pope's authority to do this--and some of the best liturgists in the world have done so. Here is Klaus Gamber himself on this very subject:

"Since there is no document that specifically assigns to the Apostolic See the authority to change, let alone to abolish the traditional liturgical rite; and since, furthermore, it can be shown that not a single predecessor of Pope Paul VI has ever introduced major changes to the Roman Liturgy, the assertion that the Holy See has the authority to change the liturgical rite would appear to be debatable, to say the least." (The Reform of the Roman Liturgy, p. 39.)

Code of Canon Law
IntraText CT - Text

BOOK IV : THE SANCTIFYING OFFICE OF THE CHURCH (Cann. 834 – 848)
PART III : SACRED PLACES AND TIMES
TITLE II: SACRED TIMES (Cann. 1244 - 1258)
CHAPTER II : DAYS OF PENANCE
Previous - Next

CHAPTER II : DAYS OF PENANCE

Can. 1249 All Christ's faithful are obliged by divine law, each in his or her own way, to do penance. However, so that all may be joined together in a certain common practice of penance, days of penance are prescribed. On these days the faithful are in a special manner to devote themselves to prayer, to engage in works of piety and charity, and to deny themselves, by fulfilling their obligations more faithfully and especially by observing the fast and abstinence which the following canons prescribe.

Can. 1250 The days and times of penance for the universal Church are each Friday of the whole year and the season of Lent.

Can. 1251 Abstinence from meat, or from some other food as determined by the Episcopal Conference, is to be observed on all Fridays, unless a solemnity should fall on a Friday. Abstinence and fasting are to be observed on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday.

Can. 1252 The law of abstinence binds those who have completed their fourteenth year. The law of fasting binds those who have attained their majority, until the beginning of their sixtieth year. Pastors of souls and parents are to ensure that even those who by reason of their age are not bound by the law of fasting and abstinence, are taught the true meaning of penance.

Can. 1253 The Episcopal Conference can determine more particular ways in which fasting and abstinence are to be observed. In place of abstinence or fasting it can substitute, in whole or in part, other forms of penance, especially works of charity and exercises of piety.

the assertion that the Holy See has the authority to change the liturgical rite would appear to be debatable, to say the least."

In his book "The Reform of the Roman Liturgy", Msgr. Gamber never in any way calls into question the validity of the New Mass due to any changes in the ritual of the Novus Ordo Mass. His basic contention is that the new ritual of the Mass is just that, a new ritual of the Mass. Thus, for all practical purposes the Roman Rite is dead, when not using the Roman Canon in the Novus Ordo Masses. Because of his knowledge of ecclesiology and sacramentology, Gamber never insists that the new ritual of the Mass is somehow invalid.

On the other hand, there must be said something for the defense of the authority of the Catholic Church, which has the power to guard and protect the sacred liturgy. Msgr. Gamber does not question the papal authority and power to determine liturgical reforms. He does question, however, whether or not it is really in the best interest of the Church to radically interrupt what were traditionally the liturgical rites of the Mass, which had roots for over a millennium, not to mention the very center of the liturgy, the Roman Canon (which had been determined already, almost in its entirety by the fifth century, even before the time of Gregory the Great). Gamber questions the prudence of the Roman Pontiff in discarding these venerable traditions without sufficient cause, especially when there had been no outcry on the part of the faithful, before, during, or even after the Council to discard or destroy any of the elements of the Roman Rite. And even if there had been a general outcry for change, there still would have been on justification for destroying a veritable work of art, a treasure for the Church for all time.

There are 17 oriental rites (give or take a few variations), that are officially recognized by the Church, and whose development also hearken back to the ancient Church. Would you have all of these rites replaced with the Tridentine Rite?

You write, "In his book "The Reform of the Roman Liturgy", Msgr. Gamber never in any way calls into question the validity of the New Mass due to any changes in the ritual of the Novus Ordo Mass. His basic contention is that the new ritual of the Mass is just that, a new ritual of the Mass."

