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When Were Joseph and Mary Married?
Catholic Answers ^ | September 20, 2013 | Tim Staples

Posted on 09/21/2013 3:07:58 PM PDT by NYer

When the Archangel Gabriel visited Mary and declared unto her that she was called to be the Mother of God, as we see recorded in Luke 1, her response would become the cause of the spilling of a whole lot of ink over the centuries: “How shall this happen, since I know not man?” (v. 34, Douay Rheims, Confraternity Edition).

For Catholics this is an indication of Mary’s vow of perpetual virginity. It’s really quite simple. If Mary and Joseph were just an ordinary couple embarking on a normal married life together, there would be no reason to ask the question. Mary would have known very well how it could be that the angel was saying she would have a baby. As St. Augustine said it:

Had she intended to know man, she would not have been amazed. Her amazement is a sign of the vow (Sermon 225, 2).

But Protestants do not see it as quite so simple. Reformed Apologist James White gives us an example of the most common objection to our “Catholic” view of this text:

Nothing about a vow is mentioned in Scripture. Mary’s response to the angel was based upon the fact that it was obvious that the angel was speaking about an immediate conception, and since Mary was at that time only engaged to Joseph, but not married, at that time she could not possibly conceive in a natural manner, since she did not “know a man” (Mary—Another Redeemer? p. 31.).

Among the errors in just these two sentences (I counted four), there are two that stand out for our purpose here.

Error #1: Mr. White claims Mary was engaged to St. Joseph.

There was no such thing as engagement (as it is understood in modern Western culture) in ancient Israel. The text says Mary was “betrothed” or “espoused” (Gr.—emnesteumene), not engaged. Betrothal, in ancient Israel, would be akin to the ratification of a marriage (when a couple exchanges vows in the presence of an official witness of the Church) in Catholic theology. That ratified marriage is then consummated—in the normal course—on the couple’s wedding night. So when Luke 1:27 says Mary was betrothed, it means they were already married at the time of the annunciation. If this were an ordinary marriage, St. Joseph would then have had a husband’s right to the marriage bed—the consummation.

This simple truth proves devastating to Mr. White’s (and the Protestant's) argument. If Joseph and Mary were married—and they were—and they were planning the normal course, Mary would have known full and well how she could and would have a baby. As St. Augustine said, the question reveals the fact that this was not just your average, ordinary marriage. They were not planning to consummate their union.

Betrothed = Married?

For those who are not convinced “betrothed” equals “married” for Mary and Joseph; fortunately, the Bible makes this quite clear. If we move forward in time from the “annunciation” of Luke 1 to Matthew 1 and St. Joseph’s discovery of Mary’s pregnancy, we find Matthew 1:18 clearly stating Mary and Joseph were still “betrothed.” Yet, when Joseph found out Mary was “with child,” he determined he would “send her away privately” (vs. 19). The Greek verb translated in the RSVCE to send away is apolusai, which means divorce. Why would Joseph have to divorce Mary if they were only engaged?

Further, the angel then tells Joseph:

Do not fear to take Mary your wife, for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit . . . When Joseph woke from sleep, he did as the angel of the Lord commanded him; he took his wife (vss. 20-24).

Notice, Joseph took Mary “his wife,” indicating both St. Matthew and an archangel considered this couple married even though they were said to be “betrothed.” “Betrothed” is obviously much more than “engaged.”

Moreover, months later we find Joseph and Mary travelling together to Bethlehem to be enrolled as a family according to the decree of Caesar Augustus, just before Jesus would be born. They were obviously married; yet, even then, they were still said to be “betrothed” (see Luke 2:5).

So let's recap what have we have uncovered. First, Joseph had already taken his espoused “wife” into his home and was caring for her. Second, Scripture reveals him to be her legal husband and to have travelled with Mary to be enrolled with her as a lawfully wedded couple and family. Third, she was called St. Joseph’s “wife” by the angel of the Lord… and yet, they were still referred to as betrothed.

Referring to Mary and Joseph as “engaged” in the face of all of this evidence would be like calling a modern couple at their wedding reception “engaged” because they have yet to consummate their marriage.

