Rome's New and Novel Concept of Tradition Living Tradition (Viva Voce - Whatever We Say)

Monergism.com ^ | 12/17/2012 | William Webster

[Elsie]

You have no magical spectacles you can use to get into the minds of hearts of the authors of the Scriptures, and allow you to dismissed the trail of evidence, sometimes clear sometimes faint, sometimes conjured out of thin air and wishful thinking that leads back to First Century Israel.

[Elsie]

You have no magical spectacles you can use to get into the minds of hearts of the authors of the Scriptures, and allow you to dismissed the trail of evidence, sometimes clear sometimes faint, that leads back to First Century Israel.

Now now.

Don't be too harsh on him.

Although the following pertains to MORMONs; the same mindset is seen in this thread and countless others:

 

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"Any Latter-day Saint who denounces or opposes, whether actively or otherwise, any plan or doctrine advocated by the 'prophets, seers, and revelators' of the Church is cultivating the spirit of apostacy..."

(Improvement Era, June 1945, p. 354)

 

 

 

Reinforced here......

 

MP3 File

This is the audio clip of Dallin H. Oaks, current Mormon Apostle leader, from the PBS documentary, "The Mormons", declaring unequivocally:

"IT'S WRONG TO CRITICIZE LEADERS OF THE (MORMON) CHURCH, EVEN IF THE CRITICISM IS TRUE."

 

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Don't criticize?

 

Dallin H. Oaks, Mormon Apostle 

 

 

 

And here:

 

Temple Recommend Questions:

 1 Do you have faith in and a testimony of God the Eternal Father, His Son Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost?

 2 Do you have a testimony of the Atonement of Christ and of His role as Savior and Redeemer?

 3 Do you have a testimony of the restoration of the gospel in these the latter days?

 4 Do you sustain the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as the Prophet, Seer, and Revelator and as the only person on the earth who possesses and is authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain members of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local authorities of the Church?

 5 Do you live the law of chastity?

 6 Is there anything in your conduct relating to members of your family that is not in harmony with the teachings of the Church?

 7 Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?

 8 Do you strive to keep the covenants you have made, to attend your sacrament and other meetings, and to keep your life in harmony with the laws and commandments of the gospel?

 9 Are you honest in your dealings with your fellowmen?

10 Are you a full-tithe payer?

11 Do your keep the Word of Wisdom?

12 Do you have financial or other oblgations to a former spouse or children? If yes, are you current in meeting those obligations?

13 If you have previously received your temple endowment:

     Do you keep the covenants that you made in the temple?

     Do you wear the garment both night and day as instructed in the endowment and in accordance with the covenant you made in the temple?

14 Have there been any sins or misdeeds in your life that should have been resolved with priesthood authorities but have not been?

15 Do you consider yourself worthy to enter the Lord's house and participate in temple ordinances?

 

 

 

 

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Oh, they can say that their leaders were NOT speaking for GOD when they said    WHATEVER    but that's NOT the same as criticizing!

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( Remember fellow Christians:  the Mormon's criticize US because they've been taught that they CAN'T criticize ANY of their leaders; so they HAVE to vent somehow! )

[Elsie]

Although the following pertains to MORMONs; the same mindset is seen in this thread and countless others:

Merely change MORMON to Catholic and it fits pretty well.

Oh; be sure to remove the highly important MORMON rules and insert the highly important Catholic sacrements.

[Elsie]

Hicks elsewhere are not quite as hick-ish as those of us who live in 'those types of places'... Do I have that right?

I THOUGHT I had it copied!

Oh well; SANTA will forgive me! ;^)

Merry Christmas!!

Time to hit the road; you leave_it_'til_ChristmasEve shoppers!

[RobbyS]

Maybe it is because you reject the notion that celibacy can be a higher estate than the married life. A queer notion since John, Jesus, and Paul all lived celibate lives. I ascribe it to the Reformers with their hatred for the Priesthood and monasticism. Although Protestantism has have it queer sects such as those where men and women lived together without sex. Fact is that John Wesley ought not to have married since he spent too much on the road to be a good husband and father.

