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One by one, bishops slowly insisting Catholics go back to Mass. How many will listen?
LifeSite News ^ | September 16, 2020 | Phil Lawler

Posted on 09/16/2020 12:09:08 PM PDT by ebb tide

One by one, bishops slowly insisting Catholics go back to Mass. How many will listen?

Having used their authority to stop lay Catholics from attending Mass, can bishops now invoke their authority to bring them back? Will this genie go back in the bottle?

September 16, 2020 (CatholicCulture.org) — Starting this coming Sunday, it will be a serious sin for a Catholic in the Milwaukee archdiocese to miss Sunday Mass without a serious reason. Last week it was OK. It’s still OK in most other American dioceses and archdioceses.

Can we expect ordinary Catholics to understand this situation? Can we expect them to come back to Sunday Mass, after a six-month hiatus? Having used their authority to stop lay Catholics from attending Mass, can bishops now invoke their authority to bring them back? Will this genie go back in the bottle?

Milwaukee’s Archbishop Jerome Listecki has ended the blanket dispensation from the obligation to attend Mass on Sunday, and warned the faithful of his archdiocese: “Those who deliberately fail to attend Sunday Mass commit a grave sin.”

“Fear of getting sick, in and of itself, does not excuse someone from the obligation,” the archbishop continued. But wait: wasn’t a fear of illness the reason why Archbishop Listecki, and so many other prelates, issued a dispensation from that obligation? The archbishop obviously anticipates that question, and his statement continues:

However, if the fear is generated because of at-risk factors, such as pre-existing conditions, age or compromised immune systems, then the fear would be sufficient to excuse from the obligation.

So each lay Catholic must decide for himself whether he has real reason to fear that going to Mass could endanger his health, and if it would not, the regular Sunday obligation applies. Fair enough.

But the Sunday obligation only applies in Milwaukee (and in the few other dioceses whose bishops have ended the dispensation). So what happens if a lay Catholic who resides in Milwaukee finds himself in, say, nearby Chicago on a Sunday morning? Is he bound by the Sunday obligation because he is under Archbishop Listecki’s authority? Or dispensed because he is in another ecclesiastical jurisdiction where the blanket dispensation is still in place? It is difficult to understand why something that is gravely sinful in one place is not sinful at all just a few miles away.

For that matter, if it will be gravely sinful to skip Mass next Sunday, why was it acceptable to skip Mass last Sunday? At first glance Archbishop Listecki’s decision — and consequently, his warning about the possibility of grave sin — appears to be based on nothing more than his own personal authority; there is no reference to the Decalogue, to the solemn commandment to keep holy the Lord’s Day, to the notion that worship is an obligation in justice.

To an informed Catholic (and bear in mind that not all Catholics are informed), the basic facts are clear:

What sort of illness constitutes a “serious reason” for failure to attend Sunday Mass? The individual must answer that question for himself. His answer will depend on his particular circumstances: his age, his overall health, the possible risks of exposure to new disease. The pastor cannot come take his temperature and his medical history. The individual must trust his own judgment.

Urgent appeal to the bishops of the world: Feed your flock! Sign the petition here.

Back in March, however, the Catholic bishops of the US — all of them — did make that judgment. They decided that all Catholics had a “serious reason” for not attending Sunday Mass. That the bishops had the authority to make that judgment, and issue the blanket dispensations, is beyond question. Whether they were prudent in doing so is another matter.

When the Covid epidemic first broke upon us, we were virtually all frightened. That fear was not irrational; the disease was spreading at an objectively frightening rate. The media fanned the flames of fear, and — influenced no doubt by the media hype — so did our bishops. Within weeks all the churches were closed, and for most of us attending Sunday Mass was no longer an obligation; in fact it was an impossibility.

Bishops are not epidemiologists; they did not know — any more than the rest of us did — how fast the virus would spread and how deadly it would prove. As time passed, more information became available, and we could put the Covid epidemic in perspective, we all reached our own conclusions about the risks we were running, and the risks we were prepared to run. But if we concluded that Sunday Mass would be safe — that we no longer had a “serious reason” to absent ourselves — that option still was not open to us, because the bishops had closed our churches.