Once the fact that Mary and Joseph were already married at the time of the annunciation is understood, Mary’s “How shall this happen…” comes more into focus. Think about it: If you were a woman who had just been married (your marriage was “ratified,” but not consummated) and someone at your reception said—or “prophesied”—that you were going to have a baby—that would not really be all that much of a surprise. That is the normal course of events. You marry, consummate the union, and babies come along. You certainly would not ask the question, “Gee, how is this going to happen?” It is in this context of Mary having been betrothed, then, that her question does not make sense… unless, of course, you understand she had a vow of virginity. Then, it makes perfect sense.

Error #2: Mr. White claimed, “…it was obvious that the angel was speaking about an immediate conception.” And, closely related to this, Mr. White then claimed Mary asked the question, "How shall this happen...?" because she knew "at that time she could not conceive in a natural manner?"

Really? It was obvious?

There is not a single word in this text or anywhere else in Scripture that indicates Mary knew her conception was going to be immediate and via supernatural means. That’s why she asked the question, "How shall this happen...?" It appears she did not know the answer. How could she? Why would it ever enter into her mind? There would be no way apart from a revelation from God that she could have known. And most importantly, according to the text, the angel did not reveal the fact that Mary would conceive immediately and supernaturally until after Mary asked the question.

But let's suppose Mary was "engaged" as Mr. White claims. There would be even less reason to believe the conception would be immediate and somehow supernatural then there would be if Mary had a vow of virginity (though there’s really no reason to think this in either scenario). An "engaged" woman would have naturally assumed that when she and St. Joseph would later consummate their marriage, they could expect a very special surprise from God. They were going to conceive the Messiah. There would be no reason to think anything else. And there would be no reason to ask the question.

One final thought: When Mary asked the question, "How shall this happen, since I do not know man," the verb to be (Gr.-estai) is in the future tense. There is nothing here that would indicate she was thinking of the immediate. The future tense here most likely refers to… the future. The question was not how she could conceive immediately. The question was how she could conceive ever. The angel answered that question for her.



TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; History; Theology
KEYWORDS: sectarianturmoil
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To: NYer
Why would Joseph have to divorce Mary if they were only engaged?

Why in the world would Mary have been getting married in the first place if she had taken a vow to never know a man? The above argument implies Joseph was okay with that which is obviously absurd. What could possibly have been his motive to agree to such a thing? The article doesn't address this rather obvious point (I wonder why?).

Betrothal was more serious than a modern engagagment but it was still before the marriage ceremony and the marriage was only consummated at that point. If he's implying betrothal had to have been after then he's full of it.

And then of course they declare that Jesus brothers were actually his cousins. Righhht.

41 posted on 09/21/2013 7:11:18 PM PDT by lasereye
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To: Manly Warrior
"Check out Mt 12:49, Mk 6:3, Luke 8:19, Jn 7:3,4,5,10, referring to Jesus’ brothers ( adelphos- male sibling in the greek text, not adelphotes - a brotherly relation as in brotherhood)."

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

In Matthew 12:49-50, Jesus is actually calling His disciples and other people who do the will of His Father in heaven "His brothers", using that Greek word "adelphos".

The truth is, "adelphos" can mean several things, including "a brother, near kinsman, or relative; one of the same nation or nature; one of equal rank and dignity; an associate, a member of the Christian community", etc.    (Source:    http://www.teknia.com/greek-dictionary/adelphos )

Also, your statement "The only reason to declare Mary a lifelong celibate woman is to worship her" is also false.    There are many other reasons why one could believe that Mary was a lifelong celibate.    I believe Mary is "ever-virgin" (celibate), and I do not worship Mary.

42 posted on 09/21/2013 7:25:10 PM PDT by Heart-Rest (Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. Gal 6:7)
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To: NYer

And yet according to Catholicism, the marriage was never consummated, which means Joseph was also a virgin.


43 posted on 09/21/2013 7:32:31 PM PDT by Old Yeller (Who am I to judge homosexuals? That's what the Tony Awards are for.)
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To: Old Yeller

Exactly. There’s no way to explain this implication so it’s ignored.


44 posted on 09/21/2013 7:50:30 PM PDT by lasereye
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To: Old Yeller
"And yet according to Catholicism, the marriage was never consummated, which means Joseph was also a virgin."

