Rev 17
1
And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters:
How could it be said that Jerusalem sit up on many waters?
They have a big problem staying in control of their own land.
2
With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.
In times past the Church shared power with many kings and in some cases even controlled them.
3
So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.
4
And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
Golden cup? wine? communion?
5
And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery, Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth.
6
And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.
Does it read that the blood of the saints was on her hands? no, it says she was drunken with the blood of the saints.
Could it be she was falsely representing the saints and therefore drunken (figuratively speaking) on the blood that they shed?
Was she drinking from the golden communion cup unworthily?.
While it is true that Rome itself sits on and around the seven hills and was surrounded by a wall the Vatican is in Rome.
The mother Church and her daughters are the only ones that fit the bill, we can see a lot just by reading a little history.
rev 18
4
And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
Who is God talking to here? he says my people, are we who are reading his word and wondering about it his people? i think so.
Why would he be telling his people to come out of Israel, or parts of the Muslim world? why would he feel the need to?
He is telling us to come out of something we love and even worship.
I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters:
The Church and her daughters are all over the world, many waters which represent multitudes of people.
What does "many waters" mean? Where can I find that in the scriptures?
>>>In times past the Church shared power with many kings and in some cases even controlled them.<<<
I am unsure how the catholic church is relevant, unless it killed all the prophets.
>>>Golden cup? wine? communion?<<<
I believe the cup is in reference to a prophecy by Jeremiah where God sent the armies of ancient Babylon against ancient Jerusalem and the cities of Judah (Jer 25.) The cup was in remembrance of the first desolation of Jerusalem, I presume:
"And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath." (Rev 14:8)
>>>Does it read that the blood of the saints was on her hands? no, it says she was drunken with the blood of the saints. Could it be she was falsely representing the saints and therefore drunken (figuratively speaking) on the blood that they shed?<<<
It says that Babylon the Great was responsible for the blood of the saints, and the prophets; like Jerusalem.
"And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth." (Rev 18:24, KJV)
>>>While it is true that Rome itself sits on and around the seven hills and was surrounded by a wall the Vatican is in Rome. The mother Church and her daughters are the only ones that fit the bill, we can see a lot just by reading a little history.<<<
All this is meaningless unless the Papacy is responsible for the blood of all the prophets, which it is not, nor ever shall be. We have been fresh out of prophets since the first century. Besides the great city, Babylon the Great sat on a scarlet colored beast; and on seven mountains, not hills. Ancient Jerusalem sat on seven mountains.
>>>Who is God talking to here? he says my people, are we who are reading his word and wondering about it his people? i think so.<<<
He was talking to the early Christians to get out of Jerusalem. It appeared to be a follow-through of his warnings in the Olivet Discourse of Matt 24, Luke 21 and Mark 13, where he warned Christians to get out of Judea when they saw certain signs.
>>>Why would he be telling his people to come out of Israel, or parts of the Muslim world? why would he feel the need to?<<<
There were no Muslims in the first century.
>>>He is telling us to come out of something we love and even worship.<<<
In the first century Christians were being persecuted and murdered by the Jews of Jerusalem, and elsewhere. That is part of the reason it was destroyed. It had some other ghastly deeds in its resume: the blood of all the prophets; all the righteous blood since Abel; the murder of Christ; etc..
>>>The Church and her daughters are all over the world, many waters which represent multitudes of people.<<<
You have absolutely no proof of that. If you did, I would not have started this thread.
Philip