Posted on 05/05/2013 10:16:01 AM PDT by NYer
Are you saved?
Have you ever been asked this question? Has anyone ever told you that Catholics think they can work their way into Heaven?
The Catholic Church does not now, nor has it ever, taught a doctrine of salvation by works - that we can “work” our way into Heaven. And, the Bible does not teach that we are saved by “faith alone.” The only place in all of Scripture where the phrase “Faith Alone” appears, is in James 2:24, where it says that we are not justified (or saved) by faith alone. However, if works have nothing to do with our salvation, then how come every passage in the New Testament that talks about judgment says we will be judged by our works, not by whether or not we have faith alone? (See Rom 2, Matthew 15 and 16, 1 Ptr 1, Rev 20 and 22, 2 Cor 5, and many, many more verses).
If we are saved by faith alone, why does 1 Cor 13:13 say that love is greater than faith? Shouldn’t it be the other way around?
As Catholics we believe that we are saved by God’s grace alone. We can do nothing, apart from God’s grace, to receive the free gift of salvation. We also believe, however, that we have to respond to God’s grace. Protestants believe that, too. However, many Protestants believe that the only response necessary is an act of faith; whereas, Catholics believe a response of "faith and works" is necessary, or, as the Bible puts it in Galatians 5:6, “For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumsion is of any avail, but faith working through love." (Just as the Church teaches.)
St. Paul said he needed to work out his salvation with "fear and trembling." If anyone professed their faith in Jesus it was Paul. If he felt so assured of his salvation because of his faith alone in Jesus, why then would he be trembling, and have to work out his salvation?
So, the next time someone asks you if you are saved, the Catholic should reply:
As the Bible says, I am already saved (Rom. 8:24, Eph. 2:5–8), but I’m also being saved (1 Cor. 1:8, 2 Cor. 2:15, Phil. 2:12), and I have the hope that I will be saved (Rom. 5:9–10, 1 Cor. 3:12–15). Like the apostle Paul I am working out my salvation in fear and trembling (Phil. 2:12), with hopeful confidence in the promises of Christ (Rom. 5:2, 2 Tim. 2:11–13)." ♥
“Regarding the debate about faith and works: It’s like asking which blade in a pair of scissors is most important.”
~C.S. Lewis
John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
1 John 5:13
I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.
John 10:28
I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.
Romans 10:13
For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”
John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
1 John 5:11-13
And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.
1 John 2:3-4
And by this we know that we have come to know him, if we keep his commandments. Whoever says “I know him” but does not keep his commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him,
Ephesians 2:8-9
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Romans 8:1
There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.
John 6:37
All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.
Romans 8:16
The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,
Acts 2:38-39
And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself.”
Acts 2:21
And it shall come to pass that everyone who calls upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.’
John 10:27-30
My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand. I and the Father are one.”
Titus 3:5
He saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,
John 20:31
But these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.
John 1:12
But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God,
1 John 5:4
For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.
John 6:39
And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day.
"These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God". (1 John 5:13).
Yes, I know that I am saved! I have that certainty!
From lots of Protestant Bibles too!
| ◄ John 6:53 ► |
|
|||
But if we were baptized as a child, then we continually, every month or six weeks put ourselves on a schedule for the Sacrament of Penance/Reconciliation. Some people call it Confession.
We know we are sinners and must always seek the forgiveness of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit that we received in Baptism through this sacrament.
Then baptism did not really save anyone.
Hebrews 7:25 Consequently, he is able to save to the uttermost those who draw near to God through him, since he always lives to make intercession for them.
Hebrews 9:15 Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant.
Hebrews 9:24-29 24 For Christ has entered, not into holy places made with hands, which are copies of the true things, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God on our behalf. 25 Nor was it to offer himself repeatedly, as the high priest enters the holy places every year with blood not his own, 26 for then he would have had to suffer repeatedly since the foundation of the world. But as it is, he has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself. 27 And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment, 28 so Christ, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time, not to deal with sin but to save those who are eagerly waiting for him.
Hebrews 10:14-18 14 For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified. 15 And the Holy Spirit also bears witness to us; for after saying, 16 “This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws on their hearts, and write them on their minds,” 17 then he adds, “I will remember their sins and their lawless deeds no more.” 18 Where there is forgiveness of these, there is no longer any offering for sin.
John 10:27-29 27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. 28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand.
John 3:16 16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
Note that Jesus says in John 3:16, that those who believe HAVE eternal life. Possess it at the present time. They HAVE it before the die and He promises in John 10 that we will never lose our salvation.
There's no need for continual working to keep it by baptism and *reconciliation*.
Believers have already been reconciled and are sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.
**Then baptism did not really save anyone.**
Yes it did. What about the baby that dies at two months after it was baptized at one month?
What about the child that falls and is accidentally killed before he/she reaches the age of reason.
What about the person on their deathbed who is baptized by the priest visiting them? They also are saved.
What about someone like me who went in for a heart procedure this last week, but received the Sacrament of the Anointing of the Sin which removes all sin. If I had died on the doctor’s table, all the sin would have been gone?
