MegaChurch or Catholic Church?

taylormarshall.com ^ | August 26, 2013 | Dr. Taylor Marshall

[NYer]

Megachurch. Two young ladies. Both had left the Catholic Church. Both were now attending “megachurches.” We had a good chat together. I wanted to understand their reasons for why they left the Catholic Church for a megachurch.

Joel Osteen’s Lakewood Megachurch
43,500 weekly attendance

I was at the bank and somehow I got into a spiritual conversation with two Hispanic executives that worked there.

Why the Megachurch?

When I asked why they exchanged the Catholic Church for the megachurch, they gave me a number of reasons:

1. “My new church has an iPhone app. I can go on my iPhone and get Bible studies, sermons (video and audio). When I travel I can still watch the sermon, either live or later. I feel apart of the community.”
2. “The preaching is dynamic and speaks to my life. I find practical encouragement.”
3. “I felt judged at the Catholic Church.”
4. “People were not friendly or welcoming at the Catholic Church. The first time I went to my new church, I was welcomed by so many people.”
5. “My new church has classes and courses that are interesting and helpful.”
6. “The music is better.”
7. “In the Catholic Church, they use a lot of words that I did not understand.”
8. “People pray for each other and know each other (in the megachurch).”

Although these two ladies didn’t articulate it explicitly to me, I could tell that they were very proud of their new churches. I could also discern in them a surprise that I am so “spiritual” and yet I am very excited about being Catholic. They assumed the “with it” people were leaving Catholicism for the bigger and better and deal.

I asked them what they miss about being Catholic. They replied with two answers:

1. “There are not any crosses in my new church. I know it makes some people feel uncomfortable, but I wish we had crosses.”
2. “What will I do when I die?” They were both unclear about whether they could get anything like Last Rites at the megachurch.

What About the Eucharist?

I asked both about the Eucharist: “Don’t you miss the Eucharist?”

This question didn’t phase them one bit. “Oh we still have communion. They pass out little crackers and cups of juice. I like this better because I thought drinking from one big cup is icky. Spreads germs.”

“But in the Catholic Church,” I replied, “we believe that the Eucharist is the real Body and Blood of Jesus?”

I may as well have said, “Don’t you know that there are Martians in my back pocket.” She was unaware that the Catholic Church taught this. No idea.

The Problem

This, my brothers and sisters, is the crux of the problem. These girls were raised as Catholics, but did not know about the Eucharist. They did not know that the Eucharist is God. They did not understand the Holy Eucharist is the center of the Catholic tradition.

So when they compare our ho-hum Catholic music and pedestrian sermons to snazzy well produced musical productions and highly polished bulleted sermons from handsome professional speakers…where are they going to go?

If they had believed that the Holy Eucharist is truly the Lord Jesus Christ, then they would have stayed. This is the task of the New Evangelization if there is going to be one. Can we communicate the mystery of Eucharist. If we fail in that, everyone is leaving the building.

Godspeed,
Taylor

PS: I don’t mean to suggest that having the Holy Eucharist is an excuse for bad music, bad vestments, bad architecture, and bad sermons. The Eucharist is like a precious diamond. It deserves a platinum setting…not a plastic setting. We can’t say, “Well, we have the Eucharist – so you’re forced to stay and have a miserable experience every Sunday.” We can’t keep the sacraments hostage to mediocracy.

PPS: With 1 billion strong, the Catholic Church is the real megachurch!

Pope Francis at Rio de Janeiro
3 million people

[metmom]

LOL, the babies you carried were a part of you, just as Jesus was a part of Mary.

Humans don't reproduce by budding......

And the babies you carried weren’t Jesus, the Christ, the second person of the Holy Trinity, God made Man.

No kidding. they were separate beings, just like Jesus was a separate being from Mary.

Is it your belief that Jesus, once born of Mary no longer knew her or lived in her heart?

How could He live in her heart when He was physically here on earth in His body?

Was she just so much dross to be discarded once used?

That doesn't even deserve the honor of an answer.

Honestly, for the life of me, I cannot figure out what goes on in the minds of Catholics when they leap to such conclusions about others.

[HiTech RedNeck]

Sometimes more intense efforts have to be made to be spiritually effective in a given situation. Fasting can be one of the means. It doesn’t mean that’s the right thing in every single situation. Also, it’s perhaps an ill noted spiritual truth that demons are driven away with light. By exalting God in their faces. It does not work to try to curse a demon to hell. It’s already damned. It’s superfluous at best, and gives the demon a foothold over you at the worst.

[Elsie]

You made a claim, now back it up with the Scriptures you have read to support it.

I refer you back to your OWN comments; in the reply just above this.

How many places, in Scripture, would I have to post showing that all people die, before you'd accept the fact that Mary did as well?

I'll answer for you: None - for you CANNOT believe it and continue on the path you're on; a well worn path; trod by many travelers; safe, apparently from highwaymen and scoundrels.

[Elsie]

WHEN you find one; let ME know!

I might wanna go there for a while!

[Elsie]

So are Ignorance and Apathy.

[Jvette]

Thank you for at least posting what my actual words, yet never in any of those posts do I say that the Bible does not teach that Jesus is God.

The conversation was as to why Scripture calls Mary the mother of Jesus but not the mother of God and I pointed out, quite rightly that Scripture never says, outright, i.e. in plain words JESUS IS GOD!

