>>” And they must serve with derived authority, living totally under the written Scripture and its final authority.”<<
The written Sacred scripture is not enough. We have seen what happens when the papacy is ignored by Protestants. Everyone becomes their own pope and interprets the same scriptures by their own partial understanding, leading to massive disputes and misunderstandings. Every human organization requires an accountable leader. in addition to scripture, we must learn the practices of the early Christian community (for the first 300+ years when there was no written bible), which the Catholic church calls the Sacred Tradition of Christ’s church. Others may look to Luther, Calvin, or King Henry, etc. for their proper understanding of the Sacred scriptures. But I look to Jesus Christ, the Apostles, and the church they created for my understanding. I pray that Jesus will help us all to become ONE as He desired.
Do you know that there is no infallible commentary of the bible by the magisterium ?? They have only "interpreted a handful of scriptures.. so all you hear in your homilies, read in RC books or hear in a Bible study are all just their own personal interpretation of the scriptures.. Every priest, every "theologian" every teacher... his own pope just like protestants..
(for the first 300+ years when there was no written bible),
Make sure you tell Peter that..He said that Pauls written letters (epistles) were scripture
And make sure you tell that to Athanasius (b. 296)' Origen (b. 185'), Irenaeus (b. 130), Marcion* (b. 85), all of which had scriptures
“We have seen what happens when the papacy is ignored by Protestants.”
Better fix this...
“We have seen what happens when the Bible is ignored by the papacy.”
Oh??
It sure USED to be!
Acts 18:28 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition (DRA)
For with much vigour he convinced the Jews openly, shewing by the scriptures, that Jesus is the Christ.
The world has SEEN what happens when the papacy is ignored by POPES; too!
Actually, you have entire RC groups who interpret RC teaching as meaning they must ignore the papacy of certain years, while those who obey "the one duty of the multitude," which is "to allow themselves to be led, and, like a docile flock, to follow the Pastors," are mostly liberals.
In addition, EO Catholics (some RCs will not even call them Catholics) significantly differ with Rome. And what doctrinal unity she has is largely on paper and quite limited. Thus while claiming unity, Catholicism exists in schisms and sects,
For the problem with the cultic Roman model for authority, in which souls are induced into looking to leaders and giving assent to them above unchanging Scripture, is that when they go South, or deviate from Scripture or RC past teaching, then so do most of the people.
Thus obedience to the pope during past centuries included exterminating all Prots, which were excluded from salvation, while today the pope gives even evangelicals the embrace of brethren, based on V2. (
Some examples of contrasting teaching .)
Thus conservative RCs tend to be of the SSPX or SSPV variety, yet which are charged with being like Prots in principal, since they determine what true teaching is by interpretive examination of the evidences for it. But a faithful RC is not to ascertain the veracity of current or any RC teaching by examination of evidences (for that reason). For to do so would be to doubt the self-proclaimed veracity of Rome.
“All that we do [as must be patent enough now] is to submit our judgment and conform our beliefs to the authority Almighty God has set up on earth to teach us; this, and nothing else.” (Henry G. Graham, "What Faith Really Means", (Nihil Obstat:C. SCHUT, S. T.D., Censor Deputatus, Imprimatur: EDM. CANONICUS SURMONT, D.D.,Vicarius Generalis. WESTMONASTERII, Die 30 Septembris, 1914 ); http://www.catholictradition.org /Tradition/faith2-10.htm]
..in all cases the immediate motive in the mind of a Catholic for his reception of them is, not that they are proved to him by Reason or by History, but because Revelation has declared them by means of that high ecclesiastical Magisterium which is their legitimate exponent.” — John Henry Newman, “A Letter Addressed to the Duke of Norfolk on Occasion of Mr. Gladstone's Recent Expostulation.” 8. The Vatican Council lhttp://www.newmanreader.org/works/anglicans/volume2/gladstone/section8.html
St. Ignatius once said that should the Pope command him to undertake a voyage by sea in a ship without a mast, without oars or sails, he would blindly obey the precept. And when he was told that it would be imprudent to expose his life to danger, he answered that.
prudence is necessary in Superiors; but in subjects the perfection of prudence is to obey without prudence. This doctrine is conformable to Holy Scripture: Behold, says the Lord, as clay is in the potter s hands.' Religious must leave themselves in the hands of the Superior to be moulded as she wills. St. Alphonsus De Liguori, True Spouse of Christ, p. 68 http://wallmell.webs.com/LiguoriTrueSpouseChristVol1.pdf
Everyone becomes their own pope and interprets the same scriptures by their own partial understanding, leading to massive disputes and misunderstandings.
Actually, no one can presume personal or magisterial protection from error as popes and Rome does, while RCs either give implicit submission of mind and will to what popes and Rome does or they differ with them, and which Rome implicitly sanctions.
In addition, both what magisterial level teachings fall under (unless one provides implicit assent to all Rome says, and which is cultic, not Christian, then) , and their meanings are subject to varying degrees of interpretation, This is esp. manifest among those who take doctrine most seriously, and thus they pick and choose from V2 and modern teaching what is to be obeyed, even though they disagree among themselves over things (including whether Francis is a valid pope).
And having lost her unholy power of the sword of men, then the fruit of Rome is largely liberal, with even proabortion/sodomite pols being treated as members in life and in death.
And unlike evangelicals, RCs cannot obey the Biblical injunction to be separate from such, (2Cor. 6:14-18) but must be yoked with unless they become part of schisms or sects, while those who hold most strongly to the primary evangelical distinctive in holding Scripture as the wholly inspired and accurate, basically literal word of God are the most unified in conservative basic beliefs.
