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To: verga
Any first year Greek student will tell you that...

LOL, I'm not interested in what a n00b student can tell me.

God gave the job of understanding scripture to the Holy Spirit and that's good enough for me.

The better translation into English would have been "This is the body which is Me."

Yea maybe when in your first year of Greek School. But the Bible is quite clear, and it would NOT be as you say.

"Feel free to have the last word...[I don't play the "last word" game"]

"The reason I rarely waste time with these discussions is that when I was a protestant I was not willing to listen to the truth... [That's called hard heartedness in the Bible. Maybe that is why you seem to believe that all Protestants are the same as you were. Not so much.] until the Holy Spirit moved me. [That's the ticket and the key to understanding Truth and the scriptures.] I have learned that most Prots have the exact same mind set. [Probably not most, but if you have to believe that to support your beliefs, that is fine with me.]That is not a personal attack it is a simple statement of fact. [Well not really, but if you must believe it that is fine with me]

Oh BTW, being as you answered my question, I will answer yours.

I believe you stated that I claim to be a Christian, and if I am not Catholic "exactly" what am I?

Well to understand that my claim to be a Christian means that I am born again (from above) and am saved by Jesus and have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.

Everyone that is a part of His church here on earth must fit that criteria. Both Jesus and Peter agree on that, it's in the Bible.

Now back to communion, which is very simple.

Jesus took the bread and broke it and said this is my body, it is broken just for you. (or something like that)

This is My body, take and eat.

Now if it was literally His body, why would he use bread?

If they were ACTUALLY to eat His body, I would imagine he would hold out his arm for them to take a bite.

Heck, he was right there!

It's a spiritual thing, Jesus is the Bread of Life and to partake of that bread we are to be one with Him...He in us and us in Him.

Take up your cross daily and follow Him.

When we take communion, the person serving it says "this the body of Christ, take and eat. This is the blood of Christ, take and drink." And it is and we do.

And we do so in "remembrance" of Him. Exactly as He asked us to-- Luke 22:19

136 posted on 03/19/2013 1:07:12 PM PDT by Syncro (Hebrews 11:1-Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen)
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To: Syncro
LOL, I'm not interested in what a n00b student can tell me. God gave the job of understanding scripture to the Holy Spirit and that's good enough for me. The better translation into English would have been "This is the body which is Me." Yea maybe when in your first year of Greek School. But the Bible is quite clear, and it would NOT be as you say.

You are (or should be) that the New Testament was originally written in Greek. Most of it was written in Koine or what is commonly called "attic" Greek.

To get the clearest understanding of what is intended you should whenever possible use primary languages. Second ANY translation no matter how faithful will colored by the biases of the translator, if we use the primary language we are not subject to those biases.

Jesus took the bread and broke it and said this is my body, it is broken just for you. (or something like that)

Thank you for a perfect example proving my point. Words mean things and the Word of God means very specific things not "something like that."

Believing that God said "something like that" Led Eve to eat the forbidden fruit. If God said it I want to know exactly what he said.

Now if it was literally His body, why would he use bread?

I am not claiming to know either the heart or mind of God, but the Bible is filled with examples of God using "material" for His purposes. Right from the start He created the entire universe from nothing, yet when he created man he used the mud from the earth. When He created woman He could have done it from nothing or He could have done it from the ground again, instead chose to use one of Adams ribs.

He had Samson use the jawbone of an ass to slay the Philistines.

In John 9 Jesus used mud to heal the man born blind from birth. He could have just snapped His fingers. He allowed the woman with the hemorrhage to be healed by touching His cloak. Jesus is not adverse to using parts of creation to connect us to Him.

As to why bread specifically. This goes back to Chapter 12 of Exodus, three things are consumed, the lamb, bitter herbs and unleavened bread.

Later in the desert (Chapter 16)they are given the manna for forty years. In 16:32 he commanded them to keep an omerful and that was placed in the Ark with Aaron's staff and the Tablets.

There something that you need to understand and I don't want you to take my word for this. There is a website called "Ask Moses" which is staffed 24/7 by Rabbi's Ask for one that is an expert on the meaning of the Passover. The Jewish understanding of the Passover is that today 2400 plus years later when they celebrate Passover they are actually participating in the original one. For them the term: "Do this in remembrance..." is not a simple recollection it is an actual participation in the event.

In light of that when Jesus tells the Apostles that "This is My Body" and Do this in remembrance of me" He is giving them very specific instructions. If you combine this with John 6 and His inistanace that He IS the bread from heaven and must be consumed to have eternal life that leads to only one conclusion. It really is His Body and Precious Blood.

I might also suggest that you take the time to read "The Fourth Cup" and "The Lambs Supper" by Scott Hahn. I also Strongly Recommend "Not by Bread Alone" by Robert Sungenis. Both of them do a much better job of explaining than I do and are able to go into much more depth and detail.

I apologize for the length of this post, but it is something i don't treat lightly.

138 posted on 03/19/2013 4:03:33 PM PDT by verga (A nation divided by Zero!)
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