I quite clearly say that we CAN KNOW from Scripture that JESUS IS GOD, but that those words are not found anywhere in Scripture.

When the pharisees say that Jesus is blaspheming it is because they assumed that Jesus when he said, “before Abraham was, I Am,” was saying that He is the God that they believed in.

We of course, know that that God is God the Father and not God the Son who is Jesus.

In the first post of mine, you omitted what came before. IN the second, also omitted much of the post. And, gee golly whiz, the third says exactly what I said, which does not even begin to suggest that the Bible doesn’t teach that Jesus is God.

Well, do not color me surprised. After all, that’s the same thing you do to Scripture.

[Elsie]

Of course, even in that you are wrong because in Luke, Elizabeth calls Mary the Mother of My Lord.

WAIT!!!

The point is that Scripture never calls Jesus God.

Lizzy!

You got some 'splainin' to do!

Which is it?

[Elsie]

The way in which the Church reached a conclusive understanding of those doctrines can be found in Acts.

Oh?

[Elsie]

Elsie, my friend, despite all the glee this display of papal sinfulness may provoke, it proves nothing,

Can you repeat this when one of your buds decides it's time to trash Luther again?

[Jvette]

****Honestly, for the life of me, I cannot figure out what goes on in the minds of Catholics when they leap to such conclusions about others. ****

Kettle meet pot. lol

Honestly after reading these last couple of posts from you, I thank God that I am not one of your babies and will certainly pray for those who are.

Budding? How about each child has 26 Chromosomes from their mother and 26 from their father, so yes, they are part of their mother and their father.

Christ had ALL OF HIS from his mother.

Why do you suppose Simeon said that a sword would pierce her heart?

[Elsie]

I assume you have a chapter and verse?

Did you not just write:

 

            The Eucharist --- the true food and true drink of the Lord's Supper --- is not dead; is not parts; and is not from a deceased human person.

 

???

Zombies eat LIVING flesh (Brains are the best - "let this mind be in you" and all that).

It ain't rocket surgery to say Catholics are ZOMBIES.

[Elsie]

Thanks for posting that.

I'm merely the talking ass.

GOD's word can SPEAK for itself.

(I think I read that somewhere... Isaiah 55:11)

[Elsie]

Have you ever thought about the Incarnation or what it means for God to unite with humanity?

No; not really.

After I read this - "Let us make man in our image" - I pretty much put it out of my mind.

[Elsie]

I’ve had a cradle Catholic who’s fallen away tell me “Catholics don’t read the Bible.” This was someone who heard the Bible read every Sunday at Mass and attended Catholic school where there were religion classes. How can such a disconnect be possible?

It's the same everywhere.

Do you REALLY think any of us PROTESTants learned all this stuff in CHURCH?!

We learned it on our OWN (with a little help from a Counselor)

[metmom]

I’ve had a cradle Catholic who’s fallen away tell me “Catholics don’t read the Bible.” This was someone who heard the Bible read every Sunday at Mass and attended Catholic school where there were religion classes. How can such a disconnect be possible?

It's not a disconnect. I never knew any Catholics who read the Bible until they were saved.

And there's a difference between hearing snippets of Scripture read once a week in church and sitting down and READING it, studying it, taking notes on it, memorizing it, and meditating on it.

[Iscool]

This can be seen in the Bible. For instance, the carved cherubim in the Temple are "images" of beings "in heaven above," but were not forbidden; they were in fact commanded. Almost all coins were stamped with the visages of persons (Jesus noted that the Roman coins bore the image of Caesar) but the use of coinage was not prohibited.

God makes the rules...If God doesn't want you to create images knowing the weakness of humanity, who are we to argue??? And if God wants these Cherubim on the Mercy Seat, who are we to question God???

[Elsie]

I’m not happy with the splintering of Christianity into a multitude of flavors and types.

Divide and conquer still works...

[Jvette]

Wrong in trying to make the distinction between calling Mary the mother of Jesus and calling her the mother of God.

We would have to go all the way back to the beginning of the conversation and follow through to see where the dialogue began and how it has gotten here.

There is a difference between the person that is God the Father and the person that is God the Son, though how that is possible is not spelled out in Scripture.

That is what I have been trying to convey. Apparently very very badly.

The God of the Jews, as they understood Him to be was not one God in three persons, so when I say that Scripture does not call Jesus God, it is this God that I am referring to.

It has been spelled out many times on this thread and others like it that Catholics do not believe that Mary is the mother of the God the Father or of the Holy Spirit.

She is the mother of Jesus who is God and that is why she is called the mother of God.

I suppose my ability to state what I am trying to impart is seriously flawed, but I do not take back the theology I was trying to explain.

[Elsie]

More?

[boatbums]

Nowhere in Scripture is Jesus called God. Through many passages we come to understand that He is indeed God, but nowhere does Scripture call Jesus, God.

What would you call these:

John 1:1-3
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Colossians 2:8-9
Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

John 20:28
And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.

Hebrews 1:8
But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

Titus 2:13
Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ.

Matthew 1:23
Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

That's only a few, there ARE more and as you said all the many verses that speak about Jesus being the incarnate Almighty God, second person of the Trinity and Son of God - which, since we know there is ONLY one God, Jesus IS God in the flesh.