[Elsie]

Maybe it is because you reject the notion that celibacy can be a higher estate than the married life.

You'll need a lot more straw before than man is worth attacking.

[Elsie]

Fact is that John Wesley ought not to have married since he spent too much on the road to be a good husband and father.

Huh?

But you claim JOSEPH was a 'good man' because he DIDN'T perform his DUTY* to his wife!

Strange logic you have there!!

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* 1 Corinthians 7:5
Do not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.

[metmom]

Although Protestantism has have it queer sects such as those where men and women lived together without sex.

Such as? Examples please.

Oh? So when Protestants go without sex, it's a *queer sect* but when Catholicism does it it's the higher state than married life?

Double standard anyone?

[RobbyS]

The people who made the furniture. Of course they were queer by Protestant standards, who began with a rejection of monasticism.

[RobbyS]

Indeed, Wesley was a good and great man. But his calling was not to that of a country vicar, as his father’s had been.

Do you really think that the union of Joseph and Mary fits the situations that Paul has in mind? I am amazed that you can read the scripture and not realize the uniqueness, the seeming impossibillity of it all. Apart from the Resurrrection, nothing is so unlikely as the Virgin Birth.

[RobbyS]

Oddball? Protestants generally reject monasticism, but there have been excepts such as the Shakers (?). But, why you do say “Catholics” when the Greeks and Russians put more store by classic monasticism than we Latins do. The first monk was St. Anthony, a Coptic Christian, and he started the movement in the 3rd and 4th centuries. A kind of John the Baptist redux.

[Elsie]

I am amazed that you can read the scripture and not realize the uniqueness, the seeming impossibillity of it all. Apart from the Resurrrection, nothing is so unlikely as the Virgin Birth.

And then it was over.

Time to come down off the mountain and get back to work in the carpentry shop; not go on speaking tours and say how great this family is.

[RobbyS]

First a hazardous journey to escape the cutthroats of a mad king, and then to go into hiding, a long way from the seat of politics, and then the rearing of a very special child. Not a bad life.

[RobbyS]

How do YOU know the evidence was invented?

[RobbyS]

Merry Xmas to all who celebrate the feast, and even to those who do not.

[Elsie]

And no nookie?

Gimme a break!

[Elsie]

How do YOU know the evidence was invented?

What evidence do you mean?

Show me some and THEN I can make a JUDGEMENT.

Until then; you've got a CALVINOSAURUS or two or three on your hands.

[Elsie]

[metmom]

Protestants generally reject monasticism,

And with good reason. We are not allowed the option of cloistering ourselves in little enclaves while the world goes to hell. That is unscriptural.

Jesus' own commands.....

Matthew 28:18-20 18 And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”

Mark 16:15 15 And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation.

Acts 1:6-8 6 So when they had come together, they asked him, “Lord, will you at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?” 7 He said to them, “It is not for you to know times or seasons that the Father has fixed by his own authority. 8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you, and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth.”

[CTrent1564]

roamer_1:

Well, while I am an American of Siclian ancestry and a loyal and faithful Catholic, I actually have only lived in the Southern U.S. [3 different states]. So for the record, I can’t speak for what the Western U.S. is like as I have not been to most of the states West of the MS. River save Texas, California, Washington, Nevada, Arizona, and Coloarado.

On the other hand, based on my own experiences, there are indeed still lots of folks in many places in the Southern US [the region that I live in] that are the fundamentalist types that are in those faith traditions that have views of Christiantiy that do not have any depth beyond the local city/town that they live in and is purely a function of what the local Rev. Bob, or Brother Jim teach at the local First “fill in whatever Protestant group here” church, etc.

In addition, that type mentality a great tradition among many of the fundamentalist Protestants here on FR and thus I have no problem in equating my “lived experiences” in 3 different Southern States with many of those said FR protestant views here.