Posted on 06/02/2018 6:34:56 AM PDT by Salvation
I know...I was surprised at the NASB rendering. Explains why we need to have the Greek at our disposal.
You’re saying the Holy Spirit messed things up when He was moving Paul to write his letters.
There are some things you like and things you don`t like which is proven by the way you twist it all up there are some cold hard facts which you are afraid to consider so you ignore the scripture.
No, i did not say the holy spirit messed anything up, making things up again are you?
Read the New Testament. You will not find Paul or any of the Apostles referring to themselves as Father ______.
Run along and play somewhere. As I said....you’re out of your league.
Run along and play somewhere. As I said....you’re out of your league.
You may be right, believing what Jesus said is pretty unpopular and i don`t know how to deny everything he said like you do.
Also, in the Vulgate it says:
nam si decem milia pedagogorum habeatis in Christo sed non multos patres nam in Christo Iesu per evangelium ego vos genui
Which roughly translated says:
for if you have tens of thousands of teachers in Christ but not many fathers for in Christ Jesus through the gospel I have begotten you
It is interesting to note that we have an English Bible in spite of the RCC, who wanted to keep it only in Latin and initially killed those who would print it in the native languages.
It is interesting to note that we have an English Bible in spite of the RCC, who wanted to keep it only in Latin and initially killed those who would print it in the native languages.
The NIV
Even if you had ten thousand guardians in Christ, you do not have many fathers, for in Christ Jesus I became your father through the gospel.
So it appears to me that Paul could possibly have been the first father in the Church that later became the Catholic Church.
I don`t know but if they are reading what Paul says and ignoring what Jesus said i can see where they have their reason.
The simple point is that in the Greek, in the Vulgate, and in the KJV, it plainly says “I have begotten you”, not “I became your father.”
But in either rendering, Paul is talking about an event, not an honorific.
“I have begotten you”, not “I became your father.”
Again, in either rendering, Paul is not talking about an honorific title.
Again, in either rendering, Paul is not talking about an honorific title.
The Protestants claim Jesus did not say Simon would be called a rock but there are also over a billion Catholics and no doubt millions of Protestants who think of him as the rock or call him the rock.
So regardless of the reason Paul said it that is what we have.
By that logic, 1 billion moslems believing that Mohammed is the prophet must be true as well.
The Protestants claim Jesus did not say Simon would be called a rock but there are also over a billion Catholics and no doubt millions of Protestants who think of him as the rock or call him the rock.
I think this is a gross mischaracterization of what other have said. Peter is "a Rock," not "THE Rock," which is Christ, the Son of the Living God.
“The passage contains the feminine word, ‘petra.’”
Cephas means rock, i think Jesus understood what he was saying, and changing the word after the fact does not change the meaning.
I think this is a gross mischaracterization of what other have said. Peter is “a Rock,” not “THE Rock,”
The fact that it was written in Greek does not change what Jesus had already said.
“By that logic, 1 billion moslems believing that Mohammed is the prophet must be true as well.”
It is true that they believe it,Yes.
Jesus said you shall be called a rock and he was.
My argument is not if Simon barjona was the rock or not but that he was called a rock, even by Paul, Cephas means rock.
JESUS IS NOT A LIAR..
I don’t have a problem with Simon being call Petros/Cephas/Peter, because that is plain in scripture. The thing I object to is he is not The Rock of the church. That is Christ, and Christ alone.
The Eastern Orthodox do not see the Bishop of Rome, who (supposedly) sits in the seat of Peter, as having primacy over the church. That is purely a Roman catholic distinctive.
That is purely a Roman catholic distinctive.
Mathew 20:25, 26 , 27
25 But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Ye know that the princes of the Gentiles exercise dominion over them, and they that are great exercise authority upon them.
26 But it shall not be so among you: but whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister;
27 And whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant:
The reason Jesus called Simon Cephas is because he knew that Simon would take the lead, and Simon did take the lead but that did not give him authority over the others.
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