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To: ultima ratio
where knowledgeable Catholics must choose between Rome and the faith itself.

"Knowledgeable" Catholics know that there can never be a choice between Rome and the Faith itself. "Tu es Petros..."

59 posted on 07/15/2003 11:07:27 AM PDT by Polycarp (When a mother can kill her own child, what is left of the West to save?" - Mother Theresa)
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To: Polycarp
"'Knowledgeable' Catholics know that there can never be a choice between Rome and the Faith itself. 'Tu es Petros...'"

What baloney. Popes can sin. They can make mistakes--like Paul VI and JnPII--and plenty of them. They are sworn to uphold Sacred Tradition for this reason. They are not identical with the faith. If you were truly as knowledgeable as you claim to be, you would know this. So now let me ask you--is Rome correct when it now says, in contradistinction to past popes, that the Jews need not be converted, that their Covenant is sufficient for their salvation and that they do not need redemption by Christ like other men? Is Rome correct when it now defines the Mass as a "supper" and denies its propitiatory sacrificial dimension, in violation of Trent? If your answer is no--and you surely know it is no--then Rome does not uphold the Faith. Thank God it is being sustained by other means outside the Vatican.
68 posted on 07/15/2003 11:23:05 AM PDT by ultima ratio
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To: Polycarp
"Knowledgeable" Catholics know that there can never be a choice between Rome and the Faith itself. "Tu es Petros..."

Are you denying that post-Vatican II Rome has confused the faithful by actions and statements that appear to contradict pre-Vatican II teaching? Is this not a problem?

83 posted on 07/15/2003 12:17:40 PM PDT by Longshanks
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