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Those Blasted Presbyterians: Reflections on Independence Day
Don Sweeting ^ | 4 July 2014 | Don Sweeting

Posted on 07/04/2017 11:09:29 AM PDT by Gamecock

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1 posted on 07/04/2017 11:09:29 AM PDT by Gamecock
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To: drstevej; OrthodoxPresbyterian; CCWoody; Wrigley; Gamecock; Jean Chauvin; jboot; AZhardliner; ...
And a happy Presbyterian Rebellion Day to all of you!

GRPL PING

2 posted on 07/04/2017 11:13:04 AM PDT by Gamecock ("We always choose according to our greatest inclination at the moment." R.C. Sproul)
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To: Gamecock

It was predestined and foreordained!

Add TULIP to MAGA and COVFEFE.


3 posted on 07/04/2017 11:29:18 AM PDT by kaehurowing
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To: Gamecock
Thanks. Profound. Sad to see that much of Presbyterianism has gone South, no longer looking to Scripture as literally being the word of God and supreme standard.

Vanishing Christianity - A Lesson from the Presbyterians - Albert Mohler

Presbyterians Become the Silly Church | The American Spectator

And the church overall and country is far past the early sanctity in which men were sufficiently controlled from within that they need not be controlled from without by a large pervasive government, elected by people who lacked Biblical wisdom and reverence.

Alexis de Tocqueville (1805—1859. French political thinker and historian; best known for his two volume, “Democracy in America”) The sects that exist in the United States are innumerable. They all differ in respect to the worship which is due to the Creator; but they all agree in respect to the duties which are due from man to man. Each sect adores the Deity in its own peculiar manner, but all sects preach the same moral law in the name of God...Moreover, all the sects of the United States are comprised within the great unity of Christianity, and Christian morality is everywhere the same...

In the United States the sovereign authority is religious, and consequently hypocrisy must be common; but there is no country in the whole world in which the Christian religion retains a greater influence over the souls of men than in America, and there can be no greater proof of its utility, and of its conformity to human nature, than that its influence is most powerfully felt over the most enlightened and free nation of the earth...

There is certainly no country in the world where the tie of marriage is more respected than in America or where conjugal happiness is more highly or worthily appreciated, In Europe almost all the disturbances of society arise from the irregularities of domestic life. To despise the natural bonds and legitimate pleasures of home is to contract a taste for excesses, a restlessness of heart, and fluctuating desires. Agitated by the tumultuous passions that frequently disturb his dwelling, the European is galled by the obedience which the legislative powers of the state exact. But when the American retires from the turmoil of public life to the bosom of his family, he finds in it the image of order and of peace...

The Americans combine the notions of Christianity and of liberty so intimately in their minds, that it is impossible to make them conceive the one without the other; and with them this conviction does not spring from that barren traditionary faith which seems to vegetate in the soul rather than to live...

Thus religious zeal is perpetually warmed in the United States by the fires of patriotism. These men do not act exclusively from a consideration of a future life; eternity is only one motive of their devotion to the cause. If you converse with these missionaries of Christian civilization, you will be surprised to hear them speak so often of the goods of this world, and to meet a politician where you expected to find a priest.

They will tell you that "all the American republics are collectively involved with each other; if the republics of the West were to fall into anarchy, or to be mastered by a despot, the republican institutions which now flourish upon the shores of the Atlantic Ocean would be in great peril. It is therefore our interest that the new states should be religious, in order that they may permit us to remain free." (Democracy in America, Volume I Chapter XVII, 1835; http://xroads.virginia.edu/~HYPER/DETOC/religion/ch1_17.htm)

There are certain populations in Europe whose unbelief is only equaled by their ignorance and their debasement, while in America one of the freest and most enlightened nations in the world fulfills all the outward duties of religion with fervor.

