Posted on 08/03/2018 9:55:47 PM PDT by unlearner
LEXINGTON, Kentucky, Pro-homosexual dissident 'Catholic' groups see in Pope Francis' ‘changing’ of the Church’s teaching on the death penalty the hope that the Church will one day also change its teaching against homosexuality.
New Ways Ministry called the change in the Catechism proof that "Church teaching can change."
"It's important for Catholic advocates for LGBT equality to take note of this change because for decades Catholic opponents of LGBT equality argued that it is impossible to change church teaching. They often pointed to the fact that condemnations of same-sex relationships were inscribed in the Catechism, and so were not open for discussion or change. Yet, the teaching on the death penalty is in the Catechism, too, and, in fact, to make this change in teaching, it was the text of the Catechism that Francis changed," the group stated on its website.
New Ways Ministry, which works to "promote the acceptance of LGBT people," said that Pope Francis' move will help advance "LGBT equality" in a number of ways.
"First, we now have a clear, explicit contemporary example of church teaching changing, and also a look into how it can be done: with a papal change to the Catechism," it stated.
"Second, we can see that the process that brought about this change has been decades of theological debate and discussion, and not just a papal whim. That means the theological and even ecclesial discussions and debates right now about LGBT people have great potential to shape future changes in church teaching in regard to those topics," it added.
The pro-gay group was not the only one to see the significance of Pope Francis' rewrite of the Catechism.
In a post that appeared yesterday on Twitter, Lexington-based “Fortunate Families” wrote:
The church cannot change its teaching. That is what so many others say about other topics, for example regarding LGBTQ persons. But doctrine develops. Today’s news is a sterling example.
"The idea first floated by [the] Pope on Catechism’s 25th anniversary last fall to signify development of doctrine,” the tweet continued, “rescript issued today sees Francis issue edit of the 1994 official text, now deeming capital punishment ‘inadmissible’-- the new formulation.”
“Development of doctrine”, legitimately used to describe how the Catholic Church refines and expands, but never undermines or rejects, what was taught earlier, has now been interpreted by some to mean the erasure of settled Church teaching.
Critics say Pope Francis attempted to do that yesterday when he promulgated a new teaching concerning the death penalty in the Catechism of the Catholic Church, saying that it was “inadmissible.” The perennial teaching of the Church, based on Scripture and unanimously accepted by the Church Fathers and every pope until Francis, is that legitimate civil authority may impose the death penalty on a malefactor. Although both Saint John Paul II and Benedict XVI were strongly opposed to capital punishment--and John Paul’s Catechism strongly circumscribed it--neither pope denied this principle.
Pope Francis’ innovation has already become a club for American liberals to beat conservatives with. Jane Fleming Kleeb, Chair of the Democratic Party in Nebraska, has tweeted “Let's be clear Nebraskans, @GovRicketts is going against the teachings of the church. We can change leaders by voting different on Nov. 6--Democrats are against the death penalty.”
Fortunate Families, founded in 1992 by Mary Ellen and Casey Lopata, the Catholic parents of a same-sex attracted man, is a group of Catholic religious and laypeople who dissent on authentic Church teaching regarding sexuality and marriage. From 2010 until this July Fortunate Families was part of a coalition with Call to Action, the banned Dignity, and the censured New Ways ministry.
Astonishingly, since November 2017 Bishop John Stowe, OFM of Lexington has served as the dissident group’s “ecclesial advisor”. Stowe is one of the five bishops who have endorsed Fr. James Martin’s pro-LGBT book Building a Bridge. The bishop was appointed to the Lexington diocese by Pope Francis in 2015.
Fortunate Families was last in the news when a Lexington Catholic church stretched an LGBT flag across its front lawn. The first executive director of the group, Stan “JR” Zerkowski, is a parishioner at St. Paul’s parish, and told media that he hoped the banner got wide publicity.
“This is a church that is open to all people and I hope this sign gets that across,” he said in the TV report. “I don’t think a Catholic Church has ever had a sign like this before in front of it during Pride Week or any other time. However, in other parts of the country we see this regularly.”
The banner read “LBGTQ+ Catholic /Family, Friends & Allies/all are welcome”, insinuating that at other Catholic churches Catholics who experience same-sex desires or suffer from gender dysphoria are barred from the worship of God.
Former homosexual Joseph Sciambra retweeted the group’s Twitter message, saying “Bishop Stowe’s ‘Fortunate Families’ believe that the [Catechism of the Catholic Church] will also ‘change’ in terms of homosexuality. FF operatives are embedded within several dioceses around the US.”
