Posted on 04/23/2025 9:45:09 PM PDT by SeekAndFind
Someone here the other day was saying, with the election of Pope Francis, that he was behind some other candidates in early rounds of voting, but then gained support in successive rounds that resulted in his election.
I’ve wondered how does someone know that, if everyone is sworn to secrecy and they burn the ballots?
It would be interesting to see how the voting goes, assuming they have multiple ballots before they choose someone.
With exceptions, many Cardinals and their aides eventually talk discretely off the record about a conclave, especially after the Pope starts talking and effectively relaxes the vow of secrecy. In addition, discussions before a conclave are not considered subject to the vow of secrecy.
A new pope will be selected by those that Francis put into position. In my mind this insures that next pope will be even worse than himself.
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You don’t want to know. It gave us great holy popes and just aweful popes, because it all depends on voting mens holiness, sinfulness, and ignorance.
God will use whomever for His Greater Glory, if even to humble his flock in their continued obsinate sinfulness as Francis did overall.
Praised Be Jesus Christ.
Black smoke, white smoke...I forgive them for their carbon footprint. /s
Last time they voted for the mosy commuknist
IIRC They used to burn green wood for white smoke.
I wonder if they burned coal for the dark smoke.
The white smoke says that the hashish is good. The black smoke says that it hasn’t arrived yet.
That said, the Roman Catholic Church, as it exists today at the top, is a joke and is evil. I believe in one thing; Jesus. His words, His Love. Nothing else matters.
Flame if you must.
BINGO was a huge part of my early “church“ experience. Those nuns and “priests” loved to gamble.
“ it all depends on voting mens (sic) holiness, sinfulness, and ignorance.”
This so-called “church” is one of Satan’s greatest tools.
Nope - Satan’s foibles always falter away. The fact that the Church despite all the bad popes, bishops, priests, etc. still survives is only due to the grace of God. Nothing else.
Sola Gratia.
Satan’s greatest tools were the various philosophies that have arisen in 19th century America - the Mormons, Seventh-Day Adventists, Jehovah’s witnesses, Christian Scientists, Dispensationalists etc. — these are modernist and deviate from what Christ taught.
At the top of the Catholic Church is Jesus - He is the High priest at every mass.
The problem with the new religions that are there in American, created in the 19th century - they either deny Christ completely (like the Jehovah’s witnesses) or twist His words (Dispensationalism, Prosperity gospel etc.)
the fact that there are sinners in the church tells us all embers of the Church, including her ministers, must acknowledge that they are sinners. In everyone, the weeds of sin will still be mixed with the good wheat of the Gospel until the end of time. This echoes Jesus’ parable of the wheat and weeds (Matthew 13:24-30), where good and evil coexist in the Church until the final judgment.
With regards to priests, yes, even 1 bad priest is 1 too many, I fully agree - and you need to note at the same time that Priests are human and subject to sin, as are all people. The Church teaches that ordination imparts a sacramental character but does not remove human weakness. While failures are scandalous, they are not universal. Many priests faithfully live their vows, serving sacrificially in poverty, chastity, and obedience. For example, saints like St. John Vianney (d. 1859) and countless unnamed priests exemplify fidelity. The media often amplifies scandals, overshadowing the majority who serve humbly.
The efficacy of sacraments does not depend on the priest’s holiness (ex opere operato). A sinful priest can still validly administer the Eucharist or absolve sins because the grace comes from Christ, not the minister
the Church acknowledges its history of corruption and the sinfulness of its members, including priests who fail in poverty, chastity, and obedience. These failings are real but do not negate the Church’s divine foundation by Christ, its holiness as His Bride, or its authority to teach and sanctify. The Church is a hospital for sinners, guided by the Holy Spirit, and has a history of reforming itself through councils, saints, and repentance. Scandals, like clergy abuse, are gravely sinful, but reforms and the faithfulness of many clergy show the Church’s commitment to renewal. Catholics are called to personal conversion, accountability, and trust in Christ’s promise that the gates of hell will not prevail (Matthew 16:18), ensuring the Church’s mission endures despite human weakness.
You mean someone outside the conclave? They don't really "know" that; it's basically rumor that's not supposed to get started in the first place.
Inside and during the conclave, the results are announced after every ballot ... not who voted for whom, but how many votes are cast for which man. The ballots are also announced as they are counted, so (a Cardinal who wanted to) could keep an independent tally.
Traditionally, they burned wet hay for the black smoke, and just the ballots by themselves for white smoke. That apparently led to some ambiguous smoking, so chemicals (not sure what kind) are added to color the smoke.
Well, it started with twelve guys, one of whom turned traitor, and eleven of whom ran away like scared rabbits when things got ugly.
"I tell you truly, Peter, before the cock crows you will deny me three times."
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