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To: BipolarBob
1. The first acts of the Church was to abolish the Jewish circumcision and dietetic laws (Acts 15). The Gospels refer to "jews" as the people hostile to Jesus and to them. No, they did not "follow Jewish Law as it was intended", unless you are going to tell me that God did not intend to demand circumcision and abstinence from shrimp and pork.

2. A rosary is a form of praying beads found in many cultures and several religions. Whether the Jews in 1 c AD used praying beads I don't know and don't care. It is like saying that because we wear pressed pants and neckties we cannot be authentic Christians.

3. Veneration of Mary (not worship and not adoration; it is helpful to have some familiarity with the meaning of words if you want to be taken seriously in debate) as "second Eve" dates at least to mid-Second Century where St. Justin Martyr describes Mary in admiring terms (Dialog with Trypho, Ch. 100). But is is compatible with the tone of the first two chapters in the gospel of Luke where Elizabeth venerates her, and with the pericope when a woman in the crowd does the same, and Jesus adjusts her prayer without forbidding it (Luke 11:27-28).

4. Queen of Heaven is a reference to Rev 12.

5. Regarding crucifixes, why should I not have the image of Christ on me? Am I not required to imitate Christ, especially in His suffering? Also, what do you think the phrase "before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been set forth, crucified among you" (Galatians 3:1) describes if not a crucifix?

6. "Hail Mary" is a direct quote from the Bible in the first part and a reference to John 19:26 in the second part.

7. St. Paul praises celibacy in 1 Cor. 7. Celibacy of priests is not a defining characteristic of the Catholic Church as Eastern rite Catholics have married priests and so do we in the Western Church under some circumstances. Yes, in the main part in the Latin Church married men cannot be ordained. That is because we are fortunate to have enough men who are willing to be celibate as St. Paul advises. In our over-sexualized culture it is a very good thing.

8. Indeed, the Early Church did not have magnificent cathedrals because it was persecuted. That is not a defining characteristic of the Early Church. Surely, if you believe that the first Christians were a lot like the Jews you should then admit that a desire to build a splendid temple is very much a feature of the early Church also.

9. The prayer of Christ directed to Peter (Luke 22:32) where Christ prays for Peter to confirm other apostles is a functional description of papacy.

10. Selling of indulgences was a brief episode in the history of the Church; it was condemned as a method of fundraising. You can earn an indulgence today, of course, but you cannot buy it. That the Early Church collected money is evidenced several times in the Bible, see for example, Acts 5:1-10.

11. The persecutions of Protestants by Catholics were reciprocal and often done not by the Church herself but by the governments which equated heresy to treason. For some of them the Church has apologized. Certainly we should not tolerate heresy; see for example, 1 Corinthians 1:13.

45 posted on 06/28/2014 4:03:20 PM PDT by annalex (fear them not)
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To: annalex
1. The first acts of the Church was to abolish the Jewish circumcision and dietetic laws (Acts 15).
Wrong. Read it again. It wasn't a requirement to be circumcised. Acts 15:24. No recording of Jesus or the Disciples of eating pork or shrimp. And I guarantee you it would be recorded because they were under constant surveillance. It did say abstain from foods polluted by idols and strangled (not bled out) animals. Nothing on clean versus unclean foods. That will be covered later.
48 posted on 06/28/2014 4:18:55 PM PDT by BipolarBob (Obama - The Scandal a Week President.)
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To: annalex
2. 2. A rosary is a form of praying beads found in many cultures and several religions.
So is idol worship. Worship God and Him alone. The Disciples were able to do it and you can too.
49 posted on 06/28/2014 4:20:31 PM PDT by BipolarBob (Obama - The Scandal a Week President.)
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To: annalex
3. 3. Veneration of Mary
No requirements for this one anywhere. All of our energies are to be devoted to God and the living.
50 posted on 06/28/2014 4:22:28 PM PDT by BipolarBob (Obama - The Scandal a Week President.)
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To: annalex
4. 4. Queen of Heaven is a reference to Rev 12.
Uh no. The woman in question here is the Church not Mary. In OT figure the True Church is at times represented by a woman (Isa 54:6; jer. 6:2) When the church apostatized it was compared to a corrupt woman (Jer 3:20 Eze 22:2-4) Also reference Rev 17 which some denominations link to your church. Just saying.
51 posted on 06/28/2014 4:29:44 PM PDT by BipolarBob (Obama - The Scandal a Week President.)
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To: annalex
5. Regarding crucifixes, why should I not have the image of Christ on me? Am I not required to imitate Christ
Yes you are. Now if you'll kindly reference me where Jesus or the Disciples wore crucifixes I'll give you this one. Galatians 3:1 is for people that can visualize Christ hanging on a cross for their sins as not all new believers witnessed this event. See Acts 19:24 onward to see Pauls thoughts on such handiwork.
52 posted on 06/28/2014 4:35:26 PM PDT by BipolarBob (Obama - The Scandal a Week President.)
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To: annalex
6. "Hail Mary"

A Bible quote? Yes. There's lots of quotes in the Bible including one from a donkey. If I see Mary in person in the flesh, I'll hail her. Otherwise it is a ritual that borders on paganism.

53 posted on 06/28/2014 4:37:37 PM PDT by BipolarBob (Obama - The Scandal a Week President.)
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To: annalex
7. St. Paul praises celibacy
Yes he does. But he knows his limits (The Catholic Church does not) and does not forbid priests from marrying.
we are fortunate to have enough men who are willing to be celibate
Because your Church causes them to choose between serving God under your man made rules or not serving at all. Not very sporting.
54 posted on 06/28/2014 4:41:02 PM PDT by BipolarBob (Obama - The Scandal a Week President.)
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To: annalex
8. Indeed, the Early Church did not have magnificent cathedrals
Point conceded.
9. The prayer of Christ directed to Peter
This was right before he denied his Lord thrice, was it not? Not exactly his defining moment for a non-existent Pope job.
55 posted on 06/28/2014 4:46:03 PM PDT by BipolarBob (Obama - The Scandal a Week President.)
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To: annalex
10. Selling of indulgences was a brief episode in the history of the Church
Well you and Mrs. Don-o keep telling me to mind my history lessons. Money for favors was routinely condemned as the Church well knew and did anyway. Acts 8:20. For a Church that follows Peter they sure blew this call. Doesn't really inspire me to call them the One True Holy Church.
56 posted on 06/28/2014 4:50:41 PM PDT by BipolarBob (Obama - The Scandal a Week President.)
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To: annalex
11. The persecutions of Protestants by Catholics were reciprocal
Well that makes it all right then. Sort of a perverse Golden Rule of Denominations. Anyone following God and His Word would know it is NOT all right to burn a man alive for his moral convictions. Your clergy failed. Your Popes failed.
57 posted on 06/28/2014 4:55:10 PM PDT by BipolarBob (Obama - The Scandal a Week President.)
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