Looking back, Archbishop Listecki explains in his recent statement why the churches were closed:

As responsible parish communities, we needed to assess the transmission of the COVID-19 virus, permit our parishes the time to establish plans for sanitizing worship spaces, secure needed resources, evaluate the appropriate numbers for social distancing and solicit the voluntary personnel necessary to accomplish the tasks of preparing our worship spaces.

In other words, our bishops and pastors were methodically deciding when, and under what conditions, they thought the churches would be safe. But since bishops have no special expertise on questions of public safety — and since their decisions on this matter were unquestionably based on calculations of public safety — many Catholics are likely to question their judgments. Archbishop Listecki acknowledges that a rational fear of exposure to Covid, based on pre-existing conditions, “would be sufficient to excuse from the obligation.” Just a few weeks ago the archbishop effectively ruled that everyone had a rational basis for fears. Now he says that, at least for most people, that rational basis is gone. But it isn’t that simple. Many Catholics in Milwaukee no doubt are afraid — having been told for months that they should be afraid — and the archbishop can’t flip a switch to turn off their fears.

So while I applaud Archbishop Listecki for ending the dispensation, and for reminding the faithful about their Sunday obligation, I doubt that the faithful of the Milwaukee archdiocese will flock back to their parish churches this coming Sunday. Bishops can issue authoritative orders, but they can’t flip emotional switches. And when a prelate seems to be saying that it’s gravely sinful to skip Sunday Mass because the archbishop says so — when just last week it wasn’t sinful at all because the archbishop said so — he is stretching his authority to the breaking point.

Back in March, a number of bishops undermined their own authority still further because they never did tell the faithful that they were dispensed from their Sunday Mass obligation; they simply said that there would be no Mass celebrated for the public. Now of course the people in that case were dispensed, since one is never obligated to do the impossible. But when regular Sunday Mass resumes in those dioceses, it will be very, very difficult for the bishops to insist on the Sunday obligation. It isn’t easy to credit a bishop’s authority to tell you that you must attend Sunday Mass, when he was so ready blithely to announce that you couldn’t.

I wonder whether some bold prelate will simplify matters for all of us, with a statement something like this:

Look, maybe I shouldn’t have issued a general dispensation. The usual rules applied then, and they still apply now. If you are sick, or have good reason to think you might become sick, then you’re excused from your obligation. That bar is naturally going to be lower during this epidemic, as it would be during any health emergency. But there still is, and always will be, a Sunday obligation.

Published with permission from CatholicCulture.org.


TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Theology; Worship
KEYWORDS: catholic; dictatorbishops; francisbishops; mass; reopen; scamdemic; theyneed
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To: ebb tide

Only 20 to 25% regularly attend Mass except Easter and Christmas.

We need all Catholics to practice their faith fully and for inactive Catholics to return to the Church. Even if the leadership are sinners and don’t fully preach the Gospel, the faithful need to know, love and serve God.

There are some very good homilies on you tube from Father James Altman and Shrine of Divine Mercy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ns4Y_P09CCY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWp9tUW7cR4


21 posted on 09/16/2020 3:01:41 PM PDT by ADSUM
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To: DuncanWaring

The Catholic Catechism is a good guide.

Also our conscience that was put in our heart by God.


22 posted on 09/16/2020 3:13:40 PM PDT by ADSUM
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To: EEGator

The Church is for sinners. Too many do not know God’s Truth.

We need to show them our faith and God’s Truth so that they may accept God’s Truth.

Jesus wants is the accept His Divine Mercy by repenting and changing our ways.

The choice of eternal life with Him or with Satan.


23 posted on 09/16/2020 3:20:27 PM PDT by ADSUM
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To: Sacajaweau

RCINC cash flow is pinched and they need $$ to pay those 800$/hr. attorneys to smear those abused and molested in deposition and trial.