Think about the Sacraments, please. You’re a smart lady and I know you are familiar with these facts.
Or check out my FR homepage for more information on the Sacraments.
**Then baptism did not really save anyone.**
I forgot one.
What about the adult convert who is baptized at the Easter Vigil — all the sins washed away, and then is killed in an auto accident on the way home? Or even the next week?
See post 46 for some verses on certainly of salvation.
Here are some more....
Ephesians 1:13-14 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, 14 who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory.
Ephesians 4:30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.
2 Corinthians 1:21-23 21 And it is God who establishes us with you in Christ, and has anointed us, 22 and who has also put his seal on us and given us his Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee.
2Corinthians 5:17-19 17 Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come. 18 All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us the ministry of reconciliation; 19 that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation.
I have a Ph.D. in Theology from a Jesuit University, and my B.A. and M.A. from well-known Evangelical colleges. I have taught theology on the college-level, and have numerous published books on biblical and theological subjects. After a lifetime of reflection and experience, here is my two cents:
I believe in the ecumenical creeds of the Church.
I believe in salvation by faith.
I also believe that “faith without works is dead.”
It seems to me (as an Evangelical) that the Catholic concern for seeing the “fruit” of salvation in someones life “for we were saved unto good works...” is wholly biblical.
Unfortunately, many who belong to the Catholic Church, as well as in Protestant denominations, lack any evidence of true faith. I do not believe that membership in any church guarantees salvation, which requires a personal commitment to Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior - and Jesus is “Lord” when we obey what He says: “Why do you call me Lord when you do not do what I say?”
Those who uncharitably attack other Christians on this forum are thereby revealing their spiritual immaturity: “But the wisdom from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, reasonable, full of mercy and good fruits, unwavering, without hypocrisy” (James 3:17)
Finally, my hope and prayer is that Christians will agree regarding our shared faith in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, and present a united front (as much as possible) in an increasingly hostile world.
Thank you, those are relevant
Catholics believe in Jesus as their Lord and savior. That isn’t even remotely debatable. Every other argument is purely over practice.
So, the only real question for any Christian who says, “I was saved.” is to ask, “Do you trust God, your Father, to follow through on that?”
Psalm 23: “HE leads me in paths of righteousness for HIS name’s sake...”
1 John 1: “If we confess our sins, HE is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all our uncleanness.”
The bottom line is this: it’s ALL of grace.
Here's a question for you.
And what is the question?
As I told you, I already watched and heard your Pentecostal Catholic on the internet...And, I already told you that your Charismatic Catholic has nothing to offer a born again Christian or anyone else for that matter...
You’d do better to melt down the CD and try to turn it into something usefull...
"For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren." (Romans 8:29)
(But practically speaking, currently undergoing much needed processing)
People really need to read the whole context of the passage:
Php 2:13 for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure.
Php 2:14 Do all things without grumbling or disputing,
Php 2:15 that you may be blameless and innocent, children of God without blemish in the midst of a crooked and twisted generation, among whom you shine as lights in the world,
Php 2:16 holding fast to the word of life, so that in the day of Christ I may be proud that I did not run in vain or labor in vain.
It is God who works in us. God is the true engine for all things. And in verse 13 Paul tells us that 1) God enacts His will in us, and 2) God works through us for His pleasure. We become His servants or slaves as Romans states. This is exact the total OPPOSITE of losing one's salvation.
As noted in verse 14 and part of 15. Once we become Christians we are to submit to God's will-not ours. We are to rejoice in all things because it is the will of God for us and He is working through us. We trust Him because this is His promise to us-that we will bear good fruit. And that is a promise to all Christians-whether we can see that fruit or not. We are lights shining in darkness. So, in good times and in bad, whether we get that promotion or not, we rejoice because God means it for our good though we might not understand why.
When we grumble or complain, we bring disrepute on God. We simply show that we don't trust Him. We don't trust His will for our lives and we don't trust that He's working through us. This is reflected in our behavior and shows a poor testimony to the world. Our light to the world is diminished.
The whole letter of Philippians is about rejoicing and being glad in the mist of struggles and adversity.
This is a very difficult lesson for Christians-probably the most difficult. And, considering God has called us and is working very hard through us, we should be fearful and tremble simply so that we don't bring shame to His holy name. Not because we fear we'll lose our salvation. But simply because of our love for the Father.
All the while, Catholics know they do not have eternal life and will not have eternal life unless they pass the test after they die...
That's easy. 2 Cor. 5:14-21.
In part, "And all things are of God, who hath RECONCILED US to HIMSELF BY JESUS CHRIST, and hath COMMITTED UNTO US THE WORD OF RECONCILIATION. Now then we are AMBASSADORS for Christ, as though God did beseech you BY US; we PRAY YOU IN CHRIST'S STEAD, BE YE RECONCILED TO GOD. For he hath made him to be sin FOR US, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him."
And what else might God want us to be?
2 Timothy 2:15. "STUDY to shew thyself APPROVED UNTO GOD, a workman that needeth NOT TO BE ASHAMED, RIGHTLY DIVIDING THE WORD OF TRUTH."
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.