Episode 25: Scandalized by Pope Francis

The Remnant ^ | December 10, 2014 | Michael Matt

[Arthur McGowan]

Michael Matt discusses Pope Bergoglio's invitation to Patti Smith.

[Dr.Deth]

Is that the one with hairy pits that used to do rock bands?

[GreensKeeperWillie]

Have to wonder if Mapplethorpe would be invited had he not died of AIDS. I can hear the Bergoglio apologists now, excusing Patty Smith’s blasphemous lyrics, saying: “relax, it is only a cover version of an old Van Morrison song.”

[Mrs. Don-o]

OK, I didn't read the article. However I admit I like Patti Smith. Not necessarily Patti Smith, punk rocker circa 1975. Patti Smith, an old artist, 67, a sort of searcher.

She is not a Christian and never was. (She was raised Jehovah's Witness and left that, and I can hardly blame her.)

She's not a pro-abort (placed her firstborn for adoption when she was 17), not a lesbian (wife, mother of two, widow), not a Catholic-hater --- and as far as I know, chaste.

Luke 7:39-40
When the Pharisee who had invited him saw this, he said to himself, "If this man were a prophet, he would know who is touching him and what kind of woman she is -- that she is a sinner."

Jesus answered him, "Simon, I have something to tell you."

I have something to tell you.

[RBStealth]

I dont have time for the video, but the facts are Patti Smith did the same concert in 2013 and is doing the same thing this year. Obviously her performance last year was no scandal and she is far less scandalous than say having Elvis Presley(drugs/opportunistic adulterer etc) as an entertainer.

Vatican Christmas Concert 2013:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/28/patti-smith-o-holy-night_n_6200736.html

[Arthur McGowan]

If you didn’t watch the video, then you don’t know what the thread is about.

[Arthur McGowan]

Jesus didn’t invite the woman to perform. She invited herself.

Since he was incapable of sin, Jesus could not be scandalized. But he was definitely not pro-scandal!

Jesus could dine with prostitutes without sin, since for him there wasn’t any such thing as an “occasion of sin.” But I’ll bet even the apostles, during the next 30-60 years, didn’t run around dining with prostitutes.

[longfellowsmuse]

I don’t know much about her personal life and what scandal she may bring to the vatican but after listening to her performance....it stinks. Don’t believe me listen to Pavarotti ( yes I know he’s dead) or Bocelli and then ask yourself why she is invited to sing at the vatican concert.

[GreensKeeperWillie]

Lenny Bruce once said: “there is nothing sadder than an aging hipster.” That just may apply to Patti Smith. And Bergoglio.

[ConservingFreedom]

For those who, like me, would rather read than watch avideo: http://remnantnewspaper.com/web/index.php/fetzen-fliegen/item/1320-a-hippy-in-the-vatican

[ansel12]

She's not a pro-abort (placed her firstborn for adoption when she was 17)

Adoption in the 1960s doesn't tell us her modern, or post Roe v Wade views on abortion. Abortion was illegal in New Jersey, in 1967.

[livius]

“Aging hipster...And Bergoglio.”

Exactly. I almost feel sorry for Bergoglio - he reminds me of an older professor I had in an art history class back in college in the 1970s who suddenly decided he had to be hip and started making dirty jokes and wearing his shirt open to the navel, featuring a gold chain with some kind of medallion (a starburst or something, I was never even able to identify it at the time) and of course his scrawny white chest with a few grey hairs sticking out around the medallion.

Bergoglio thrives on the adulation of the press and that emanating from what are probably his morning self-adulation sessions in front of the mirror.

The problem is that he is a legitimately elected Pope, although probably most of the dim elderly cardinals who voted for him, after pressure from the Big Four, never even dreamed that he would be like this and probably thought he was going to be more like JPII, popular, populist and not very assertive on major issues but basically okay. Instead, we have a Peter who wants to remake the Church in his image.

[Wyrd bið ful aræd]

I don't think you can say she isn't a pro-abort. It's worth noting that abortion was illegal and difficult to obtain when she was 17, so her not having one in 1963 isn't suprising. She may not be a fullblown lesbian, but she confirmed herself in "Patti Smith: An Unauthorized Biography" that she had sexual encounters with at least one other female. She is also credited as a prominent figure of the "bisexual" liberation movement by other sources. I think it's pretty clear she is a member of the sexual perverted, free-swinging culture so common among celebrity types.

She may not hate Catholicism, but judging by the blasphemous lyrics of some of her songs (which as far as I know she hasn't recanted), she is no fan of Jesus Himself, the Author and Perfector of our faith, the founder of our Church, our Savior, our Lord and our God. With that in mind, that she hasn't publicly made statements against Catholicism per se doesn't do much in her favor, does it?

