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To: ealgeone
LOL. You can't prove that by asserting it. Not even by asserting it repeatedly!

On the other hand, the ordinary rules of evidence would support believers one earth communicating with believers in heaven, and heavenly persons acting as intercessors.

Angels, for instance: "An angel came and stood at the altar [in heaven] with a golden censer; and he was given much incense to mingle with the prayers of all the saints upon the golden altar before the throne; and the smoke of the incense rose with the prayers of the saints from the hand of the angel before God” (Rev. 8:3–4).

Jesus is the only mediator between man and God, but it's wrong to think we shouldn't ask our fellow Christians to pray for us. We do well to ask the intercession of those Christians in heaven, who are now completely sanctified, because the prayer of a righteous man "is powerful and effectual." (James 5:16).

I think the main conceptual problem people have with this, is that though they *say* they know the Christian departed are alive with God, they do not understand the implications of this, and act as though they're spiritually dead.

The Christian departed are still --- and more than ever --- members of the living Christ, and we who are in communion with Christ are in communion with them.

That's what "Communion of Saints" means. Tagline

65 posted on 10/20/2019 8:47:49 AM PDT by Mrs. Don-o (The eye can't say to the hand, I don't need you: nor can the head say to the feet, I don't need you.)
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To: Mrs. Don-o
LOL. You can't prove that by asserting it. Not even by asserting it repeatedly!

Yet that is what is evidenced in the NT.

On the other hand, the ordinary rules of evidence would support believers one earth communicating with believers in heaven, and heavenly persons acting as intercessors.

Ordinary rules of evidence? Seriously?

You have no evidence for your claim.

This is why Rome has to have a patron saint for seemingly everything much as the Roman Empire had a god/goddess for everything.

Jesus is the only mediator between man and God,

Except in Roman Catholicism where Mary has been accorded the title of Mediatrix.

but it's wrong to think we shouldn't ask our fellow Christians to pray for us. We do well to ask the intercession of those Christians in heaven, who are now completely sanctified, because the prayer of a righteous man "is powerful and effectual." (James 5:16).

And again...as evidenced in the NT these are people on earth.

The Christian departed are still --- and more than ever --- members of the living Christ, and we who are in communion with Christ are in communion with them.

Again another false assertion that somehow the prayer of a departed believer is more effective than a believer here on earth.

And what should really be of concern to the Roman Catholic is how do they even know who is or is not in Heaven.

From what I've gathered on these forums the bulk of Roman Catholics are still in purgatory.

However, all this continues to illustrate a lack of faith/trust on the part of the Roman Catholic in the words of revealed/inspired Scripture.

I think a lot of this goes back to the medieval period writings depicting Jesus as the mean ol' judge and Mary being the benevolent, caring mother.

Recall when the disciples asked Jesus to teach them to pray He instructed them to pray to the Father. Not Moses. Not Abraham. Not Mary.

Consider, as Elsie has noted before, how many prayers a day Mary would have to handle IF all of the estimated 1.3b RCs said a prayer a day.

She has to process the language of every person on earth.

She has to perfectly and accurately hear, understand and intervene for each prayer offered.

1.3 billion Catholics/86,400 seconds in a day = 15,197 prayers a second Mary has to be able to understand and answer if every Roman Catholic said one prayer a day to Mary.

Mary has been elevated to have to capabilities of the Holy Spirit. Indeed, I'd venture to say she's replaced the Holy Spirit in Roman Catholicism.

26In the same way the Spirit also helps our weakness; for we do not know how to pray as we should, but the Spirit Himself intercedes for us with groanings too deep for words; 27and He who searches the hearts knows what the mind of the Spirit is, because He intercedes for the saints according to the will of God. Romans 8:26-27

*****

Can the believer have confidence in their prayers to God?

You betcha.

Therefore let us draw near with confidence to the throne of grace, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need. Hebrews 4:16

In Him and through faith in Him we may enter God's presence with boldness and confidence. Eph 3:12

14This is the confidence which we have before Him, that, if we ask anything according to His will, He hears us. 15And if we know that He hears us in whatever we ask, we know that we have the requests which we have asked from Him. 1 John 5:14-15

66 posted on 10/20/2019 10:28:55 AM PDT by ealgeone
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To: Mrs. Don-o
In your Catholic style, you twist the following to have a duplicitous meaning: "Jesus is the only mediator between man and God (Truth), but it's wrong to think we shouldn't ask our fellow Christians to pray for us (fellow LIVING Christians). We do well to ask the intercession of those Christians in heaven (typical injecyion of a false belief as if it is truth), who are now completely sanctified, because the prayer of a righteous man "is powerful and effectual." (James 5:16)( here is exhibit A of your false teaching methodology, asserting truth then pourting in the false application ... you refer to those in heaven then quote scritpture focused upon the still in body righteous man; you are a false teacher of paganized religion).
120 posted on 10/21/2019 11:24:58 AM PDT by MHGinTN (A dispensation perspective is a powerful tool for discernment)
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