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To: Redmen4ever
I refer to what appears to be a possibility as many Jews perceive Christianity. It appears to be possible, under the rules of Christianity, that Adolph Hitler, in the moment between firing a bullet into his head and becoming dead, could have asked God for to forgive him and have been saved.

Well, let's turn the situation around. If a Jew massacred christians and repented before death, would he be saved? Consider, as well, that in the United States, about 60 million children have been murdered in their mothers’ wombs since 1973, a tower of evil darker than Mordor. The Holocaust comes from the same bitter root as the abortion movement. They both came that we might have death, and have it abundantly. In the Holocaust 6 million Jews were killed. Jews often object when anyone compares the number killed in the Holocaust with any other number of persons killed because Hitler was trying to kill Europe’s entire Jewish population, but state approval of a systematic killing of large numbers of Jews is comparable no matter who is doing the killing. If Jews are 2 percent of the population, we may assume that Jews participated in 2 percent of the 60 million U.S. abortions since 1973. Liberal Jewish women therefore have killed more than 1 million Jewish children, a significant part of the Jewish population.

During the Holocaust Jewish men and women cried out from their hearts, “Almighty God, hear the cry of the poor!” God heard their cry and gave them back the land of Israel. Israel’s war-cry was, “Never again.” But even in Israel many Jewish mothers also kill the children in their own wombs. God told us, “He who closes his ear to the cry of the poor will himself cry out and not be heard” Proverbs 21:13. Rabbi Yeshua confirmed it. “For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and the measure you give will be the measure you get” Mt 7:2. For those who cheerfully obey the Torah or Church law, our fidelity is eternity in heaven. For those who follow man’s law Roe v. Wade it can be eternity in hell.

What do you say. Do you say if Adolph Hitler has asked for forgiveness in his dying gasp, that it is possible for him to be in heaven?

What happens at death? Christians believe that we are judged .. actually, we believe that we judge ourselves. We also believe that only those who are spotless may enter into heaven. Do you think Adolph Hitler fits that description?

And, as for the Jews that Hitler killed, many of whom did not confess on the name of Jesus, do you think it is possible that they are in hell?

You are citing a belief of Fundamentalist christians, not Catholics. Scripture teaches that one’s final salvation depends on the state of the soul at death. As Jesus himself tells us, "He who endures to the end will be saved" (Matt. 24:13; cf. 25:31–46). One who dies in the state of friendship with God (the state of grace) will go to heaven. The one who dies in a state of enmity and rebellion against God (the state of mortal sin) will go to hell.

The truth is that in one sense we are all redeemed by Christ’s death on the cross—Christians, Jews, Muslims, even animists in the darkest forests (1 Tim. 2:6, 4:10, 1 John 2:2)—but our individual appropriation of what Christ provided is contingent on our response.

I would recommend you pick up a copy of this book, written by a Jew, Roy Schoeman.

Roy Schoeman grew up studying Judaism under the most prominent Rabbis in American Judaism. After receiving a B.S. from M.I.T. and an M.B.A. from Harvard Business School, he taught at Harvard. You may find the following interview with the author, informative.

Jewish Voice Extended Interview with Roy Schoeman

33 posted on 02/13/2014 2:28:08 PM PST by NYer ("The wise man is the one who can save his soul. - St. Nimatullah Al-Hardini)
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To: NYer
Where to start with this mess:

Rabbi Yeshua

Son of God there, not one of His titles in Isaiah.

For those who cheerfully obey the Torah or Church law, our fidelity is eternity in heaven.

In contrast to 'all have sinned' (I just heard that that statement is hyperbole). Church law now saves?

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. 17 For in it the righteousness of God is revealed from faith for faith,[e] as it is written, “The righteous shall live by faith.”[f]

Romans 3

21 But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, although the Law and the Prophets bear witness to it— 22 the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God's righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins. 26 It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus. 27 Then what becomes of our boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? By a law of works? No, but by the law of faith. 28 For we hold that one is justified by faith apart from works of the law. 29 Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also, 30 since God is one—who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through faith. 31 Do we then overthrow the law by this faith? By no means! On the contrary, we uphold the law.

What happens at death? Christians believe that we are judged .. actually, we believe that we judge ourselves.

Really, so instead of 'from thence He came to judge the living and the dead' becomes 'whence I die I judge myself'?Christians indeed!

We also believe that only those who are spotless may enter into heaven. Do you think Adolph Hitler fits that description?

Not in his historic state, but had he been given the grace and the faith to repent, he would indeed would be in heaven.

Scripture teaches that one’s final salvation depends on the state of the soul at death.

Catholics may teach that, the trick is HOW.

And, as for the Jews that Hitler killed, many of whom did not confess on the name of Jesus, do you think it is possible that they are in hell? You are citing a belief of Fundamentalist christians,

Because salvation is by grace through faith in the redeeming work of Jesus. No Jesus, no salvation, that's scriptural.

The truth is that in one sense we are all redeemed by Christ’s death on the cross—Christians, Jews, Muslims, even animists in the darkest forests (1 Tim. 2:6, 4:10, 1 John 2:2)—but our individual appropriation of what Christ provided is contingent on our response.

Not in one sense. All humanity was redeemed by Christ on the cross. Our appropriation of that gift is by grace we are called, by grace we are given faith, by grace we repent and are reconciled to God. Before we are justified we remain enemies of God. Only then can we receive spiritual things.

34 posted on 02/13/2014 3:33:03 PM PST by xone
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To: NYer

On what you actually said, no problem. I’d state more positively that the Jews are our older brothers in the faith. They are the tree into which we have been grafted. So, certainly, Jews who keep the commandments and who ask for God’s forgiveness trusting in his mercy, they are saved.

As for others, religious or otherwise, I’m inclined to the same opinion. I, being merely human, would like to see some behavior evidencing repentance; but, God can see into one’s heart and doesn’t need “evidence”. I sometimes wonder about atheists, though. Maybe I’m prejudiced, but why would an atheist run into a burning building to save another person; or, not steal or lie when they could get away with it? And, besides, how do you handle it if the guy in the foxhole next to you doesn’t make it and he’s not a believer?

Finally, the question that, instead of you answering, you asked me, I’m pretty certain Adolf Hitler is in hell. In any case, if I were a Catholic priest, and Hitler on his death bed asked me for absolution, I’d say no. Maybe that’s why I’m not a Catholic priest.


37 posted on 02/13/2014 3:49:24 PM PST by Redmen4ever
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