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To: aMorePerfectUnion
What a wonderful list--- lovely really. Thank you.

What I wanted to comment upon was that,since about the 10th century, the process for canonization required 2 authenticated miracles which were obtained through the saint's intercession. The miracles are God's signal that this person really is in heaven interceding for us.

I've noticed among my non-Catholic Christian friends and family, the instant canonization of their beloved departed: that is to say, they are quite publicly proclaimed to be in heaven. It routinely appears in the obituaries, and always in the eulogies.

I see nothing offensive in this, but it contrasts with your statement that nobody on earth can know if anybody is in heaven. Common Protestant practice is to assume that everybody is in heaven.

And that same assumption seems to be creeping into Catholic practice, too.Pope John Paul II, in his eagerness to provide us with a lot of holy role-models by canonizing a lot of people, began dispensing with the "miracles" requirement back in the 90's.

But I think that was unwise. The Catholic Church should, I think, return to the traditional strictness over miracles as validating a person's arrival in heaven. Because how could we know that, unless God gave us a sign? Let God make the call. It's His job!

30 posted on 04/10/2014 6:44:50 AM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("Faith with love is the faith of Christians; without love, it is the faith of demons." - Ven. Bede)
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To: Mrs. Don-o

“But I think that was unwise. The Catholic Church should, I think, return to the traditional strictness over miracles as validating a person’s arrival in heaven. Because how could we know that, unless God gave us a sign? Let God make the call. It’s His job! “

I have to disagree here. No one can even know if the so-called miracle was attributable to that particular person. A human has to decide, yup! it was them.

There are serious problems with this.

First, they aren’t real miracles the person did. Peter’s shadow fell on people and they were healed. Everyone saw it. It is recorded in inspired Scripture.

Contrast that to an ignorant person who prays to a departed pope:

1. Scripture never indicates Christians are ever to pray to a person or angel
2. Scripture never indicates a departed person can hear them
3. Scripture never indicates the ignorant prayer’s prayer ever got to God
4. There is no way to confirm the departed person even went to heaven
5. There is no human way to confirm the departed person had a role at all in the so-called miracle.
6. In the end, you have a human opinion that is influenced by their desire to categorically state a departed person was indeed a saint.

Now, on to your earlier point.

Virtually everyone, regardless of denomination, assumes their departed friend or family member has gone to heaven (”a better place”). It is a shame, but they do it because it is comforting. The opposite thought is unthinkable to them.

However, the requirement to have eternal life in God’s presence is to entrust ourselves to Him for salvation, based entirely on His sacrifice and not our own efforts or merit. If we do this, surely His new life will manifest itself in a changed life marked by good works.

We are right to take God at His Word in this instance.

Kindest regards to you...


31 posted on 04/10/2014 10:45:00 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion
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