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To: boatbums
So, what was the Lord doing? Coming to Earth, no round trip to come back later again. So the Lord kept coming to Earth. And no secret coming - that horn/trumpet sounding was the seventh and last trumpet blown at the end of the Tribulation as He comes back - the second time as the Conquering Messiah.

I didn't have to scream and shout in bold you may have noticed)

109 posted on 07/02/2019 6:15:46 AM PDT by SkyDancer ( ~ Just Consider Me A Random Fact Generator ~ Eat Sleep Fly Repeat ~)
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To: SkyDancer
So, what was the Lord doing? Coming to Earth, no round trip to come back later again. So the Lord kept coming to Earth. And no secret coming - that horn/trumpet sounding was the seventh and last trumpet blown at the end of the Tribulation as He comes back - the second time as the Conquering Messiah.

1Co 15:52  In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 

This is the last trump of the trumpet, not the last trumpet...The last trump will be at the end of the Tribulation...This trump will be before the Tribulation starts...

1Th 4:16  For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 
1Th 4:17  Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 

You might notice that in the book of Revelation the church is no longer mentioned after the last verse in chapter 3 and doesn't pick up again til chapter 19...And what do we see at the 1st verse of chapter 4??? It's not a brass section...

Rev 4:1  After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.  Rev 4:2  And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne. 

There was no trumpet...It was a voice, speaking words, as loud as a trumpet...

The voice of God calling out to Christians to come up hither when the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled...A picture of the Rapture of the church...

114 posted on 07/02/2019 9:46:58 AM PDT by Iscool
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To: SkyDancer
So, what was the Lord doing? Coming to Earth, no round trip to come back later again. So the Lord kept coming to Earth. And no secret coming - that horn/trumpet sounding was the seventh and last trumpet blown at the end of the Tribulation as He comes back - the second time as the Conquering Messiah. I didn't have to scream and shout in bold you may have noticed)

We should always be ready to answer those who question why we believe what we do and our answers should be given in gentleness and respect. I'm sure you have arrived at your conclusions on this subject through careful study and so have I. It's no skin off my nose if someone doesn't see things the same as I do but I do have reasons for why I believe as I do.

As for Jesus' appearing (coming to earth) I'm sure you have heard of the term "theophany". It's a visible manifestation to humankind of God. The Old Testament is rife with instances of theophanies (e.g., Adam, Eve, Abraham, Jacob, Moses, etc.). These are some of them from Scripture https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/Theophany. There are instances when God appeared in human form before the incarnation or in a way that is tangible to the human senses.

Even after Jesus ascended back to heaven after His resurrection, we are told of times where He did manifest Himself to individuals. For example, the first Christian martyr Stephan when he was being stoned:

    But Stephen, full of the Holy Spirit, looked intently into heaven and saw the glory of God and Jesus standing at the right hand of God. “Look,” he said, “I see heaven open and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God.” (Acts 7:55,56)

Paul spoke about Jesus blinding him on the road to Damascus and hearing His voice and also told of an experience where Jesus taught him personally (see II Cor. 12:2-4). The Apostle John also spoke of seeing Jesus in Revelation 1. So, there HAVE been times where Jesus appeared to people after His incarnation and resurrection and they did not count as THE Second Coming. Jesus told His followers that He was going to prepare a place for them, "And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will take you to myself, that where I am you may be also." (John 14:3). It is these verses as well as the ones Paul wrote to the churches that in addition to the Old Testament prophecies convinced me there WILL be a rapture, a "catching up" of those who remain on the earth to deliver from the Time of Jacob's Trouble - the Tribulation. The Bride of Christ is spared from enduring Almighty God's wrath poured out upon the ungodly and unbelieving world prior to Jesus' triumphant return as the Conquering Messiah.

Finally, we agree on the major things and those are worth defending strenuously. If it turns out there is no Rapture of the church, then I will endure whatever God has planned because I know I am His child and Jesus Christ is my Deliverer and Redeemer. If there is a Rapture, then you, my friend will rejoice along with me I'm sure.

119 posted on 07/02/2019 8:35:58 PM PDT by boatbums (semper reformanda secundum verbum dei)
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