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To: Colofornian
The nonsensical fallback of "Paul says in the NT" or "Jesus says in the NT" shows how theologically inept (and more importantly) historically inept so many holier-than-thou christians are:
Jesus and his disciples didn't travel the Galilean and Israeli backroads with a jewel-encrusted New Testament under each arm, nor did they go quoting the King James verses as they taught Torah and Kingdom Ethics to lost Jews.
Jesus and the disciples taught to other Jews using Torah and Tanakh, and it was the Torah and Tanakh interpretations of the 2nd Temple period.
All christianity teaches is that somehow man-made doctrine (that neither Jesus nor his disciples ever taught) somehow supersedes the fact that they taught from Torah and Tanakh.
And here we are, 2,000 years later with 5,000+ different denominations with all their thousands of different man-made doctrines….and yet so many christians can so easily cast stones at Mormons or others because their beliefs are "so radical".
The irony is sickeningly thick.
14 posted on 02/22/2013 3:19:35 PM PST by brent13a
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To: brent13a
The nonsensical fallback of "Paul says in the NT" or "Jesus says in the NT" shows how theologically inept (and more importantly) historically inept so many holier-than-thou christians are: (Brent said, with all the "holier-than-thouness" he could possibly muster)

Jesus and his disciples didn't travel the Galilean and Israeli backroads with a jewel-encrusted New Testament under each arm, nor did they go quoting the King James verses as they taught Torah and Kingdom Ethics to lost Jews.

Well, of course, Jesus quoted the TORAH and the N'VI'IM (former/latter prophets) & the K'TUVIM (Writings).

But ya know...He didn't have to...based upon His authority alone:

* 25 “Who are you?” they asked. “Just what I have been telling you from the beginning,” Jesus replied. 26 “I have much to say in judgment of you. But he who sent me is trustworthy, and what I have heard from him I tell the world.” 27 They did not understand that he was telling them about his Father. 28 So Jesus said, “When you have lifted up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am he and that I do nothing on my own but speak just what the Father has taught me. (Jesus, John 8:25-29)

* 28 When Jesus had finished saying these things, the crowds were amazed at his teaching, 29 because he taught as one who had authority, and not as their teachers of the law. (Matthew 7:28-29)

* 6 But I want you to know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins.” So he said to the paralyzed man, “Get up, take your mat and go home.” 7 Then the man got up and went home. 8 When the crowd saw this, they were filled with awe; and they praised God, who had given such authority to man. (Matthew 9:6-8)

* 18 Then Jesus came to them and said, All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.

Beyond that, what do you think Jesus was referencing -- and then even expanding with great authority -- re: His Sermon on the Mount?

* Matthew 5:21-22 re: murder: “You have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘You shall not murder, and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment.’ 22 But I tell you...
* Matthew 5:27-28 re: adultery: “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ 28 But I tell you...
* Matthew 5:31-32 re: divorce: “It has been said, ‘Anyone who divorces his wife must give her a certificate of divorce.’ 32 But I tell you...
* Matthew 5:33-34 re: Oaths: “Again, you have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘Do not break your oath, but fulfill to the Lord the vows you have made.’ 34 But I tell you...
* Matthew 5:38-39 re: Eye for eye, tooth for tooth: “You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’ 39 But I tell you...
* Matthew 5:43-44 re: love for enemies: “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you...

Brent...let's not have any attempted neutral "middle ground" here...either what Jesus says above is all true; or else He's a liar or false prophet. No mere "great teacher" could be mistaken about all of the above...

Which of those two possibilities do you favor at this time in your life?

16 posted on 02/22/2013 4:03:15 PM PST by Colofornian
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To: brent13a
The nonsensical fallback of "Paul says in the NT" or "Jesus says in the NT" shows how theologically inept (and more importantly) historically inept so many holier-than-thou christians are:

Getting anyone to fight yet?

17 posted on 02/22/2013 4:41:29 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: brent13a; All
And here we are, 2,000 years later with 5,000+ different denominations with all their thousands of different man-made doctrines….and yet so many christians can so easily cast stones at Mormons or others because their beliefs are "so radical". The irony is sickeningly thick.

Oh...so you mean all these Judaistic groups have been doctrinally united for these past up to 2,000 years or so...or the off-shoots listed below have all "come home" to THE ONE TRUE DOCTRINAL JUDAISM, eh Brent??? (Well, that's good to know!)

Presenting...
...Brent's "Doctrinally United" Judaism:
...Sadducees,
...Pharisees,
...Essenes,
...Zealots,
...Karaite Judaism,
...Sephardic Judaism,
...Mizrahi Judaism,
...Hasidic Judaism (followers of Israel ben Eliezer)
...Mitnagdim Judaism,
...Hasidim/Baal Shem Tov ("pious"/"happy" ones),
...Ashkenazim Judaism (German),
...Haredi Judaism,
...Masorti Judaism,
...Reform/Progressive Judaism,
...Orthodox Judaism,
...Haskalah Judaism (followers of Moses Mendelssohn)
...Reconstructionist Judaism,
...Classical Reform Judaism,
...Neolog Judaism,
...Jewish Renewal,
...Humanist Judaism (Rabbi Sherwin Wine)
...Jewish Science (the counterpart to "Christian" Science)
...Post-denominational Jews,
...Chabad-focused (Noachide) law-abiding Jews...
...and even smaller groups I've shot past...
...along with diverse Messianic components...

Whew!!!! Talk about "sickenly thick...irony"!!!!

I mean in during Jesus' day, some Judaistic sects believed in a resurrection; others didn't; some supported "civil disobedience" (zealots), others didn't; some believed in marriage & having kids, others -- like the Essenes -- didn't; some OT kings routed false worship centers in their midst; many kings in a row didn't! Some embraced polygamy; others didn't! Some embraced concubines as "sub-wives"; others didn't.

And you are supposedly preaching from some "purity-supposed 'higher' ground?"

18 posted on 02/22/2013 4:44:31 PM PST by Colofornian
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