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To: krghou

**the aorist imperative denotes a command (yes),**

It was a command alright, but there was no indication that they received the Spirit at that moment. Nevertheless, they would definitely receive the gift of the Spirit in the near future, fulfilling the Lord’s command. And why would he command them to tarry in Jerusalem for the promised Spirit if they already had it?

Jesus Christ told Nicodemas that he needed to be born of water, and of the Spirit, explaining the “the wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou HEAREST the SOUND thereof, but CANST NOT tell whence it cometh, or whither it goeth: so is EVERY ONE that is born of the Spirit”. John 3:8

He also taught that “He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.” (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receivce: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified) John 7:38,39

He told his disciples that “..if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you: but if I depart, I will SEND him unto you.” John 16:7

Well, he ascended up to heaven, and a few weeks later the Holy Ghost was indeed sent; and his church established.


66 posted on 02/06/2013 5:05:20 PM PST by Zuriel (Acts 2:38,39....nearly 2,000 years and still working today!)
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To: Zuriel

OK - I’m pretty sure I understand what you are trying to say.

Here are some things I think make that interpretation difficult, but not necessarily impossible.

1) in John 20:22, it says he breathed on them, and said to them, receive ye the holy spirit. Obviously the breathing on them happened at the time Jesus was speaking, so it makes for awkward interpretation, just reading the verse, that the receiving of the holy ghost was to occur many days in the future. The easiest interpretation of the verse is that Jesus breathed on them and then immediately they received the holy spirit. The greek verb tense also supports this. There is no command to wait in Jerusalem at this point, because they will be in Galilee in John 21.

2) after this, In John 21, Jesus appeared to them in Galilee

3) Most, if not all of the quotes that refer to the coming of the holy spirit at pentecost, (acts 1:4, luke 24:49) tell the disciples to tarry in jerusalem and wait for the promise of the father. This clearly occurred after the first John 20 incident, since they went to Galilee after John 20 and before acts:4 and luke 24:49.

So if I approach it without preconceived notions the easiest interpretation is:
1) Jesus breathed on them and they received the holy spirit
2) They went to galilee and met jesus there
3) They came back to Jerusalem and met Jesus again before he ascended. Here he gave them the command to tarry and wait for the Holy Spirit again. This second event seems in context to be associated with the power to minister.

I can see your point, but I can’t get it from reading the scriptures unless I start with the premise there is only one occurrence. The plain reading with two occurrences is still easier for me to fit to the text.


67 posted on 02/06/2013 6:16:18 PM PST by krghou
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To: Zuriel

There is discernment between having a new human spirit, made alive by God, and being indwelt by God the Holy Spirit. The indwelling uses the human spirit as a dwelling place and is determined by God’s Volition, also called His Sovereignty, not by ours.

Believers are those with faith in what God provides. God decides where He dwells.

Doctrines of the Shekinah Glory, the Tabernacle, and Indwelling of the Holy Spirit apply.


71 posted on 02/06/2013 7:50:37 PM PST by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
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