“A Lutheran Ordinariate? That’s a Bad Sign”

La Stampa-Vatican Insider ^ | 1-22-13 | Alessandro Speciale

[marshmallow]

The Secretary of the International Lutheran Federation has rejected the proposal presented again about a day or so ago by the Prefect of the former Holy Office

An ordinariate for Lutherans who wish to re-enter into communion with the Vatican, whilst preserving their traditions at least partially? The idea of extending the solution offered by Pope Benedict XVI to groups of traditionalist Anglicans to followers of Martin Luther was suggested for the first time by the President of the Pontifical Council for Christian Unity, Cardinal Kurt Koch.

But just as the proposal is being put forward again by the Prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Mgr. Gerhard Ludwig Müller, it is beginning to trigger heated protests and concerns among the Catholic Church’s ecumenical partners –as happened with the Anglican Church.

The creation of an ordinariate – intended for those groups of Anglicans that wish to join the Catholic Church but also maintain their own identity – was “not Rome’s idea; it originates in the Anglican Church,” Koch said last 30 October. “The Holy Father looked for a solution and found a wide-reaching one which took into account the Anglican Church’s ecclesial and liturgical traditions. If the Lutherans made a similar request - he went on to say - we will have to consider their situation carefully. But the initiative remains in the hands of the Lutherans.”

The issue was recently addressed by Mgr. Müller. The German theologian chosen by Pope Benedict XVI to lead the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, recognised that the “Lutheran world is different to the Anglican one because Anglicanism has always had an element that is closer to Catholicism.” But this would not stop the Church from allowing Lutheran groups to convert to Catholicism, preserving “legitimate traditions developed” over the......

[Claud]

What’s Kumbaya in German? ;)

[Salvation]

Wrong. The Bishops along with other Christians were against Obama's election four years ago. Here's a collection of 2009 names for you. I can give you the HHS list too if you wish.

Over 100 Bishops Have Spoken Out on Priority of Life Issues
Posted on October 28, 2008, 11:59 AM | Deal W. Hudson

The list of U. S. bishops who have spoken out on the priority of the life issues in this election is now over 100. The list now contains 70 individual bishops and three joint statements.

I would like to continue updating this list until the day of the election. I have tried to incorporate all the comments thus far. If I dd not get them all, I apologize. (For a few of the suggestions, I could not find a suitable link.)

Please continue using the comments section to let us know what bishop is not on this list who should be. This would include any bishop who has individually, or jointly, published a statement about this election pointing out the primacy of the life issues.

Thank you for your help.

