Replies

"the Apostles preached the complete Gospel,"

You are making the leap that everything in the gospel is contained in a few letters by Paul and a few accounts from the other Apostles. Which is simply not the case.

John 20:
30 And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book:

John 21:25
25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

Jesus taught face to face. Everything that was taught by Jesus and by the apostles was not written down. And certainly not written down in every letter to every person they ever wrote to. Which is the basis of your argument.

It's like trying to argue that everything taught in college can be found in a study guide given out by a single instructor.

If God did not intend us to get anymore revelation then why was Judas replaced? The position of Apostle was supposed to be perpetual. An Apostle can only be chosen by an Apostle. So when the people chose to kill them there was no one left with the authority to replace those that died.

"God raises up leaders in His Church and He has done that for nearly 2,000 years."

Oh really? And which leaders would that be? It was not His Church nor His leaders. Not long after John departed, the "Church" began burning, maiming, torturing, murdering by the millions for what they called "heresy". Can you show me where Jesus taught men to do that?

God's true Church has prophets and Apostles. Live ones.

"the Scriptures do speak of false prophets arising and leading many astray."

If there are false ones, then there has to be true ones too. Or the instruction would have been, "Beware of anyone claiming to be a prophet." On the contrary Rev 11 makes it perfectly clear there will be true ones too.

Joseph Smith was absolutely a true prophet. And he restored the laws and truths lost after the original Apostles were killed.Want to know one of the keys to unlocking what the Lord means in Luke 13:?

26 Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets.

27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.

Lord says He is going to cast off people who believe in Him. Why? We need a prophet to tell us why and Joseph Smith gave us one of the answers in the Book of Mormon.

Moroni 8:
7 For immediately after I had learned these things of you I inquired of the Lord concerning the matter. And the word of the Lord came to me by the power of the Holy Ghost, saying:

8 Listen to the words of Christ, your Redeemer, your Lord and your God. Behold, I came into the world not to call the righteous but sinners to repentance; the whole need no physician, but they that are sick; wherefore, little children are whole, for they are not capable of committing sin; wherefore the curse of Adam is taken from them in me, that it hath no power over them; and the law of circumcision is done away in me.

9 And after this manner did the Holy Ghost manifest the word of God unto me; wherefore, my beloved son, I know that it is solemn mockery before God, that ye should baptize little children.

10 Behold I say unto you that this thing shall ye teach—repentance and baptism unto those who are accountable and capable of committing sin; yea, teach parents that they must repent and be baptized, and humble themselves as their little children, and they shall all be saved with their little children.

11 And their little children need no repentance, neither baptism. Behold, baptism is unto repentance to the fulfilling the commandments unto the remission of sins.

We needed a prophet to tell the world that it is solemn mockery before God to baptize little children...among other things.

I have to grin at the use of that verse (John 20:30). It is the same verse Eastern Orthodox and Roman Catholics use to 'explain' all the traditions that were never written down in the Gospels, Acts and epistles. So you do have that company using the same verse.

Let's look at the entire passage:

John 20

30 Therefore many other signs Jesus also performed in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book; 31 but these have been written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing you may have life in His name.

Kind of important to include verse 31 because it explains it all right there.

John 21:

24 This is the disciple who is testifying to these things and wrote these things, and we know that his testimony is true.

25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did, which if they *were written in detail, I suppose that even the world itself *would not contain the books that *would be written.

Again leaving out an important point. There WERE many other things indeed, but do we assume that John would leave something out that IS important for us to know? In verse 24 we find out the answer. What is given is sufficient. Just as here from Paul:

2 Timothy 3:

14 You, however, continue in the things you have learned and become convinced of, knowing from whom you have learned them, 15 and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16 All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; 17 so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work.

Prophesy is proclaiming God's Word. I am not a hard cessationist. However, I am a hard Scripture alone Christian. Which means if someone proclaims a revelation or vision or miracle today it must match 100% with the Bible. In the case of miracles it must be in support of promoting and furthering the Gospel of Jesus Christ as we have in the Bible declared by the apostles, demonstrating the Power of God. Not the "touch the TV to get healed" nonsense.

We needed a prophet to tell the world that it is solemn mockery before God to baptize little children...among other things.

No, Sir you are incorrect we did not need Joseph Smith to tell us that:

Acts 10:

44 While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who were listening to the message. 45 All the circumcised believers who came with Peter were amazed, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. 46 For they were hearing them speaking with tongues and exalting God. Then Peter answered, 47 “Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, can he?” 48 And he ordered them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay on for a few days.

Joseph Smith was a thief, a liar, a plagiarist, and a drunken bar room brawler.

Much of the mormon church follows him in spirit.

let me come at this a different way -

what doctrine of faith did the Apostles not reveal to us that a subsequent prophet did?
was it the Apostles held this doctrine back or they weren’t aware of this doctrine themself?
please name some prophets that God sent to the world after the death of the Apostle John.

thanks.

Joseph Smith was absolutely a true prophet.

If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the Lord does not take place or come true, that is a message the Lord has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him”
(Deut. 18:22).

Joseph Smith was absolutely a true prophet.

How about Brigham Young?

We needed a prophet to tell the world that it is solemn mockery before God to baptize little children...among other things.

That's about as precise a statement as Mormonism's creed that says - TWICE! - ...and so forth!!

Here is MORMONism's own creed:

Articles of Faith

The Articles of Faith outline 13 basic points of belief of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
The Prophet Joseph Smith first wrote them in a letter to John Wentworth, a newspaper editor,
in response to Mr. Wentworth's request to know what members of the Church believed.
They were subsequently published in Church periodicals.
They are now regarded as scripture and included in the Pearl of Great Price.

THE ARTICLES OF FAITH
OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER-DAY SAINTS
History of the Church, Vol. 4, pp. 535—541

We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.
We believe that men will be punished for their own sins, and not for Adam's transgression.
We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.
We believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are: first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ; second, Repentance; third, Baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; fourth, Laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost.
We believe that a man must be called of God, by prophecy, and by the laying on of hands by those who are in authority, to preach the Gospel and administer in the ordinances thereof.
We believe in the same organization that existed in the Primitive Church, namely, apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers, evangelists, and so forth.
We believe in the gift of tongues, prophecy, revelation, visions, healing, interpretation of tongues, and so forth.
We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God.
We believe all that God has revealed, all that He does now reveal, and we believe that He will yet reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of God.
We believe in the literal gathering of Israel and in the restoration of the Ten Tribes; that Zion (the New Jerusalem) will be built upon the American continent; that Christ will reign personally upon the earth; and, that the earth will be renewed and receive its paradisiacal glory.
We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may.
We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.
We believe in being honest, true, chaste, benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to all men; indeed, we may say that we follow the admonition of Paul—We believe all things, we hope all things, we have endured many things, and hope to be able to endure all things. If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things.

Joseph Smith