But not even I question the validity of the New Mass. So you are setting up a straw man. What is your point? I have said over and over on this site that validity itself proves nothing. A Mass may be valid and still be extremely harmful to the faith. This is why Ecclesia Dei itself allows the faithful to attend SSPX Masses--precisely because there are so many bad Novus Ordo Masses around.

As for your second point, reread my quotation. You are once again either distorting the truth or totally misreading what Gamber intends. Here it is again:

"SINCE THERE IS NO DOCUMENT THAT SPECIFICALLY ASSIGNS TO THE APOSTOLIC SEE THE AUTHORITY TO CHANGE, LET ALONE TO ABOLISH THE TRADITIONAL LITURGICAL RITE; AND SINCE, FURTHERMORE, IT CAN BE SHOWN THAT NOT A SINGLE PREDECESSOR OF POPE PAUL VI HAS EVER INTRODUCED MAJOR CHANGES TO THE ROMAN LITURGY, THE ASSERTION THAT THE HOLY SEE HAS THE AUTHORITY TO CHANGE THE LITURGICAL RITE WOULD APPEAR TO BE DEBATABLE, TO SAY THE LEAST." (Reform of the Roman Liturgy, p. 39.)

This clearly contradicts what you've been saying about Gamber. He does most certainly question papal AUTHORITY to change the rite, not merely whether it was wise to do so as you contend. He points out no pope had ever done so before and no documents in support of such a move has ever existed.

As to your last question--the rites you mention have evolved over the centuries under the guidance of the Holy Spirit--and all are supportive of the Catholic dogmas of Propitiatory Sacrifice and Transubstantiation. BUT NONE HAS EVER BEEN FABRICATED BY A COMMITTEE--AND IN SUCH A WAY AS TO UNDERMINE THE FAITH. As Gamber points out, the present situation is unprecedented and frightening: it is a direct assault upon the whole of Catholic Tradition.

You write the following: "On the other hand, there must be said something for the defense of the authority of the Catholic Church, which has the power to guard and protect the sacred liturgy."

The authority of the papacy is to guard and protect SACRED TRADITION and the deposit of faith. How does it do so by destroying the ancient liturgy of that tradition and thereby suppressing and subverting the dogmas it had sustained with a fabricated liturgy that emulates a Protestant worship ceremony instead? The very notion is ridiculous.

In the West, especially in recent centuries, the gradual centralizing tendency affecting all of Church life means that the Pope took an increasingly direct and personal role in liturgical legislation. Nevertheless, Ratzinger has no hesitation in declaring (pp. 165-166) that even the Supreme Pontiff's authority is limited in this area:

After the Second Vatican Council, the impression arose that the pope really could do anything in liturgical matters, especially if he were acting on the mandate of an ecumenical council. Eventually, the idea of the givenness of the liturgy, the fact that one cannot do with it what one will, faded from the public consciousness of the West. In fact, the First Vatican Council had in no way defined the pope as an absolute monarch. On the contrary, it presented him as the guarantor of obedience to the revealed Word. The pope's authority is bound to the Tradition of faith, and that also applies to the liturgy. It is not "manufactured" by the authorities. Even the pope can only be a humble servant of its lawful development and abiding integrity and identity. . . . The authority of the pope is not unlimited; it is at the service of Sacred Tradition. . . . The greatness of the liturgy depends - we shall have to repeat this frequently - on its unspontaneity (Unbeliebigkeit).

From "spirit of the Liturgy" by Cardinal Ratzinger

What is this yes or no business? So you don't attend an SSPX Mass--so what? I've already said it represents only 20% of the traditionalist movement. I would have to know a helluva lot more to answer--but I don't make it a practice to jump through other people's hoops. If you want a yes or no, you would have to give me a lot more information about your religious habits--if you attended the Novus Ordo, for instance, fully aware of its deficiencies.

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