RCINC is the oldest most profitable multinational corporation on the planet


24 posted on 09/16/2020 3:46:31 PM PDT by slapshot (The NHL is dead to me)
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To: ADSUM

How ardent are you regarding Divine Mercy? I’d like to know what Archbishop Viganó thinks about it. He’s relatively young so his time in seminary began post-Vatican II. He imbibed heavily at that well for decades. So his present heavy skepticism about Vaticon II and the “spirit” thereof is hard won. He may have had a devotion relating to Divine Mercy. If he did I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s not so gangbusters about it now. If not I doubt it will ever hold any attraction for him given the urgency with which he is now connecting dots and naming names. You can probably tell that Divine Mercy leaves me flatter than a pancake. To me, there’s just too much about it that says “look at me, I’m new” and not enough about it that says “learn well what it meant to be a devout Catholic during or before about 1910-1915”. In other words, it has that whiff of jesuitical modernism that sends me running in the opposite direction.


25 posted on 09/16/2020 3:48:45 PM PDT by one guy in new jersey
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To: ebb tide

Now be honest. How many angels can REALLY dance on the head of a pin?


26 posted on 09/16/2020 4:06:27 PM PDT by HIDEK6 ( God bless Donald Trump.)
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To: HIDEK6
Now be honest. How many angels can REALLY dance on the head of a pin?

Honestly, I don't answer stupid questions.

27 posted on 09/16/2020 4:27:32 PM PDT by ebb tide (We have a rogue curia in Rome.)
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To: one guy in new jersey

I am not sure where you are coming from on Divine Mercy? Perhaps you should explain.

I do not know Arch Vigano’s position.

St Faustina (1905-1938) wrote a Diary in Polish and translated to English published in 1987 with a Nihil Obstat and Imprimatur at the request of her confessor.

It was based on her life and Jesus chose her to proclaim His message of Mercy to the people of the whole world.

Jesus said that “I do not want to punish aching mankind, but I desire to heal it, pressing it to My Merciful Heart.” 1588

Jesus wants us to ask for His Mercy, Repent and change our ways away from sin. Jesus is concerned that many have and will reject His love will not enter eternal life with Him.

Now is the time of mercy and will not last forever. There is predicted an enlightenment soon when we will see our souls and then a 3 day period of darkness. If people do not change then there is a possibility of a chastisement of fire.

Perhaps you are familiar with the Blessed Mother’s separate warning at Garabandal: Our Lady’s Message of June 18, 1965

Since my Message of October 18, 1961 has not been complied with and has not been made much known to the world, I will tell you that this is the last one. Before the chalice was filling now it is overflowing. MANY CARDINALS, MANY BISHOPS, AND MANY PRIESTS ARE ON THE PATH OF PERDITION AND THEY TAKE MANY SOULS WITH THEM. TO THE EUCHARIST, THERE IS GIVEN LESS AND LESS IMPORTANCE. We should avoid the Wrath of God on us by our good efforts. If you ask pardon with your sincere soul God will pardon you. It is I, Your Mother, who through the intercession of St. Michael, wish to say that you amend, that you are already in the last warnings and that I love you much and do not want your condemnation. Ask us sincerely and we will give to you. You should sacrifice more. Think of the Passion of Jesus.
Conchita Gonzales
http://www.garabandal.org/News/Message_7.shtml


28 posted on 09/16/2020 5:16:34 PM PDT by ADSUM
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To: ADSUM; one guy in new jersey
Jesus said that “I do not want to punish aching mankind, but I desire to heal it, pressing it to My Merciful Heart.”

Personally, I question the authenticity of Sister Faustina'a "revelations" and am not surprised they were not approved until after VC II.

They conflict with both Fatima and Garabandal (the latter of which occurred just before VC II).

And now the post-Vatican II church appears to be close to approving the frauds at Medjugore.

29 posted on 09/16/2020 6:06:36 PM PDT by ebb tide (We have a rogue curia in Rome.)
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To: ADSUM; one guy in new jersey
"If my people do not wish to submit themselves, I am forced to let go of the hand of my Son. It is so heavy and weighs me down so much I can no longer keep hold of it. Our Lady of La Salette; September 19th, 1846. The Message of Our lady of La Salette

The above doesn't really jive with:

“I do not want to punish aching mankind, but I desire to heal it, pressing it to My Merciful Heart.”

