If God chose to be a man, he chose also to continue his work through the men and women of his Church. He wants his saints to be intercessors between him and us. We ought to be in agreement on this, except that you would limit this work to living saints. Remember that saints means only “holy ones.” Jesus provided us an example of holiness. Who is a saint but one who imitates Christ? And of those who most perfectly imitate him are those who give up their lives proclaiming the faith, the martyrs. John describes them as well aware of the injustice that still prevails on earth. Are they “asleep,” too?
Duh!
Dead ones can't do ANYTHING!!!
Ecclesiastes 9:1-6
1 But all this I laid to heart, examining it all, how the righteous and the wise and their deeds are in the hand of God. Whether it is love or hate, man does not know; both are before him. 2 It is the same for all, since the same event happens to the righteous and the wicked, to the good and the evil, to the clean and the unclean, to him who sacrifices and him who does not sacrifice. As the good one is, so is the sinner, and he who swears is as he who shuns an oath. 3 This is an evil in all that is done under the sun, that the same event happens to all. Also, the hearts of the children of man are full of evil, and madness is in their hearts while they live, and after that they go to the dead. 4 But he who is joined with all the living has hope, for a living dog is better than a dead lion. 5 For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward, for the memory of them is forgotten. 6 Their love and their hate and their envy have already perished, and forever they have no more share in all that is done under the sun.
And yet; there seem to be those who would claim to smarter than the wisest man who ever lived...
Duh!
Dead ones can't do ANYTHING!!!
Ecclesiastes 9:1-6
1 But all this I laid to heart, examining it all, how the righteous and the wise and their deeds are in the hand of God. Whether it is love or hate, man does not know; both are before him. 2 It is the same for all, since the same event happens to the righteous and the wicked, to the good and the evil, to the clean and the unclean, to him who sacrifices and him who does not sacrifice. As the good one is, so is the sinner, and he who swears is as he who shuns an oath. 3 This is an evil in all that is done under the sun, that the same event happens to all. Also, the hearts of the children of man are full of evil, and madness is in their hearts while they live, and after that they go to the dead. 4 But he who is joined with all the living has hope, for a living dog is better than a dead lion. 5 For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward, for the memory of them is forgotten. 6 Their love and their hate and their envy have already perished, and forever they have no more share in all that is done under the sun.
And yet; there seem to be those who would claim to smarter than the wisest man who ever lived...
That type of reasoning to support an extra-Biblical practice is what cults must resort to, as the conclusion is simply without any actual support, and again reveals the extrapolation that RCs must resort to in attempting to provide some.
You must presume the Holy Spirit was either negligent or did not see it important even for such a fundamental practice to provide even one example of believers mentally praying to each other btwn earth and Heaven. Why does not "After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name." (Mt. 6:9) have another saying, "our Mother...." (or another believer).
Similarly, "I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ," likewise, "And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father." (Galatians 4:6) And that "Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus, " (Hebrews 10:19) is not be appended, "thru Mary and the saints in Heaven." And that of no saints it is said, "Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God," who "was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin; Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need. . (Heb. 4:14-16) "For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted." (Hebrews 2:18)
But the Holy Spirit was not negligent, but consistent in teaching and abundantly showing that the Lord alone is the direct heavenly object of prayer, and resorting to arguments from silence and extrapolating support based upon earthly relations for something without actual support and contrary to what is exampled simply will not do as a basis for doctrine.
Moreover, this type of attempt is counterproductive, for the fact is that for RCs Scriptural substantiation is not the basis for veracity, and RC attempts trying to wrangle support from Scripture for PTDS exposes it to be a tradition of men and not of Scripture, and such attempts are repulsive to those who hold Scripture as supreme and sufficient as the standard for obedience and testing truth claims.
And of those who most perfectly imitate him are those who give up their lives proclaiming the faith, the martyrs. John describes them as well aware of the injustice that still prevails on earth. Are they “asleep,” too? The text (Rv. 6:9,10) does not necessarily indicate they were well aware of what was happening on earth, but due to what happened to them they inquire when justice will prevail, yet regardless, this does not make them heavenly objects of prayer or endow them with the power to hear infinite amounts of prayer and respond to them.
In addition, disagreeing that the deceased believers are to be prayed to does not equate to soul sleep. The will rest from their labors, (Rv. 14:13) but that does not mean they are not conscious in Heaven, which i have been spending much time defending on another FR thread.
“He wants his saints to be intercessors between him and us”
Robby,
Are you really that ignorant of Scripture?
My gosh, man!!