Sciambra, a survivor of the San Francisco 1990s “gay scene”, is dedicated to helping people with same-sex attractions avoid being trapped in what he says is a dangerous way of life.
You can easily do that, however, depending on the topic I may not post to it. But it won't stop the internecine "battles" on such a thread. I've even been accused of not being a Christian just because I wear a scapular. More than one "christian" on FR has claimed Catholics are not even Christians.
The full title of this article was:
"LGBT ‘Catholic’ groups: If Pope can reverse Church teaching on death penalty, why not homosexuality?"
I don't know why any non-catholic Christian who does not recognize the papal office to be so concerned about what this pope says.
There's a reason for caucuses.
Dominus tecum
If you are counting on a piece of cloth to deliver you.....then no. You are not a follower of Christ. You’ve abandoned the Gospel for another false gospel.
The NT is clear we are only saved through faith in Christ and Christ alone....no one or nothing else.
I asked you a question last night.......will you trust in Christ, and only Christ for your salvation?
The stakes are eternity in Heaven or Hell.
What say you?
You said, "I’m not going to continue to debate this with you, but it’s obvious to anyone who can understand proper reading comprehension that you are wrong about my statement" in you post #242.
I responded with post #246.
You bit on the bait.
Awaiting your answer to my question.
That's your opinion; I don't agree with it though.
I’m not going to bother to look those up.
If you want me to see a post, make it a link.
I stopped debating it with you.
Are you going to call me a liar again?
Get back with the subject of the thread.
Lazy.
When did I call you a liar?
Go through your posts and you will find it more than once.
“I don’t know why any non-catholic Christian who does not recognize the papal office to be so concerned about what this pope says.”
As a Christian, I do not see myself as being bound by the authority of the Pope because I do not think he meets the Biblical criteria for apostleship. However, I recognize that millions of observant Catholics do recognize his authority.
Even though I am unpersuaded by the argument of apostolic succession or that there is an absolute continuity of doctrine in the Catholic Church, I do understand that this is a major argument that Catholics have for their commitment to their Church.
And Protestants and Catholics on this forum generally agree on abortion, homosexuality, and the death penalty.
If we could get Catholics and Protestants to ALL agree and refuse to support any politicians who hold other views, we could cooperatively right a lot of the wrongs in this nation, I believe.
It is alarming to me that the world’s largest Christian denomination is drifting away from social conservatism. And I did not think it was possible for official Catholic doctrines to be changed. But that appears to be the case.
Why didn't you have those "supposed" posts deleted?
That's my point, it seems you don't consider Catholics to be Christians.
Who here remembers the good ole days?
Abuse of Caucus [whiner’s caucus]
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2678253/posts
And this should go down in FReperdom history.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2678253/posts?page=574#574
In The Forum
(To the tune of “In The Ghetto” by Elvis Presley)
As the guano flies
On a cold and gray Chicago mornin’
A poor little newbie handle is born
In the Forum
Will the liberal moan?
if there’s one thing that he don’t need
an objective set of morals that he won’t heed
In the Forum
People, don’t you understand
this country needs a helping hand
or we’ll wake up Socialist some day
Read your Bible every day
“Do not steal” means what it says
will you simply turn your heads
and look the other way?
Well the thread turns cold
and the whiny little boy with the turned-up nose
he types with his feet, and his argument blows
In the Forum
And his anger burns
so he starts to roam the boards at night
and he learns how to covet
and he learns how to fight
In the Forum
Then one night in desperation
this FReeper man goes awry
He spams the threads, tries to break some hearts
bends the truth, but he don’t get far
And makes Jesus cry
As the crowd gathers ‘round, the angry young man
makes a home in the gutter, throwing temper tantrums
In the Forum
And the young man cries
on a cold and gray Chicago mornin’,
another little newbie handle is born
In the Forum
Elsie and Mark, you have your work cut out for you.
That set the bar pretty high.
My apologies.
I thought I had everyone pinged to this post and I missed you.
Ping to post 334.
I’d rather leave them up for posterity.
Like this thread, showing the depravity of Catholic leadership, it’s good to have documented.
Thank you for bringing this to the light!
In others words, you are unable to prove I ever called you a liar.
How apropos, thanks
Oh I could, and already have several times.
You just compounded the lies by spinning it to make it look like you didn’t lie.
No prob, carry on it’s documented quite well.
This thread is very telling. The pope changes what ever he wants, soon homosexuality will be legal in Catholicism above board instead of hidden like it *somewhat* is now.
Popes no different than any other Pastoral leader that goes off track...they start setting rules and remove what doesn’t suit their personal agenda.
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