Upon my arrival in the United States, the religious aspect of the country was the first thing that struck my attention; and the longer I stayed there, the more did I perceive the great political consequences resulting from this state of things, to which I was unaccustomed. In France I had almost always seen the spirit of religion and the spirit of freedom pursuing courses diametrically opposed to each other; but in America I found that they were intimately united, and that they reigned in common over the same country. (Democracy in America, [New York: A. S. Barnes & Co., 1851), pp. 331, 332, 335, 336-7, 337; http://xroads.virginia.edu/~HYPER/DETOC/religion/ch1_17.htm)

A quote often attributed to Tocqueville but which is not documented by any early sources, states,

Not until I went into the churches of American and heard her pulpits flame with righteousness did I understand the secret of her genius and power. America is great because America is good, and if America ever ceases to be good, America will cease to be great.”

Benjamin Franklin (1706—1790. One of the Founding Fathers; leading thinker; author; printer; statesman; postmaster; diplomat, and a non-Christian deist)...serious religion, under its various denominations, is not only tolerated, but respected and practiced. Atheism is unknown there; Infidelity rare and secret; so that persons may live to a great age in that country without having their piety shocked by meeting with either an Atheist or an Infidel. And the Divine Being seems to have manifested His approbation of the mutual forbearance and kindness by which the different sects treat each other, and by the remarkable prosperity with which He has been please to favor the whole country. (Benjamin Franklin, "Information to those who would Remove to America" In Franklin, Benjamin. The Bagatelles from Passy. Ed. Lopez, Claude A. New York: Eakins Press. 1967; http://mith.umd.edu//eada/html/display.php?docs=franklin_bagatelle4.xml. Also, John Gould Curtis, American history told by contemporaries .... Volume 3, p. 26)

4 posted on 07/04/2017 11:30:02 AM PDT by daniel1212 (Trust the risen Lord Jesus to save you as a damned and destitute sinner + be baptized + folllow Him)
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To: daniel1212; redleghunter; Springfield Reformer; kinsman redeemer; BlueDragon; metmom; boatbums; ...

See above


5 posted on 07/04/2017 11:31:48 AM PDT by daniel1212 (Trust the risen Lord Jesus to save you as a damned and destitute sinner + be baptized + folllow Him)
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To: kaehurowing

I’m not a Calvinist myself, but I’ll certainly give credit where it’s due.


6 posted on 07/04/2017 11:34:14 AM PDT by Luircin
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To: Gamecock

Walpole’s letter to the Countess of Ossory August 3, 1775 actually has it as:

“one has griefs enough of one’s own, without fretting because Cousin America has eloped with a Presbyterian parson”

He might have said something similar earlier, but I would note that he only served in Parliament 1741-1768. And that appears to be a bit early to be commenting on the American Revolution. At the time of the Revolution, his seat was held by his cousin, Thomas Walpole. The seat was later held by Thomas’s son, also named Horatio Walpole.


7 posted on 07/04/2017 11:34:36 AM PDT by PAR35
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To: Gamecock

“Scotch or Scotch-Irish origin,”

Idiot.


8 posted on 07/04/2017 11:41:07 AM PDT by crz
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To: Gamecock

It is likely that a lot of the Scots and Scotch/Irish were rednecks. (Freedom loving Scottish dissidents)

The origins of this term Redneck are Scottish and refer to supporters of the National Covenant and The Solemn League and Covenant, or “Covenanters”, largely Lowland Presbyterians, many of whom would flee Scotland for Ulster (Northern Ireland) during persecutions by the British Crown. The Covenanters of 1638 and 1641 signed the documents that stated that Scotland desired the Presbyterian form of church government and would not accept the Church of England as its official state church.

Many Covenanters signed in their own blood and wore red pieces of cloth around their necks as distinctive insignia; hence the term “Red neck”, (rednecks) which became slang for a Scottish dissenter*. One Scottish immigrant, interviewed by the author, remembered a Presbyterian minister, one Dr. Coulter, in Glasgow in the 1940’s wearing a red clerical collar — is this symbolic of the “rednecks”?

Since many Ulster-Scottish settlers in America (especially the South) were Presbyterian, the term was applied to them, and then, later, their Southern descendants. One of the earliest examples of its use comes from 1830, when an author noted that “red-neck” was a “name bestowed upon the Presbyterians.”


