The Elect

Christian Apologetics & Research Ministry ^ | 1-13-20 | Matt Slick

[fproy2222]

The elect are those called by God to salvation. This calling occurs before the foundation of the world (Eph. 1:4) and is according to God's will and not man's (Rom. 8:29-30, 9:6-23) because God is sovereign (Rom. 9:11-16).

[fproy2222]

This seems to be teaching that those who will be saved are chosen befor we are born. Any ideas?

[SoConPubbie]

One of the most damnable hearsays pushed by those who do not read their Bible in context. You cannot believe that God arbitrarily chooses one Sinner over another Sinner to be saved and at the same time, believe that God an All-Loving, Perfect God. These are incompatible beliefs.

"And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely." -Revelation 22:17

“But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.” - Hebrews 2:9

"And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world." - 1st John 2:2

[circlecity]

If you believe God exists outside of time, that he knew the end from the beginning, then there’s no other conclusion you can come to.

[circlecity]

The Apostle Paul responds to this exact objection in Romans 9.

[Calm_Cool_and_Elected]

Romans 9:13

[SoConPubbie]

Another scripture that flies in the face of this hearsay:

John 3:15-16

15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

[SoConPubbie]

Wrong!

God's foreknowledge of your choices does not mean that he chooses winners and losers where Salvation is concerned.

He still gives the choice to the sinner as to whether or not that sinner will repent and believe the Gospel and he has promised anyone who does repent and believe the Gospel will be saved.

[SoConPubbie]

If you believe God exists outside of time, that he knew the end from the beginning, then there’s no other conclusion you can come to.

Wrong!

God's foreknowledge of your choices does not mean that he chooses winners and losers where Salvation is concerned.

He still gives the choice to the sinner as to whether or not that sinner will repent and believe the Gospel and he has promised anyone who does repent and believe the Gospel will be saved.

[LeonardFMason]

Man’s responsibility is to repent and believe the Gospel.

God IS Sovereign. God is Omniscient. NOTHING is done without Him. Nothing is a surprise to Him.

Election is a truth for Believers. It should bow the Believers heart to the Mercy and Grace of God they have been shown.

A simple illustration: The DOOR(The Lord Jesus -
John 10:9 “I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved”)It has the invitation “WHOSOEVER” above the mantle - John 3:16

Once Inside, having heeded the invitation and accepting Christ as Savior looking back to the same door above the mantle it says: “CHOSEN” - Ephesian 1:4 “According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world”

ELECTION is a truth for the SAVED(BELIEVERS)
SALVATION thru the Finished work of Christ is the Gospel message for the UNSAVED.

[faucetman]

ONLY God knows! He’s not telling.

IF you knew, you would act differently. So, He keeps it to Himself.

It’s not up to God, it’s up to YOU! He just already KNOWS (all knowing) what path you WILL take.

[Orbiter]

I wonder how Judas got elected.

[SoConPubbie]

Read all the way to the end of the chapter where the Apostle Paul shows who will be saved (those whom God has chosen) vs. who will not:

Romans 9:32-33

32. Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;

33. As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

So we see it is not an arbitrary choosing by God, but a choosing by God based on the choice of the Sinner to seek him by faith.

Read in context!

[Cottonpatch]

Reading one verse in the Bible is like reading one chapter in a history book.
The Bible is an unfolding story about God . We see Him at work in different
ages drawing those who will come to Him. It is like a rose bud opening to let us smell and see His Glory.
Spurgeon put it like this.. There is but one door to enter heaven. On the outside is written “ whosoever will” and if and when you enter and look back there written on the backside of that door is “The Elect”. This is what the Bible teaches.

[armydoc]

So we see it is not an arbitrary choosing by God, but a choosing by God based on the choice of the Sinner to seek him by faith.

A question for you:

This saving faith that you speak of, is it a gift from God or is it self-generated?

[circlecity]

You read in Context:

And not only so, but also when Rebekah had conceived children by one man, our forefather Isaac, 11 though they were not yet born and had done nothing either good or bad—in order that God’s purpose of election might continue, not because of works but because of him who calls— 12 she was told, “The older will serve the younger.” 13 As it is written, “Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.” 14 What shall we say then? Is there injustice on God’s part? By no means! 15 For he says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.” 16 So then it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, “For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you, and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.” 18 So then he has mercy on whomever he wills, and he hardens whomever he wills. Ro 9.11-18

Paul anticipated your objection and responds accordingly:

19 You will say to me then, “Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?” 20 But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me like this?” 21 Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? 22 What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, 23 in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory— (Ro 9:19–23).

[circlecity]

"There is but one door to enter heaven. On the outside is written “ whosoever will” and if and when you enter and look back there written on the backside of that door is “The Elect”. This is what the Bible teaches."

I see that as saying the only ones who "will" are the "elect" - those chosen specifically by God. Spurgeon was a devout Calvinist and his theology was reformed, he believed in predestination.

[Roman_War_Criminal]

Oh man you opened up a can of worms here with that question!

Do I work for it?
John 6:29

Or is it by Grace & free?
Ephesians 2:5-8; Acts 15:11; Romans 9:16

Just call out to him. He will answer you!
Romans 10:13; Acts 2:21

[JLLH]

Beautifully stated. Yes, election is Biblical. John 6, Romans 9, passages in Ephesians and elsewhere reiterate this undeniable Truth. Responsibility to repent and believe? Absolutely, but NEVER forget that God’s elect is just that. Salvation is of the Lord from beginning to end.

[Bob434]

it’s complicated- those that are ‘chosen’ are the ones God preknew would accept His call- apparently-

[Just mythoughts]

“before the ‘foundation of the world’” is the translation used for the Greek word, Strong's #2602: katabole (pronounced kat-ab-ol-ay’)

Usage:

This word is used 12 times:

Matthew 13:35: “I will utter things which have been kept secret from the foundation of the world.”
Matthew 25:34: “prepared for you from the foundation of the world:”
Luke 11:50: “prophets, which was shed from the foundation of the world, may be required of this”
John 17:24: “me: for thou lovedst me before”
John 17:24: “me: for thou lovedst me before”
Ephesians 1:4: “in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy”
Hebrews 4:3: “works were finished from the foundation of the world.”
Hebrews 9:26: “often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once”
Hebrews 11:11: “received strength to conceive seed, and was delivered of a child when she was past age,”
1 Peter 1:20: “Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in”
Revelation 13:8: “Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.”
Revelation 17:8: “book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast”

The elect were ‘chosen’ before Genesis 1:2... describes the katabole (pronounced kat-ab-ol-ay’) the casting down/overthrow of the Serpent.

All souls were created at the same time .. and when the ‘Serpent’ rebelled, (Isaiah 14, Ezekiel 28) some souls stood against the ‘Serpent’... and they are the elect. (today some calling themselves Christian, honor the Serpent in a Temple.)