"...and as far as I know, chaste."

I have no idea how anybody could know that, except based on her own previous statements, which lead me to the opposite conclusion. If she is chaste now, well...The woman is nearly 70 years old.

[Mrs. Don-o]

Not to be too terribly mystical misty about it, but for some reason (not at all clear to me) every day at the Elevation of the Host, for several months now, I have been praying for:

• Patti Smith
• Anne Lamott
• My sons Ben and Vanya
• Pope Francis, and
• about a billion Muslims.

That's just the way I roll, for some reason.

BTW, dear Arthur, I was delighted to learn that my Ben's new girlfriend is an Albanian University student here in the US on an athletic scholarship. Raised Muslim, she is reportedly considering converting to Christianity. And guess where Ben took her on a Washington DC date? To the Shrine of the Immaculate Conception!!

I was bowled over.

Where they met the pope, or something. Here's the totally authentic documentary proof:

[Mrs. Don-o]

"Jesus didn’t invite the woman to perform. She invited herself."

Since I consider you one of the more intelligent posters on FR, I will let this one go by in silence. This does you no credit.

"Since he was incapable of sin, Jesus could not be scandalized. But he was definitely not pro-scandal!"

There's a sin of giving scandal. There's also a sin of taking scandal. Consider that.

"Jesus could dine with prostitutes without sin, since for him there wasn’t any such thing as an “occasion of sin.” But I’ll bet even the apostles, during the next 30-60 years, didn’t run around dining with prostitutes."

Inviting a 67 year old ex-punk sing a Christmas carol is not the same as dining with a prostitute.

I think you and I are sometimes in the position of slightly miffed sheep on a hillside bleating,

"But I'm a good little lamb! I never want astray! I would sure be honored to have the Shepherd pick me up and carry me around on His shoulders. But no! He goes and picks up that stupid old ewe who's been rolling around in the dung, stinking and full of cockleburs! SHE is SO unworthy!! We GOOD little lambs, we're so-o-o-o-o scandalized!"

[Jeff Chandler]

My two cents worth: the venue and occasion call for a performer of greater skill. Putting aside the issue of scandal, inclusion of this mediocre talent belies poor judgement.

[piusv]

I wish this was the worst thing Francis does or says.

[Arthur McGowan]

I’m not so shocked by this one measly incident.

Basically, Francis used up all my benefit of the doubt a long time ago. He used up about 97% of it with the remark about how we must not be obsessed with abortion. That one remark made me feel about as much kinship with him as a Catholic as if he had just strutted down the ramp of a spaceship from Neptune. He used up the rest pretty quickly.

I think he’s a shallow, inauthentic, cowardly buffoon. Those who have known him and worked with him for years have said he has always said whatever would please his immediate audience. He left the Archdiocese of Buenos Aires a shambles. He has promoted notorious (I don’t mean by that, “rumored”) homosexuals to positions of trust. He has persecuted manifestly good—or at the VERY, VERY least, harmless-people.

Cupich is one of the worst possible choices for Chicago, and from what I know, the very worst of all the actual candidates. He has wasted no time declaring his solidarity with Wuerl, Dolan, O’Malley, Chaput, Gomez, and the other 95% of the American bishops in mortal sin. (Giving Communion to pro-aborts.)

As far as I’m concerned, we are worse off at the moment than if the See were vacant—even if it were vacant for a long time.

If you like, I’ll tell you how I REALLY feel.

[Mrs. Don-o]

Oh, quit pulling your punches. :o/

I think we (you plus I) should abstain from this type of scandal-mongering. Why is it our business to take every offense and multiply it by 10,000 by serving as Beelzebub's distribution system to the eyes, ears and souls of the public? What we we, His Infernal Dungishness' publicity agents?

Ephesians 4:29
Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen.

1 Peter 3:15
But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect.

Maybe we should flee the FR Religion Forum altogether. I've never seen a more sin-sponsoring environment.

At least, not since I left the Benedictine Sisters of Erie.

[Bridesheadfan]

I’m with you, Arthur. Francis has made me feel estranged from the Church; not so much by this episode, but by everything you’ve mentioned. I think he’s a narcissist, and many of his statements read like he’s just another liberal politician. Unfortunately a lot of Catholics think that every utterance of the Pope is from the Holy Spirit, and that he’s above all criticism. I’m glad St. Paul didn’t feel that way when he “withstood Peter to his face”. We need some courageous men right now who will withstand this man to his face, before he does more harm.