Moreover, consider what your sola ecclesia model can lead to, and which further warranted the Reformation.
"For nearly half a century, the Church was split into two or three obediences that excommunicated one another, so that every Catholic lived under excommunication by one pope or another, and, in the last analysis, no one could say with certainty which of the contenders had right on his side. The Church no longer offered certainty of salvation; she had become questionable in her whole objective form--the true Church, the true pledge of salvation, had to be sought outside the institution. "It is against this background of a profoundly shaken ecclesial consciousness that we are to understand that Luther, in the conflict between his search for salvation and the tradition of the Church, ultimately came to experience the Church, not as the guarantor, but as the adversary of salvation. (Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger, head of the Sacred Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith for the Church of Rome, “Principles of Catholic Theology,” trans. by Sister Mary Frances McCarthy, S.N.D. (San Francisco: Ignatius, 1989) p.196). http://www.whitehorseinn.org/blog/2012/06/13/whos-in-charge-here-the-illusions-of-church-infallibility/) As for comparing Rome with Prot divisions, this is an invalid comparison, as it compares one body (if quite varied in reality despite having the same theater daily/weekly) with a many which includes multitudes who do not even hold to the most primary aspect of the Reformation, while those who hold most strongly to holding Scripture as the wholly inspired and accurate, basically literal word of God are the most unified in conservative basic beliefs. Meanwhile, having lost her unholy power of the sword of men, then the fruit of Rome is largely liberal, with even proabortion/sodomite pols being treated as members in life and in death. Meanwhile those who hold most strongly to the primary evangelical distinctive in holding Scripture as the wholly inspired and accurate, basically literal word of God are the most unified in conservative basic beliefs. Instead of the Roman model for assurance of Truth claims, which rests upon the novel and unScriptural premise of ensured perpetual magisterial infallibility as per Rome (and basically in primary cults). the NT church began because souls followed itinerant preachers whom the magisterium rejected, and whom their itinerant Leader reproved from Scripture as being supreme, (Mk. 7:2-16) and established His Truth claims upon scriptural substantiation in word and in power, as did the early church as it began upon this basis. (Mt. 22:23-45; Lk. 24:27,44; Jn. 5:36,39; Acts 2:14-35; 4:33; 5:12; 15:6-21;17:2,11; 18:28; 28:23; Rm. 15:19; 2Cor. 12:12, etc.) What is lacking today is the manner of manifest men of God who treated Scripture as the supreme authority, in word and deed. And thus could say, ...in all things approving ourselves as the ministers of God, in much patience, in afflictions, in necessities, in distresses, In stripes, in imprisonments, in tumults, in labours, in watchings, in fastings; By pureness, by knowledge, by longsuffering, by kindness, by the Holy Ghost, by love unfeigned, By the word of truth, by the power of God, by the armour of righteousness on the right hand and on the left, (2 Corinthians 6:4-7)
These leaders did not resort to claiming ensured perpetual magisterial infallibility, but followed an itinerant Preacher whom the magisterium rejected, and whom the Messiah reproved by Scripture as being supreme, (Mk. 7:2-16) and established His Truth claims upon scriptural substantiation in word and in power, as did the early church as it began upon this basis. (Mt. 22:23-45; Lk. 24:27,44; Jn. 5:36,39; Acts 2:14-35; 4:33; 5:12; 15:6-21;17:2,11; 18:28; 28:23; Rm. 15:19; 2Cor. 12:12, etc.) Under which the NT church saw its degree of limited unity of heart and basic Truths. The Biblical model has not been tried and found wanted, but wanting to be tried. Thus lacking such leadership which directed souls to Scripture as supreme, then divisions are a fitting judgment, while Rome's alternative of sola ecclesia is foreign to the NT church, and is what major cults rely on.. Every human organization requires an accountable leader. But the pope is not, as he is an autocratic head, with "full, supreme, and universal power over the whole Church, a power which he can always exercise unhindered," (CCC 882) and who is judged by no one. Dictatus papae [1075] : That a sentence passed by him may be retracted by no one; and that he himself, alone of all, may retract it. That he himself may be judged by no one. That no one shall dare to condemn one who appeals to the apostolic chair. http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/source/g7-dictpap.asp Only he [the Pope] can summon universal councils No synod can be called valid without the pope's agreement. Thus it is said, that the Pope heretic can be truly and authoritatively deposed by the Church, is no less false than the first... it must be observed in the first place that, from the fact that the Pope deposes bishops, it is deduced that the Pope is above all the bishops, though the Pope on deposing a bishop does not destroy the episcopal jurisdiction, but only separates it from that person. — http://www.fisheaters.com/bellarmine.html In his dissent, Dollinger summed up what papal infalliblity made the pope into: “The Pope’s authority is unlimited, incalculable; it can strike, as Innocent III says, wherever sin is; it can punish every one; it allows no appeal and is itself Sovereign Caprice; for the Pope carries, according to the expression of Boniface VIII, all rights in the Shrine of his breast. As he has now become infallible, he can by the use of the little word, 'orbi,' (which means that he turns himself round to the whole Church) make every rule, every doctrine, every demand, into a certain and incontestable article of Faith. No right can stand against him, no personal or corporate liberty; or as the Canonists put it -- 'The tribunal of God and of the pope is one and the same.'” - Ignaz von Dollinger, in “A Letter Addressed to the Archbishop of Munich”, 1871 (quoted in The Acton Newman Relations (Fordham University Press), by MacDougall, pp. 119 120