9 posted on 07/04/2017 11:43:39 AM PDT by Revolutionary ("Praise the Lord and Pass the Ammunition!")
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To: Revolutionary

You are correct about “rednecks.” The term began to mutate in the early 1900s when socialist “progressives” who were pushing a form of “social justice” Christianity without God mocked those who believed in the Bible as ignorant, backwards “rednecks.” The battle culminated in the Left’s takeover in the early 1900s of the Presbyterian Church and the purge from Princeton seminary of Christian professors.

The purged professors had been advocating that socialist views had to be rejected and that the Church had to return to the “fundamentals” as set forth in the Bible. Those purged from the Presbyterian church by the Socialists were also disparagingly called “fundamentalists,” so that is where that term came from as one being used to denigrate Christians.

The descendants of those leftists pretty much gained complete control of all the mainline denominations by the 1950s and 1960s, and you can see the results today.


10 posted on 07/04/2017 12:08:44 PM PDT by kaehurowing
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To: kaehurowing

I have another term for “blasted” at least as applies to the PCUSA!


11 posted on 07/04/2017 12:17:00 PM PDT by Bonemaker
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To: Gamecock

Quite good....and true!

And of course, our awesome President Trump was nurtured by a Scottish ( John Knox / Calvinistic Presbyterian ) mother!


12 posted on 07/04/2017 12:38:18 PM PDT by Guenevere
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To: crz

“Idiot”

Absolutely not!


13 posted on 07/04/2017 12:40:55 PM PDT by Guenevere
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To: Bonemaker

PC U SA have sadly departed their roots and the faith.


14 posted on 07/04/2017 12:42:26 PM PDT by Guenevere
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To: Gamecock

Article reads...”Most American Christians are unaware of the fact that the American Revolution, as well as the new American state, was greatly shaped by Presbyterians and the Calvinism that was at its root. Some modern-day Presbyterians have moved light years away from the convictions of these early colonists.”......

Most of them have moved away from those convictions....those who still have them have left that church....or at the least remain to fight to bring it back.


15 posted on 07/04/2017 12:55:24 PM PDT by caww
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To: kaehurowing
...."An absolute liberty. It is always to be lived out under the sovereign creator God. It was this theology, a theology rooted, not just in Calvin, but in the Bible, which ultimately gave the colonialist the will to resist."....


16 posted on 07/04/2017 1:08:04 PM PDT by caww
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To: Guenevere

Absolutely YES.

Scotch? Do you have any idea how stupid that is?

That is offensive thing there is about that people.

Appears you havent a clue either.


17 posted on 07/04/2017 1:21:11 PM PDT by crz
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To: Gamecock

Sadly the PCUSA has gone Unitarian and apostate in practice.


18 posted on 07/04/2017 1:28:14 PM PDT by ckilmer (q e)
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To: Guenevere

Here, let me educate you.

Scotch is a drink-Whisky, or it is a game that is played, or a type of candy.

Scot is a ethnic group-most came from Ireland-at least the true Scotti Irish.

Scot-Scottish-Scotsman/women. Scotland is a country attached to the UK. Also a very socialist country attached to the UK. The reason they are Socialists is because the GD English made them that way when the crown/nobility managed to destroy the true Scotland-hence, every time the English say day, the Scots will say night. Also a very unruly group.

The Scots remember the great highland clearances when the English cleared the commoners off the land for sheep, mostly by violent means, and left many of them to die of starvation although there was vast amounts of grain that could have been distributed to save those folks. AND THE KIRK WAS LARGELY involved along with the nobility. Why? Because the Kirk was the center for registration for the parishes.

Same with the Irish and the potato famine-which also hit in Scotland when the clearances were going on.


19 posted on 07/04/2017 1:36:45 PM PDT by crz
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To: crz; Guenevere

>> Scotch is a drink-Whisky, or it is a game that is played, or a type of candy <<

It’s also what us “ignorant redneck” Southerners have long called people from Scotland. I’ve heard the word from my neighbors over and over again for the past 70 years. Get over it.


20 posted on 07/04/2017 3:30:17 PM PDT by Hawthorn
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