1. Archbishop Charles Chaput of Denver

2. Bishop James Conley, auxiliary of Denver

3. Archbishop Donald Wuerl of Washington, D.C.

4. Justin Cardinal Rigali of Philadelphia, chairman of the Committee on Pro-Life Activities

5. Bishop William Lori of Bridgeport, chairman of the Committee on Doctrine

6. Edward Cardinal Egan of New York

7. Bishop Samuel Aquila of Fargo

8. Bishop David Zubik of Pittsburgh

9. Bishop Michael Sheridan of Colorado Springs

10. Archbishop Jose Gomez of San Antonio

11. Bishop Oscar Cantu, auxiliary of San Antonio

12. Bishop William Murphy of Rockville Centre

13. Bishop Edward Slattery of Tulsa

14. Bishop Kevin Farrell of Dallas

15. Bishop Gregory Aymond of Austin

16. Sean Cardinal O'Malley of Boston

17. Bishop Thomas Wenski of Orlando

18. Archbishop John Nienstedt of Saint Paul/Minneapolis

19. Francis Cardinal George of Chicago, President of the USCCB

20. Bishop Robert Vasa of Baker

21. Bishop Jerome Listecki of La Crosse

22. Bishop Richard Lennon of Cleveland

23. Bishop Ralph Nickless of Sioux City

24. Archbishop George Niederauer of San Francisco

25. Bishop Glen Provost of Lake Charles, LA

26. Bishop Nicholas DiMarzio of Brooklyn

27. Bishop Joseph F. Martino of Scranton

28. Archbishop Raymond Burke, Prefect of the Apostolic Signatura

30. Bishop Peter J. Jugis of Charlotte

31. Bishop Michael F. Burbidge of Raleigh

32. Archbishop Joseph Naumann of Kansas City, KS

33. Bishop Robert Finn of Kansas City-St. Joseph, MO

34. Bishop Robert C. Morlino of Madison, WS
35. Bishop Ronald Gilmore of Dodge City, KS
36. Bishop Paul Coakley of Salina, KS
37. Bishop Michael Jackels of Wichita
38. Bishop Gerald M. Barbarito of Palm Beach
39. Bishop Kevin W. Vann of Fort Worth

40. Bishop Rene H. Gracida, retired, of Corpus Christi

41. Daniel Cardinal DiNardo of Houston

42. Bishop Paul S. Loverde of Arlington

43. Bishop Francis X. DiLorenzo of Richmond

44. Bishop William Murphy of Rockville Center

45. Bishop Robert McManus of Worcester

46. Bishop Arthur Serratelli of Patterson

47. Bishop Robert Herrmann of St. Louis

48. Archbishop Edwin O'Brien of Baltimore

49. Bishop Thomas J. Olmsted of Phoenix

50. Bishop Thomas D. Doran of Rockford

51. Bishop Joseph A. Galante of Camden

52. Bishop Robert J. Baker of Birmingham

53. Archbishop Alexander J. Brunett of Seattle

54. Bishop J. Peter Sartain of Joliet

55. Bishop John M. Smith of Trenton

56. Bishop Earl Boyea of Lansing

57. Bishop Leonard R. Blair of Toledo

58. Bishop Frances J. Dewane of Venice

59. Bishop W. Frances Malooly of Wilmington

60. Bishop Robert Morlino of Madison

61. Bishop John Yanta , retired, of Amarillo

62. Bishop James V. Johnston of Springfield-Cape Girardeau

63. Archbishop John Vlazny of Portland

64. Bishop Blase J. Cupich of Rapid City

65. Bishop Lawrence Brandt of Greensburg

66. Bishop Dennis M. Schnurr of Cincinatti

67. Bishop Larry Silva of Honolulu

68. Bishop Paul Swain of Sioux Falls

69. Bishop Michael J. Sheehan of Santa Fe

70. Bishop Eusebius Beltran of Oklahoma City

71. Bishop Kevin C. Rhoades of Harrisburg

72-94. Joint Statement by the bishops of New York State (22 bishops)

95-111. Joint Statement by the bishops of Pennsylvania (16 bishops)

112-116. Joint Statement by the bishops of Kansas (4 bishops)

117-126. Joint Statement by the bishops of Florida (9 bishops)

Added by me

 

127. Bishop Tobin -- http://www.catholic.org/politics/story.php?id=30333 ^

 

128. Archbishop Wilton Gregory  georgiabulletin.org ...

 

129. Archbishop Dolan http://www.jsonline.com/news/opinion/32482989.html.

 

130. Archbishop Elden Curtiss Omaha http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2123119/posts?page=1

 

131. Bishop Carlson's of Michigan pastoral letter in full, go to:
http://www.saginaw.org/images/election-statement_carlson_102...

 

[Salvation]

Did you miss this?

What You [Catholics] Need to Know: Just War [Catholic/Orthodox Caucus]

[Salvation]

Another one for you.

A Vatican Spokesman's Misguided Statement on Gun Control

Surprised?

[Conservativegreatgrandma]

I consider myself a real Lutheran—Lutheran Cburch Missouri Synod—we left the liberal ELCA 14 years ago.

[Salvation]

Catholics are FOR legal immigration as exemplified by Archbishop Jose Gomez's journey to U. S. citizenship.

Again....maybe you missed this.

He studied, took the test and became a U. S. citizen the right way. I know there are many illegals, but that is not right in my mind. Gomez sets a good example.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%c3%a9_Horacio_G%c3%b3mez#Early_life_and_education.