Well, either a virgin, or a widower.    (Source:     http://www.catholic.com/quickquestions/was-st-joseph-a-virgin-or-a-widower-with-children )

45 posted on 09/21/2013 7:55:50 PM PDT by Heart-Rest (Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. Gal 6:7)
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To: Heart-Rest

Why were they getting married in the first place? Is there some “tradition” that explains that too?


46 posted on 09/21/2013 8:00:25 PM PDT by lasereye
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To: jph1776
You are right!

"Never apologize for the

Blessed Virgin Mary!"

~~Mother Angelica

 

Mother Angelica and Marcus Grodi with Rosalind Moss and Kristine Franklin


47 posted on 09/21/2013 8:00:27 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Catsrus

But Mary IS the Mother of God the Son, Jesus Christ, fully human and fully God.

Re=read the story of the Visitation again, please, and Elizabeth’s greeting to Mary, “How is this that the Mother of the Lord....”


48 posted on 09/21/2013 8:03:53 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: lasereye
"Why were they getting married in the first place? Is there some “tradition” that explains that too?"

You mean you've never heard of the tradition of getting married?

May I ask, where are you from?

49 posted on 09/21/2013 8:05:09 PM PDT by Heart-Rest (Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. Gal 6:7)
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To: NYer

1. How does the writer know Mary’s parents were elderly when she was born? Never read that in the Bible.

2. How did the writer know Joseph was much older than Mary? Where does it say THAT in the Bible? He may have been as much as ten years older, but if he were say 24 and she was 14 that wouldn’t seem that strange.

3. They were probably legally married prior to going to Bethlehem, most likely before Mary began to “show”, otherwise in the eyes of many Jesus most certainly would have been a bastard child, and would not even seem like Joseph’s at all. Maybe when the angel said “Do not be afraid to take Mary for your wife” Joseph took care of the legalities right away.

4. Joseph must have been quite a man to be able to deal with all of the above.


50 posted on 09/21/2013 8:06:41 PM PDT by madison10
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To: Salvation

Actually she said “mother of my Lord”. I don’t even understand what saying she’s the mother of THE Lord would mean except that Jesus had a beginning which is impossible.


51 posted on 09/21/2013 8:08:27 PM PDT by lasereye
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To: Heart-Rest

I haven’t heard of the tradition of people vowing to never have sex getting married.


52 posted on 09/21/2013 8:09:43 PM PDT by lasereye
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To: lasereye

So do you believe that Father, Son and Holy Spirit were present at the beginning of the World?


53 posted on 09/21/2013 8:10:35 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

Of course. Don’t you?


54 posted on 09/21/2013 8:11:17 PM PDT by lasereye
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To: lasereye

I know of several Saints who did just such a thing and consecrated their lives to God.

One is incorrupt — so to me, that says that it is not a sin.


55 posted on 09/21/2013 8:11:47 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: lasereye

Absolutely. All one has to do is read the beginning of Genisis. It’s there, but people sometimes don’t see it.


56 posted on 09/21/2013 8:13:32 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

My question is, what were Mary and Joseph’s motives for getting married vowing never to have sex, not some Saints you know of?

And where does the idea come from that vowing not to have sex inside a marriage has anything to do with consecrating one’s life to God? There’s nothing in the Jewish religion to suggest any such idea existed at any time.


57 posted on 09/21/2013 8:16:44 PM PDT by lasereye
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To: lasereye

we’ve had a thread about St. Joachim and St. Anne. After the birth of Mary, they vowed to live as brother and sister, if I remember correctly.

And that’s what I believe aobut Mary and Joseph.

I’m not a history buff on Judaism, so I can’t answer that question.


58 posted on 09/21/2013 8:20:34 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation
I think you mean for example "Let us make man in our image".

http://carm.org/christianity/christian-doctrine/let-us-make-man-our-image

59 posted on 09/21/2013 8:22:53 PM PDT by lasereye
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To: Salvation
Sts. Joachim and Anne, parents of the Virgin Mary, honored July 26 (Catholic Caucus)
The Discovery of the Saint Anne's Relics (Catholic Caucus)
[CATHOLIC CAUCUS] Traditional Feast Of Saint Joachim, Patriarch
Saint Anne and Saint Joachim
St. Roch - The Great Advocate of the Sign of the Cross (And More on St. Joachim) (Catholic Caucus)
The Life Of Saint Ann [and St.Joachim]
60 posted on 09/21/2013 8:24:46 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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