30 posted on 09/16/2020 6:38:45 PM PDT by ebb tide (We have a rogue curia in Rome.)
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To: ADSUM

I’m glad I reached out.

Thanks for parting with your thoughts.

Now mine.

“Now is the time of mercy and will not last forever. There is predicted an enlightenment soon when we will see our souls and then a 3 day period of darkness. If people do not change then there is a possibility of a chastisement of fire.”

I strain to see where the above vignette relating to “now” ties back to what the Catholic Church taught at all times and in all places. It smacks of gnosticism, secret knowledge. The concept of waiting with bated breath for a soon-to-come “enlightenment” in which “we” will “see our souls”? Search your heart, Adsum. Where does this kind of talk find a point of connection with traditional Catholic teaching? I don’t see one. It seems as foreign to me as Louis Farrakhan’s mother ship.

“Jesus wants us to ask for His Mercy, Repent and change our ways away from sin. Jesus is concerned that many have and will reject His love will not enter eternal life with Him.”

Okay. Well. Jesus is “concerned”. Damned if that doesn’t sound to me like the height of postmodern effeminacy. In his prime, (just a turn of phrase—he’s always in his prime) Jesus told us that wide and easy is the way that leads to perdition, and many there are who will choose that path. He speaks about casual acquaintances who will be shocked when roughly rejected at the front door and refused entry into the sumptuous banquet, being told at that time by the master, depart from me, I never knew you, and then cast into the street to ponder their poor life choices. Adsum—does this sound like one who is wracked with “concern” about those who are being given every chance to develop a minimally-functioning conscience and pull themselves out of a moral nosedive, but still in the end obstinately choose, as grown adults, in the unrestricted exercise of their God-given free will, to follow the ways of the world, rather than mount the narrow and arduous path to salvation?

Come now. At some point, Jesus would never countenance those around him falling into some virtue-signaling trance that compels them to blindly and continually cast pearls at swine all the live-long day, and neither should we. At some point we need to let the dead bury their dead. Shake the dust from our sandals. Move on to the next town in search of a better reception.

“Perhaps you are familiar with the Blessed Mother’s separate warning at Garabandal: Our Lady’s Message of June 18, 1965”

Very interesting that you should mention Garabandal.

I plunged into that minor ocean at one point. I found Garabanal and the happenings there utterly fascinating. Then I began to develop a sense of consternation that the local Catholic hierarchy there was consistently negative or at least neutral and unenthusiastic about concluding that the supernatural occurrences were divine in origin. Then over time I educated myself about the vast capacity of Satan and his army of brilliant fallen angels to orchestrate circumstances and coopt the faithful in ways that make them feel like they are in the thrall of a divine ecstasy when instead they are being used and led around by their noses for the dastardly purposes of the evil one, up to his old tricks, shamelessly aping the divine and thereby pulling so many vulnerable believers into his sulpherous orbit from which it can be very difficult to escape.

Adsum, in a nutshell, that is Garabandal. Dirty, rotten fruit. Diabolically-deceived and seemingly irreversibly distracted members of the lay faithful going to their graves in a kind of half-schismed fog of paranoia and frustration without ever having seriously considered that the hierarchy’s consistent thumbs-down attitude, however vaguely conveyed or poorly explained over the years, was their signal to hop off the deranged Garabandal train and rejoin the land of the living.

Please don’t make that same mistake. Drop your interest in Garabandal. I dropped it. Like a hot brick, when I got the distinct sense that the Devil was rampant and fully at play there, I just let it go. I am so glad I did. I don’t ever look back with any kind of curiosity. You won’t either.

As a member of the flock, I listen carefully and eagerly for the voice of the shepherd. When I hear it, I instantly recognize it. I am comforted, and I respond, gently, happily. When the voice is unfamiliar, just try to get me to follow. It is just not going to happen. Ever. In fact, just try to get me to shut up about the poor, pathetic hireling’s manifold shortcomings in Catholic doctrine.

This is a function of having applied for the past six years a well-educated and intelligent fully adult mind to overcoming the problem of having received an horrifically poor education in the faith when young in the wake of Vatican II.

