Posted on 01/11/2018 6:54:52 PM PST by Salvation
Sorry I veered off the topic, Benedict at least stuck to doctrine.
Francis has not just left the reservation, he’s setting it on fire.
People come to God through Jesus.
People don’t need to go through anything to get to Jesus.
Thanks for the tip.
Apologies not necessary. I am interested in hearing your story. When you say “the Church has never been the same” (since your traditional priest retired), what are you referring to?
Why? Have you ex-communicated yourselves?
Peter – rock
Matthew 16:18 - http://bible.cc/matthew/16-18.htm
Jesus said that Peter was *petros*(masculine) and that on this *petra*(feminine) He would build His church.
Greek: 4074 Pétros (a masculine noun) – properly, a stone (pebble), such as a small rock found along a pathway. 4074 /Pétros (”small stone”) then stands in contrast to 4073 /pétra (”cliff, boulder,” Abbott-Smith).
“4074 (Pétros) is an isolated rock and 4073 (pétra) is a cliff” (TDNT, 3, 100). “4074 (Pétros) always means a stone . . . such as a man may throw, . . . versus 4073 (pétra), a projecting rock, cliff” (S. Zodhiates, Dict).
4073 pétra (a feminine noun) – “a mass of connected rock,” which is distinct from 4074 (Pétros) which is “a detached stone or boulder” (A-S). 4073 (pétra) is a “solid or native rock, rising up through the earth” (Souter) – a huge mass of rock (a boulder), such as a projecting cliff.
4073 (petra) is “a projecting rock, cliff (feminine noun) . . . 4074 (petros, the masculine form) however is a stone . . . such as a man might throw” (S. Zodhiates, Dict).
It’s also a strange way to word the sentence that He would call Peter a rock and say that on this I will build my church instead of *on you* as would be grammatically correct in talking to a person.
There is no support from the original Greek that Peter was to be the rock on which Jesus said he would build His church. The nouns are not the same, one being masculine and the other being feminine. They denote different objects.
Also, here, Paul identifies who petra is, and that is Christ. This link takes you to the Greek.
http://biblehub.com/text/1_corinthians/10-4.htm
1 Corinthians 10:1-4 For I do not want you to be unaware, brothers, that our fathers were all under the cloud, and all passed through the sea, and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea, and all ate the same spiritual food, and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank from the spiritual Rock (petra) that followed them, and the Rock (petra) was Christ.
http://biblehub.com/text/romans/9-33.htm
Romans 9:30-33 What shall we say, then? That Gentiles who did not pursue righteousness have attained it, that is, a righteousness that is by faith; but that Israel who pursued a law that would lead to righteousness did not succeed in reaching that law. Why? Because they did not pursue it by faith, but as if it were based on works. They have stumbled over the stumbling stone, as it is written,“Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone of stumbling, and a rock (petra) of offense; and whoever believes in him will not be put to shame.”
http://biblehub.com/text/1_peter/2-8.htm
1 Peter 2:1-8 So put away all malice and all deceit and hypocrisy and envy and all slander. Like newborn infants, long for the pure spiritual milk, that by it you may grow up into salvation— if indeed you have tasted that the Lord is good.
As you come to him, a living stone rejected by men but in the sight of God chosen and precious, you yourselves like living stones are being built up as a spiritual house, to be a holy priesthood, to offer spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. For it stands in Scripture: “Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone, a cornerstone chosen and precious, and whoever believes in him will not be put to shame.”
So the honor is for you who believe, but for those who do not believe,
“The stone that the builders rejected has become the cornerstone,”
and
“A stone of stumbling, and a rock (petra) of offense.”
They stumble because they disobey the word, as they were destined to do.
All occurrences of *petra* in the Greek.
Well, I think Mary was blessed among women, and deserves respect. Beyond that, she was a sinner, saved by faith, and went on to have a bunch of kids. I believe it was her son James, not Peter, who was the head of the Jerusalem church. 👍😁🇵🇭
The loss of the old liturgy and the Latin Mass.
Because none of us can be virgin, free from sin, and mother of God.
While SOME may attain the virgin part, the rest is not within anyone's ability.
Besides, Jesus said to follow HIM, not to follow His mother.
But Catholics keep telling us that *God can do whatever He wants*.
Now you're saying He can't?
Not surprised.
If it’s only a matter of the Latin Mass, why wouldn’t you seek out a parish that offers the Latin Mass?
Now, now, they need safe spaces...
Obviously......
And who makes the determination if they are good enough?
You know, the title makes no sense in terms of the article.
It has nothing to do with it.
If someone is going to return to the church, there’s no *strategy* about it.
You walk into the nearest Catholic church and go to confession and communion, and viola, you’re back.
And likely, they never even knew you were gone, just like the Catholic church I went to growing up. It was so big that no doubt they had a roster, but I rarely saw the same priest twice. They came and went constantly. They didn’t know you from Adam.
The article is more about strategies for getting people back into the church.
Well, once you’re dead, it’s not hard. Some self-appointed group that runs the show does that.
If you’re living, then nobody is good enough.
If they were, they’d know if they were going to heaven. Since they don’t know, that is a defacto admission that they are not.
Otherwise, some self-appointed holier-than-thou-FRoman Catholic can always tell you.
“So it is unusual, to say the least.”
Unusual, but not unheard of, not unprecedented, and not invalid. Thus, who resigned as pope before Pope Francis became pope has no bearing on the validity of Pope Francis’ pontificate. All that matters is that Pope Benedict validly resigned, and Francis was validly elected. That’s what happened. That’s the reality of things.
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