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To: FatherofFive
We have the promise of Christ - "And I say also unto you, That you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hades shall not prevail against it."

It's too bad you have chosen to NOT state what so many Early Church Fathers knew and believed.


 

As regards the oft-quoted Mt. 16:18 (And less understood)
 
 
 

Augustine, sermon:

"Christ, you see, built his Church not on a man but on Peter's confession. What is Peter's confession? 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.' There's the rock for you, there's the foundation, there's where the Church has been built, which the gates of the underworld cannot conquer.John Rotelle, O.S.A., Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine , © 1993 New City Press, Sermons, Vol III/6, Sermon 229P.1, p. 327

 

Augustine, sermon:

Upon this rock, said the Lord, I will build my Church. Upon this confession, upon this that you said, 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God,' I will build my Church, and the gates of hell shall not conquer her (Mt. 16:18). John Rotelle, Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City, 1993) Sermons, Volume III/7, Sermon 236A.3, p. 48.

 

Augustine, sermon:

For petra (rock) is not derived from Peter, but Peter from petra; just as Christ is not called so from the Christian, but the Christian from Christ. For on this very account the Lord said, 'On this rock will I build my Church,' because Peter had said, 'Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.' On this rock, therefore, He said, which thou hast confessed, I will build my Church. For the Rock (Petra) was Christ; and on this foundation was Peter himself built. For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Christ Jesus. The Church, therefore, which is founded in Christ received from Him the keys of the kingdom of heaven in the person of Peter, that is to say, the power of binding and loosing sins. For what the Church is essentially in Christ, such representatively is Peter in the rock (petra); and in this representation Christ is to be understood as the Rock, Peter as the Church. — Augustine Tractate CXXIV; Philip Schaff, Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers: First Series, Volume VII Tractate CXXIV (http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf107.iii.cxxv.html)

 

Augustine, sermon:

And Peter, one speaking for the rest of them, one for all, said, You are the Christ, the Son of the living God (Mt 16:15-16)...And I tell you: you are Peter; because I am the rock, you are Rocky, Peter-I mean, rock doesn't come from Rocky, but Rocky from rock, just as Christ doesn't come from Christian, but Christian from Christ; and upon this rock I will build my Church (Mt 16:17-18); not upon Peter, or Rocky, which is what you are, but upon the rock which you have confessed. I will build my Church though; I will build you, because in this answer of yours you represent the Church. — John Rotelle, O.S.A. Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City Press, 1993), Sermons, Volume III/7, Sermon 270.2, p. 289

 

Augustine, sermon:

Peter had already said to him, 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.' He had already heard, 'Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jona, because flesh and blood did not reveal it to you, but my Father who is in heaven. And I tell you, that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church, and the gates of the underworld shall not conquer her' (Mt 16:16-18)...Christ himself was the rock, while Peter, Rocky, was only named from the rock. That's why the rock rose again, to make Peter solid and strong; because Peter would have perished, if the rock hadn't lived. — John Rotelle, Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City, 1993) Sermons, Volume III/7, Sermon 244.1, p. 95

 

Augustine, sermon:

...because on this rock, he said, I will build my Church, and the gates of the underworld shall not overcome it (Mt. 16:18). Now the rock was Christ (1 Cor. 10:4). Was it Paul that was crucified for you? Hold on to these texts, love these texts, repeat them in a fraternal and peaceful manner. — John Rotelle, Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City Press, 1995), Sermons, Volume III/10, Sermon 358.5, p. 193

 

Augustine, Psalm LXI:

Let us call to mind the Gospel: 'Upon this Rock I will build My Church.' Therefore She crieth from the ends of the earth, whom He hath willed to build upon a Rock. But in order that the Church might be builded upon the Rock, who was made the Rock? Hear Paul saying: 'But the Rock was Christ.' On Him therefore builded we have been. — Philip Schaff, Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers (Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, 1956), Volume VIII, Saint Augustin, Exposition on the Book of Psalms, Psalm LXI.3, p. 249. (http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf108.ii.LXI.html)

 

Augustine, in “Retractions,”

In a passage in this book, I said about the Apostle Peter: 'On him as on a rock the Church was built.'...But I know that very frequently at a later time, I so explained what the Lord said: 'Thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church,' that it be understood as built upon Him whom Peter confessed saying: 'Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God,' and so Peter, called after this rock, represented the person of the Church which is built upon this rock, and has received 'the keys of the kingdom of heaven.' For, 'Thou art Peter' and not 'Thou art the rock' was said to him. But 'the rock was Christ,' in confessing whom, as also the whole Church confesses, Simon was called Peter. But let the reader decide which of these two opinions is the more probable. — The Fathers of the Church (Washington D.C., Catholic University, 1968), Saint Augustine, The Retractations Chapter 20.1:.

 

231 posted on 07/08/2019 3:17:59 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Elsie
The Church is ‘the pillar and foundation of Truth” Not a single man. The great Ecclesiastical writer Origen was never canonized because he believed in Apokatastasis.

If I am delayed, you will know how people ought to conduct themselves in God's household, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of the truth. 1 Timothy 3:15

246 posted on 07/08/2019 7:12:09 PM PDT by FatherofFive (Islam is EVIL and needs to be eradicated)
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To: Elsie; FatherofFive

We have the promise of Christ - “And I say also unto you, That you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hades shall not prevail against it.”

How many times does God have to say that He is the only rock not Peter, not the Pope, or not Mary. Well I guess for a roman catholic there is no such number.