 

^[8] He became a U.S. citizen in 1995.^[3]

[Salvation]

OK, do you still want the HHS list of links — long?? Or do you believe me?

[Salvation]

OOPS

2008 names for you

[SecondAmendment]

Again no argument from me on pro-life an moral issues,
And there are some priests against socialism (including Pope John Paul), but as a whole the church has taken a very leftward lurch as borne out by the US bishops. Anyone who uses the term “social justice” is not on our side.

[Salvation]

Bishops Chaput explains what Catholics believe. Are you sure you aren't talking about CINOs?

“Catholic social ministry begins and ends with Jesus Christ,” he said. “If it doesn’t, it isn’t Catholic.”

~Archbishop Chaput

[Salvation]

Please remember that these Bernardin Boys (Bishops previously appointed that leaned left) are being replaced by quite conservative bishops announced almost every month by Pope Benedict.

We are awaiting one in our Archdiocese too.

[wonkowasright]

"Presumably the ELCA are ‘followers of Sodom’, since Luther never preached that sodomy is a virtue."

True. But he did repeatedly plug bigamy, he actually preached you should be able to be married to your wife and your wifes sister, or your wifes niece, or marry your goddaughter just to mention a few of his more wacky ideas. He even advised Henry VIII just to take a second wife.

In his defense he did feel that out and out polygamy was bad and that put him at odds with many of the early anabaptists.

[SecondAmendment]

And I guess this is the reason I am sticking my neck out a bit with my fellow freepers, to show that we all must keep watch over our houses of worship as much as we must oversee our representatives.

[narses]

+

Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic List:

Add me / Remove me

Please ping me to note-worthy Pro-Life or Catholic threads, or other threads of general interest.

[Ransomed]

“The Holy Father looked for a solution and found a wide-reaching one which took into account the Anglican Church’s ecclesial and liturgical traditions. If the Lutherans made a similar request - he went on to say - we will have to consider their situation carefully. But the initiative remains in the hands of the Lutherans.”

This sounds like a draconian threat. I mean this guy has legions of albino monk assassins at hand, as well as a supercomputer with all the Protestant names and locations. A guy with those resources then says that he would only consider making a special provision for a group wanting to join his group if and when that group asks for such a provision? We can only imagine the carnage if such a group decides not to ask.

Freegards

[Campion]

But, ultimately, if “Papa Benny” doesn’t correct Cd. Koch, he affirms the rhetoric.

Why, pray tell, should the Pope "correct" Cdl. Koch for something Alessandro Speciale of La Stampa said???

[Campion]

"I approve of your rhetoric."

[Ransomed]

That would make an awesome prayer card.

“St. Albinosious, patron Saint of Monastic Assassinators, please pray with us that our secret strategy of inflicting the acceptance of pastresses and homosexualist matrimony upon our fellow Christians so that some may want leave and join our Babylonian Mystery Cult succeeds, and that we may be one in our idolatry.”

Freegards, papist agent 5235362w6 out

[Psiman]

I follow the BIBLE! not Martin Luther.

No Popes!

[verga]

Lets take a look at four of these: Much of the Catholic Church's teachings are not grounded in scripture.

Every Dogmatic teaching of the Catholic Church can be found in the Bible. Not all of them are found explicitly there, but each of them is there.

The Church has dishonestly represented the views, teachings, and history of the Protestant churches, and especially the Lutherans

Can you cite specific examples?

The Church dismisses all Protestant criticisms with Ad-Homeinem attacks, never addressing the actual substance of any arguments.

I believe that you are confusing "members of the Church" with the actual Church itself. The council of Trent was called to examine various official teachings, including the number of books in the Bible.

The Church has a very top down bureaucratic structure, always requiring a priest for any religious function

Well right off the bat anyone can perform a baptism. Even a non Catholic. I know of at least 2 cases where Jewish people have performed Catholic baptisms.

Second A priest is not required for a Catholic wedding. Friends of mine were married by a deacon. Jimmy Akin performed a wedding for his niece (IIRC). In a Catholic wedding the priest acts an observer to insure that the proper matter and form is followed, but it is not required.