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To: fwdude; fidelis
"Do this in remeberance of me," pretty much sums up everything He intended to mean.

Indeed it does ... except, you bolded the wrong text. DO THIS is not a suggestion; it is a command.

John 6:30 begins a colloquy that took place in the synagogue at Capernaum. The Jews asked Jesus what sign he could perform so that they might believe in him. As a challenge, they noted that "our ancestors ate manna in the desert." Could Jesus top that? He told them the real bread from heaven comes from the Father. "Give us this bread always," they said. Jesus replied, "I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me will never hunger, and whoever believes in me will never thirst." At this point the Jews understood him to be speaking metaphorically.

Jesus first repeated what he said, then summarized: "‘I am the living bread which came down from heaven; if any one eats of this bread, he will live for ever; and the bread which I shall give for the life of the world is my flesh.’ The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, ‘How can this man give us his flesh to eat?’" (John 6:51–52).

His listeners were stupefied because now they understood Jesus literally—and correctly. He again repeated his words, but with even greater emphasis, and introduced the statement about drinking his blood: "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in you; he who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. For my flesh is food indeed, and my blood is drink indeed. He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him" (John 6:53–56).

Notice that Jesus made no attempt to soften what he said, no attempt to correct "misunderstandings," for there were none. Our Lord’s listeners understood him perfectly well. They no longer thought he was speaking metaphorically. If they had, if they mistook what he said, why no correction?

On other occasions when there was confusion, Christ explained just what he meant (cf. Matt. 16:5–12). Here, where any misunderstanding would be fatal, there was no effort by Jesus to correct. Instead, he repeated himself for greater emphasis.

In John 6:60 we read: "Many of his disciples, when they heard it, said, ‘This is a hard saying; who can listen to it?’" These were his disciples, people used to his remarkable ways. He warned them not to think carnally, but spiritually: "It is the Spirit that gives life, the flesh is of no avail; the words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life" (John 6:63; cf. 1 Cor. 2:12–14).

But he knew some did not believe. (It is here, in the rejection of the Eucharist, that Judas fell away; look at John 6:64.) "After this, many of his disciples drew back and no longer went about with him" (John 6:66).

This is the only record we have of any of Christ’s followers forsaking him for purely doctrinal reasons. If it had all been a misunderstanding, if they erred in taking a metaphor in a literal sense, why didn’t he call them back and straighten things out? Both the Jews, who were suspicious of him, and his disciples, who had accepted everything up to this point, would have remained with him had he said he was speaking only symbolically.

But he did not correct these protesters. Twelve times he said he was the bread that came down from heaven; four times he said they would have "to eat my flesh and drink my blood." John 6 was an extended promise of what would be instituted at the Last Supper—and it was a promise that could not be more explicit.

So, what did the early christians believe? Ignatius of Antioch, who had been a disciple of the apostle John and who wrote a letter to the Smyrnaeans about A.D. 110, said, referring to "those who hold heterodox opinions," that "they abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer, because they do not confess that the Eucharist is the flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ, flesh which suffered for our sins and which the Father, in his goodness, raised up again" (6:2, 7:1).

orty years later, Justin Martyr, wrote, "Not as common bread or common drink do we receive these; but since Jesus Christ our Savior was made incarnate by the word of God and had both flesh and blood for our salvation, so too, as we have been taught, the food which has been made into the Eucharist by the Eucharistic prayer set down by him, and by the change of which our blood and flesh is nourished, . . . is both the flesh and the blood of that incarnated Jesus" (First Apology 66:1–20).

25 posted on 06/02/2013 2:14:43 PM PDT by NYer ( "Run from places of sin as from the plague."--St John Climacus)
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To: NYer
Indeed it was a command, and I in no way discounted the value of communion among the saints here on earth. I know of no biblical Protestant body that does NOT practice communion, very much the way Christ demonstrated it.

But if the Eucharist were as central to Christian life and belief as the RCC contends, and if the RCC reportedly chose all of the books that went into Scripture, why are the New Testament writings so completely devoid of mention of this practice and the importance of implementing it?

The text that you mention in which Christ calls himself the True Manna from Heaven proves nothing of the truth of transubstantiation. If that were the case, then anyone who eats of the Eucharist only once would "never hunger" again - would never have need of consuming the bread and wine a second time. But the RCC REQUIRES that the Mass be celebrated again and again and that communion is necessary again and again to accumulate grace - not for as yet uninitiated converts, but for existing adherents, even if they had taken communion a thousand times before. It can never be enough. So, what Christ meant by being Manna had to have been a spiritual metaphor, no less real than the eating of bread, but permanently effective in a one-time act of obedience.

28 posted on 06/02/2013 2:32:45 PM PDT by fwdude ( You cannot compromise with that which you must defeat.)
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To: NYer

Excellent post. Thank you.


43 posted on 06/02/2013 4:07:07 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: NYer

Thank you for your wonderful post(s) & explanation(s), they have helped me a great deal, wishing you all the Blessings of the Body of Christ...


174 posted on 06/03/2013 8:23:10 AM PDT by HurriKane (You will suffer in the world. But take courage! I have overcome the world.)
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