John MacArthur questions Ravi Zacharias salvation

[Philsworld]

Once Saved Always Saved? Or, after the moment of grace, is a Christian then judged by his works and God's holy law? John MacArthur questions the salvation of Ravi Zacharias in the life he led AFTER he came to Christ.

https://youtu.be/L2tpwVrBEz0

[Elsie]

Does Buzz know that those believers won’t be in heaven, because of their lawlessness?

Probably as much as he knows that...

... ...some believers WILL be in heaven, because of their lawFULLness?

[Elsie]

...which leads to more confusion.

And MORMONism.

[Elsie]

...which leads to more confusion.

And MORMONism.

[Elsie]

The Protestant movement has as much authority as the Samaritan movement.

Spoken well, Lord Farquaad!

[Elsie]

What is “His kindness”?

[Philsworld]

——>It is that internal change, when the Holy Spirit starts to change you from the inside out, that is important. If that hasn’t happened, you never believed -

Not according to OSAS/OJAJ. Do you understand my point and the position of OSAS/OJAJ? Only one thing matters in terms of Salvation, and that happens at the microsecond they accept Christ. THERE IS NO PROCESS FOR THEM. It is one and done. After that, they are locked in, no matter what happens later (aside from the unpardonable sin?). They say all one has to do is believe. Yeah, they keep saying that. Believe when? Believe at the microsecond of conversion. You accept Christ, you are absolutely going to heaven and no one is going to take that away from you. That’s what they say. One guy posts lots of bible verses, BELIEVING that’s what they mean. Unfortunately, he discounts all the other ones saying the exact opposite. How about a OSAS/OJAJ guy that accepts Christ, then some years later becomes a flaming homosexual, goes on Grindr and has a new sexual partner 5 days out of the week (LOL), won’t give it up, and after many years dies unrepentant, of an AIDS related infection. Still going to heaven? According to OSAS/OJAJ, yes. The bible clearly says no.

[Philsworld]

——>”They were broken off because they did not believe”

Does not apply to the OSAS/OJAJ, because every one of them BELIEVES that Christ is their savior. Again, there is no SALVATION PROCESS with the OSAS/OJAJ. It is one and done at the microsecond of Grace. They are ALL expecting to be in heaven, no matter what kind of life they have lived.

[daniel1212]

1 John 3:9 No one who is born of God will continue to sin,......1 John 5:18 says: "We know that anyone born of God does not continue to sin;

That is indeed the characteristic of saving faith, as it describes the character of those who are born from above, but it does not mean this precludes a believer from choosing to not persevere,

Likewise,

No man that warreth [soldiers, Luke 3:14] entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier. (2 Timothy 2:4)

However, while this is the proper character of a soldier, that does not mean one cannot betray that call.

Again, the problem with all this is that God many times warns believers, as believers, against forfeiting what justifying obtained. Such as against developing an "evil heart of unbelief in departing from living God," from the faith they once held, falling from grace, making Christ of no effect, to no profit, drawing back to perdition," and yielding to pressure to deny the faith after conversion, so that Paul's labor would be in vain, (Gal. 5:1-5; Heb. 3:12-14; Heb. 10:25-31, Heb. 10: 38-39; 1 Thessalonians 3:5)

Ask your AI who each verse is logically addressing, what faith they are appealing to, and what they are being warned against.

I am forced to conclude that God is warning believers against forfeiting what faith obtained, by the grace of God. And yes, seals can be broken. (Rev_5:1-2; Rev_5:5; Rev_5:9; Rev_6:1.)

[Philsworld]

John (you’ve heard of him?) had something to say about that:

Revelation 14:12Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Revelation 22:14Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

and Solomon:

Eccl 12:13When all has been heard, the conclusion of the matter is this: Fear God and keep His commandments, because this is the whole duty of man. 14For God will bring every deed into judgment, along with every hidden thing, whether good or evil.

Buzz probably never read those texts before, or, he doesn’t BELIEVE that. Buzz chose poorly.

[Elsie]

Again, there is no SALVATION PROCESS with the OSAS/OJAJ.

HMMMmmm...

                               SALVATION PROCESS Chart

          Start -----------------------------------------------------------End
 
Example 1                              ^
Example 2                                       ^
Example 3                        ^
Example 4                                           ^
Example 5                             ^
Example 6                                                       ^
Example 7                          ^



^ = "Yea! You made it!"



(where's the line?)

[Elsie]

Paul (You’ve read some of his stuff?) had this to say...

 

 

 

Galatians 3:11

Now it is clear that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

---

Romans 1:16-17 New King James Version

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek. 17 For in it the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith; as it is written, “The just shall live by faith.”

---

Habakkuk 2:4 King James Version

Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith.

---

Hebrews 10:38 King James Version

Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.

[Mr Rogers]

I reject OSAS so I don’t worry about their theories. When theory doesn’t match scripture, reject the theory.

[Philsworld]

——>I reject OSAS so I don’t worry about their theories.

I’m glad to hear that. However, many others are 100% all in on that Satanic lie. Mark my words.

[Philsworld]

Once again, I have no idea what on earth you are talking about.

[Philsworld]

Does Buzz know about this one too? Make sure he knows that the Remnant are commandment keepers.

Rev 12:17And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

[RoosterRedux]

I don’t disagree with that. But, of course, only God knows just exactly what is going on when, if, and how a man might walk away God’s promise of eternal life.

[Elsie]

You claimed a ‘process’.

I was merely wanting details.

[Philsworld]

I claimed that there is “NO” Salvation process for the OSAS/OJAJ, per their statements. One and done for them at the microsecond of grace.

What’s the biblical “process”? Saved by grace, Holy Spirit influence to a changed heart, leading to a life of obedience, judgment on that life. (something like that)

Hebrews 8:

10For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

11And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

12For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

[Elsie]

Your words ---> What’s the biblical “process”? Saved by grace, Holy Spirit influence to a changed heart, leading to a life of obedience, judgment on that life. (something like that)

So; just WHERE, in this 'process' can one be ASSURRED of their salvation?

[Philsworld]

——>So; just WHERE, in this ‘process’ can one be ASSURRED of their salvation?

Here:

Rev 14:12Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.