Isaiah 44:8
Do not tremble, do not be afraid. Did I not proclaim this and foretell it long ago? You are my witnesses. Is there any God besides me? No, there is no other Rock; I know not one.”

Romans 8:33
just as it is written, “BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A STONE OF STUMBLING AND A ROCK OF OFFENSE, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED.”

1 Corinthians 10:4
and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock (4073 [e], Petras) that accompanied them, and that rock (4073 [e], Petra) was Christ.

1 Peter 2:8
and, “A stone that causes people to stumble and a rock (4073 [e], Petra) that makes them fall.” They stumble because they disobey the message—which is also what they were destined for.

Matthew 14:28
“Lord, if it’s you,” Peter (4074 [e], Petros) replied, “tell me to come to you on the water.”

Deuteronomy 32:4
He is the Rock, his works are perfect, and all his ways are just. A faithful God who does no wrong, upright and just is he.
Deuteronomy 32:15
Jeshurun grew fat and kicked; filled with food, they became heavy and sleek. They abandoned the God who made them and rejected the Rock their Savior.
Deuteronomy 32:18
You deserted the Rock, who fathered you; you forgot the God who gave you birth.
Deuteronomy 32:30
How could one man chase a thousand, or two put ten thousand to flight, unless their Rock had sold them, unless the LORD had given them up?
Deuteronomy 32:31
For their rock is not like our Rock, as even our enemies concede.
Deuteronomy 32:37
He will say: “Now where are their gods, the rock they took refuge in,
1 Samuel 2:2
“There is no one holy like the LORD; there is no one besides you; there is no Rock like our God.
2 Samuel 22:2
He said: “The LORD is my rock, my fortress and my deliverer;
2 Samuel 22:3
my God is my rock, in whom I take refuge, my shield and the horn of my salvation. He is my stronghold, my refuge and my savior— from violent people you save me.
2 Samuel 22:32
For who is God besides the LORD? And who is the Rock except our God?
2 Samuel 22:47
“The LORD lives! Praise be to my Rock! Exalted be my God, the Rock, my Savior!
2 Samuel 23:3
The God of Israel spoke, the Rock of Israel said to me: ‘When one rules over people in righteousness, when he rules in the fear of God,
Psalm 18:2
The LORD is my rock, my fortress and my deliverer; my God is my rock, in whom I take refuge, my shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold.
Psalm 18:31
For who is God besides the LORD? And who is the Rock except our God?
Psalm 18:46
The LORD lives! Praise be to my Rock! Exalted be God my Savior!
Psalm 19:14
May these words of my mouth and this meditation of my heart be pleasing in your sight, LORD, my Rock and my Redeemer.
Psalm 28:1
Of David. To you, LORD, I call; you are my Rock, do not turn a deaf ear to me. For if you remain silent, I will be like those who go down to the pit.
Psalm 31:2
Turn your ear to me, come quickly to my rescue; be my rock of refuge, a strong fortress to save me.
Psalm 31:3
Since you are my rock and my fortress, for the sake of your name lead and guide me.
Psalm 42:9
I say to God my Rock, “Why have you forgotten me? Why must I go about mourning, oppressed by the enemy?”
Psalm 62:2
Truly he is my rock and my salvation; he is my fortress, I will never be shaken.
Psalm 62:6
Truly he is my rock and my salvation; he is my fortress, I will not be shaken.
Psalm 62:7
My salvation and my honor depend on God; he is my mighty rock, my refuge.
Psalm 71:3
Be my rock of refuge, to which I can always go; give the command to save me, for you are my rock and my fortress.
Psalm 78:35
They remembered that God was their Rock, that God Most High was their Redeemer.
Psalm 89:26
He will call out to me, ‘You are my Father, my God, the Rock my Savior.’
Psalm 92:15
proclaiming, “The LORD is upright; he is my Rock, and there is no wickedness in him.”
Psalm 94:22
But the LORD has become my fortress, and my God the rock in whom I take refuge.
Psalm 95:1
Come, let us sing for joy to the LORD; let us shout aloud to the Rock of our salvation.
Psalm 144:1
Of David. Praise be to the LORD my Rock, who trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle.
Isaiah 8:14
He will be a holy place; for both Israel and Judah he will be a stone that causes people to stumble and a rock that makes them fall. And for the people of Jerusalem he will be a trap and a snare.
Isaiah 17:10
You have forgotten God your Savior; you have not remembered the Rock, your fortress. Therefore, though you set out the finest plants and plant imported vines,
Isaiah 26:4
Trust in the LORD forever, for the LORD, the LORD himself, is the Rock eternal.
Isaiah 30:29
And you will sing as on the night you celebrate a holy festival; your hearts will rejoice as when people playing pipes go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the Rock of Israel.
Isaiah 44:8
Do not tremble, do not be afraid. Did I not proclaim this and foretell it long ago? You are my witnesses. Is there any God besides me? No, there is no other Rock; I know not one.”
Isaiah 51:1
“Listen to me, you who pursue righteousness and who seek the LORD: Look to the rock from which you were cut and to the quarry from which you were hewn;

Habakkuk 1:12
LORD, are you not from everlasting? My God, my Holy One, you will never die. You, LORD, have appointed them to execute judgment; you, my Rock, have ordained them to punish.


250 posted on 07/08/2019 9:03:14 PM PDT by mrobisr
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