This is a functon of having absolutely rejected ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING that did not closely mesh with Catholic texts and traditional teachings dating from about 1910 or 1915 or earlier, all the way back to the Church fathers, and including more or less everything in between of any value in characterizing or conveying the faith, but precious little to nothing from obsessed theologians, corrupt academics, faith-starved bishops, charismatic lay leaders, dating from about 1915 through until the present. Early Fulton J. Sheen materials? Fine. Story after story about Padre Pio’s fascinating life and ministry? Definitely okay too. All things Our Lady of Fatima? I want to know all about it. All other approved miraculous events and occurrences deemed worthy of belief and safe for simple members of the faithful to ponder about are also fair game. The cutoff I’m articulating is good for inoculating one from the baleful modernist influence that began to grow and grow from that time onward WITHIN the Church, and that by now has achieved bureaucratic, if not also spiritual, ascendancy.

With respect, Adsum, I would advise you to snap out of it. People are counting on you and your example. Don’t lead them astray.


31 posted on 09/16/2020 8:18:40 PM PDT by one guy in new jersey
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To: ebb tide

Medjugore.

Ugh. That’s a long day right there.

Why can’t the father of lies just make it easy on us and just agree to show up with his horns, long tail and pitchfork?

So many people have such trouble recognizing him.


32 posted on 09/16/2020 9:18:21 PM PDT by one guy in new jersey
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To: one guy in new jersey

Well Adsum, just for you I watched a 75 minute YouTube video from 2008 talking about everything you, I, or anybody else have been saying about basically every single one of the noted apparitions plus a half dozen more.

“People will know that God is Real during the Illumination of Conscience”

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=v37iXBYbW7g

The speaker knew every jot and tittle about all of it. Amazing really.

I chafe though, when prophesies are repeated and ravenously propagated, supposedly edifying us regarding soon-to-come end times, end-of-days, etc. And this speaker with his encyclopedic knowledge of every approved and unapproved apparition, Marian and otherwise, Faustina/Divine Mercy, Garabandal, Medjugore, Akita, Lourdes, La Sallete, Fatima, everything, went whole hog in getting in every specifically prophesied detail of every supposed end times event, miracle, mass depopulation incident, etc., etc., of which he was aware. Like a Las Vegas buffet, nobody’s favorite dish was omitted.

I don’t know if it is attributable to the way I came about my knowledge of the faith, or how I developed my belief in the Real Presence, or what it is, but I have ***zero*** interest in being stuffed like a Christmas Turkey full of detailed prophesies of end times. One after another, the eagerly predicted spectacles and supposedly unmistakable signs of divine wrath and power multiply and pile up upon each other, not a single one of whuch has any relation whatsoever to my faith, how I came about it, or why I hold onto it as strongly as I do.

And it seems as if it is these very types of apparitions that are lingering out there, decade after decade waiting for “final approval” by some local or Vatican authority, that seem to want to load their adherents and devotees up with kind of fevered apprehension about what’s to come. And when. And how. And at what time of day, etc.

To dwell on this kind of stuff, to obsess on it, to require it as some kind of spiritual sustenance, just has to be wrong! Is it not so that we will know neither the day nor the hour? That noone but the master himself will know when he will return to the house?

Are we not expected to keep our lamps filled and trimmed at all times? That’s the healthy approach. One should never allow apprehension about what supernatural end-of-days events are supposedly coming right around the corner to steal away your peace of mind and distract you from full spiritual participation in the here and now. It is all so clamorous and unnecessary and I would just as soon leave it all up to God and his undisclosed schedule, so long as in the meantime I’m permitted to know to a moral certainty that I’m doing his will.


33 posted on 09/17/2020 12:47:53 AM PDT by one guy in new jersey
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To: pbear8

Sounds as though you do not like her very much.


Actually, that really DOES speak to the “I love my kids, but sometimes I don’t like them very much.”

She is getting more and more fanatical about it. And I don’t mean about Christianity. I mean about Catholicism.


34 posted on 09/17/2020 5:52:14 AM PDT by cuban leaf (The political war playing out in every country now: Globalists vs Nationalists)
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