Posted on 03/03/2024 10:48:40 AM PST by Roman_War_Criminal
Enjoy:
So then, all the OT saints are in Hell?
Do you even READ your bible?
Let’s say you are a child.
And your Father promises you to take you to get ice cream if you behave.
During the long (to you) day, you really, really do better, but you still do something wrong.
Now, your Father, who saw your effort, BECAUSE YOU HAD FAITH THAT YOUR FATHER WAS A GOOD FATHER AND WOULD REWARD YOU - decides to take you to get ice cream anyway.
Did the child DESERVE ice cream? NO!
Is the Father Good? YES!
Was the child hopeful, and faithful and TRY to fulfill the promise, even though he could not control himself? YES.
This is a picture of Israel - They are saved by FAITH through their belief in the Old Covenant, and Israel is partially blinded to the Savior until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.
WHO BLINDED ISRAEL? Did not God know what Israel would do BEFORE He entered into a convent with them? Of course He did. He knows Israel is a “stiff necked” people. Just the type to receive the OT and not change one jot or tittle.
The Covenant does NOT save people. Jesus does. Nothing has changed, our Deliverer has, and always will be, Jesus. Even the New Covenant shows you cannot keep it. Is there a Christian alive who has kept the LAW? Even just the ten commandments? We Christians are in the same boat as the Jews. All must have faith in God to be saved, and it’s Jesus (like it or not) that is the ONLY One that saves.
So then, should we think God made a mistake and has rejected the Jews?
Read Romans 11
That was because of disobedience. Nbut GOD promised to gather Israel a 3rd time.
No one said that.
I guess it's easy to win arguments when you're putting words into the opponent's mouth.
The OT saints obeyed God and believed in Christ, even if they didn't know His identity yet.
After Christ appeared to the Jews, there's no excuse not to know.
Read another point of view and provide your proofs that it is wrong if you can.
If you're sincerely interested in other points of view...
Catholic revisionist history justifying itself?
No, that’s not biased..........
“Nbut GOD promised to gather Israel a 3rd time.”
Yes, but that occurs AFTER peace worldwide breaks out and righteouss prevails. And it is done by God, not the United Nations.
There is no highway running from Egypt to Jerusalem.
No, it is going on right now. The spiritual restoration of Israel is accelerating, and more Jews are coming to YESHUA every day.
Did the OT saints obey God, or did they try?
You see, they are in the same situation - Justified by FAITH. Not by LAW.
The LAW was only to show you cannot be justified by works.
But they had faith in the coming redeemer, the messiah, God with us!
They knew His titles, but not His name.
So all were and are saved by the same agency - Belief in Jesus.
(Either knowing His name (as we Christians are privileged to) or not).
Are you familiar with the story of the Prodigal Son?
The Gentiles are the younger brother, we ate with the pigs and left the things of God after the fall.
The Jews are the older brother, who stayed in the field.
Note that the older brother would NOT come into the feast when the younger brother returned.
Likewise, the Gentiles have returned to God, but the Jews stay in the field, not attending the celebration.
The parable ends with that issue hanging out. The older brother is still in the field.
But we know from prophecy the older brother WILL return and celebrate with the Father.
WE (the younger brother) should write the older brother out of the family. That decision is the Fathers, not ours.
We are all the prodigal son when we sin. We are all the older brother when we resent seeing a sinner forgiven.
The prodigal son in the story was Jewish. He worked with pigs to emphasize his degradation; how far he had fallen.
There are deeper meanings to all the parables.
I wish you well on your journey.
Yes, he was.
Unbiased sources are sometimes warranted. The author is a Protestant.
https://www.amazon.com/Bearing-False-Witness-Debunking-Anti-Catholic/dp/1599475367/
Who did he kill and how many?
Give us a list of those he himself murdered.
No sense arguing with the RCC faction here.
When you believe in “purgatory” you’ll fall for any lie.
Preterists like yourself are hardly basing their beliefs on historical facts and Biblical truth.
That’s why I refer to your flawed baseline.
You probably date the Book of John to before 70AD - at that point all discussion is moot because you clearly cannot see the massive gulf between His Gospel and the other three.
Not to mention Revelation.
By His cross Chris reconciled Jews and Gentiles, making both ONE in Himself (Eph. 2:14-16)
14 For he himself is our peace, who has made the two groups one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, 15 by setting aside in his flesh the law with its commands and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new humanity out of the two, thus making peace, 16 and in one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility.As Paul wrote "theirs is the sonship and the glory and the covenants and the law and the worship and the promises; theirs are the fathers and from them is the Christ according to the flesh" (Rom. 9:4-5).
The Church rejects the idea that the covenant with Israel has been nullified or revoked. The Old Testament is an indispensable part of Sacred Scripture. Its books are divinely inspired and retain a permanent value, for the Old Covenant has never been revoked.
While the role of preparing the world for the arrival of the messiah has been fulfilled by the Jewish people, they still are God’s chosen people whose fidelity to God remains a light to the nations. The Jewish people were called to a unique and special relationship to God that included preparing for the messiah but was not limited to that one role.
The two extremes of replacement theology and dispensationalism are both wrong in their extremes - both Jews and Christians as complimentary and overlapping peoples of God. We are both elect. Those Jewish individuals who are also Christians might be regarded as doubly elect, or elect on two grounds. While the Church is the New Israel, this does not obliterate the identity of the Old Israel, nor deprive it from playing any role in God’s plan of the ages. In particular, it does not remove the prophesied conversion of the Jewish people in the last days.
The prophecy in the book of Revelation is for the Jesus followers - whether of Jewish or gentile heritage.
Chapter 2 and 3 are to churches that are varied from mixed to mostly gentile.
Chapters 5 to 20 are about the fall of Jerusalem in 70 AD - and we read about not only the 144K Judeans but also the vast multitudes from all nations who are included in the worship of the Lord.
By the time John wrote the book of Revelation *around 65 AD*, “Christianity” was still a sect of 2nd temple judaism.
Current day Judaism is derived from Phariseeism and actually dates to AFTER 70 AD, so is a “niece” religion to Christianity and about 40 odd years YOUNGER
Unfortunately, “replacement theology” has been the official position of historical chrstianity from the very beginning. It is philo-Semitism that is the recent innovation.
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