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To: NYer; BipolarBob; metmom; Elsie

“Christ stated that the Church, not Scripture should be the final authority: “And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the Church: but if he neglect to hear the Church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.” (Matthew 18:17 )”

As I’ve pointed out before, context is important. Jesus did not give local churches authority to determine doctrine. However:

“15 “If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother. 16 But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every fact may be confirmed. 17 If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. 18 Truly I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven.”

Jesus quotes scripture, already given (”by the mouth of two or three witnesses every fact may be confirmed”), in saying how the future church should handle DISCIPLINE. When does this kick in? “If your brother sins...”

The Apostles did have the right to determine doctrine, backed by the miracles God performed through them. Thus we ended up with the New Testament, the written record of what Jesus & the Apostles taught.

“the church of the living God, the pillar and support of the truth”

It truly is, but not some heretical church that made up false doctrines and substituted the teachings of man for the teachings of God. When a church abandons scripture, and places itself above the Word of God, it rejects both the written Word of God and the Living Word of God, Jesus Christ.

The church lifts the truth up and holds it high, but the church is not, itself, the truth. The duty of the church is to hold the truth up before an unbelieving world, to lead some to repentance and confirm others in their damnation. The Apostles did this, and backed up what they preached with the Word of God, because it is God’s Word that is truth. The church is not the truth. God is, and His revelation to man, in the life of Christ in human flesh, the scripture and the lives of believers. The church holds that truth up for all the world to see.

The church cannot invent the truth any more than a pillar can create a building.

“14 As Moses lifted up the bronze snake on a pole in the desert, in the same way the Son of Man must be lifted up, 15 so that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life.”

So it is the job of the church to lift up Jesus, in word and deed. Our job is to hold the truth up for all to see, not to replace it with our own thoughts and values. It is Jesus who is exulted, and the church only “in Him”.


400 posted on 06/25/2014 3:00:14 PM PDT by Mr Rogers
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To: Mr Rogers

Well stated.


401 posted on 06/25/2014 3:05:07 PM PDT by BipolarBob (Obama - The Scandal a Week President.)
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To: Mr Rogers
The church lifts the truth up and holds it high, but the church is not, itself, the truth. The duty of the church is to hold the truth up before an unbelieving world, to lead some to repentance and confirm others in their damnation. The Apostles did this, and backed up what they preached with the Word of God, because it is God’s Word that is truth. The church is not the truth. God is, and His revelation to man, in the life of Christ in human flesh, the scripture and the lives of believers. The church holds that truth up for all the world to see. The church cannot invent the truth any more than a pillar can create a building. “14 As Moses lifted up the bronze snake on a pole in the desert, in the same way the Son of Man must be lifted up, 15 so that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life.” So it is the job of the church to lift up Jesus, in word and deed. Our job is to hold the truth up for all to see, not to replace it with our own thoughts and values. It is Jesus who is exulted, and the church only “in Him”.

Amen! Cannot be stated enough.

409 posted on 06/25/2014 10:42:39 PM PDT by boatbums (Proud member of the Free Republic Bible Thumpers Brigade.)
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