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Hey Mr. Condescension,
did you ever consider that the men who created the Catholic religion got something very wrong which has resulted in celibate priests raping little boys and bishops allowing it to go on and then being moved to the safe confines of the Vatican where they wine and dine with the Pope? Or again, abortion and homosexual agenda loving politicians being allowed to receive the Eucharist at Catholic mass? Did you at least ever consider it??? How many people at your very church will vote for Obama? If similar to other Catholic churches, the number is very significant which says much about the church itself. I'm fairly certain that the number of Obama voters at my church will be 0. We follow Christs word. Period. Amen. Sincere faith in Christ and the works follow.
Have a good day. I was wrong to have originally posted anything controversial in this thread and I'm sorry. You certainly aren't changing my views and I'd guess I've only made you angry. And I should’ve known better.

See - you guys judged the Brampster too quickly! Look how clearly and concisely he addressed the man-made Biblical translation question - he’s brilliant!!

I'm not angry, bramps, despite the fact that your most recent post was crammed with flamebait.

I'm simply pointing out to you that your posts are filled with shaky assumptions - especially your assumptions about the Bible, the main topic of the thread.

You should consider those assumptions and worry less about the mote that you see in the Pope's eye.

That would make the conversation much more profitable for both of us.

did you ever consider that the men who created the Catholic religion got something very wrong

you mean the Apostles?

What about the various cases of pastors abusing kids? This was posted on FR -- would you then condemn all Christian pastors (and the majority, 95 to 98% of pastors (Catholic or not) do NOT do this)?

SK (Baptist) pastor arrested on child rape charges
Pastor had sex with teens to cure their homosexuality
Riverside Pastor Now Faces 91 Sex-Related Charges
San Jose pastor accused of molesting boy
Pastor admits molesting 2 girls
Pastor held for sexually exploiting minor girls
Where is the Outrage? (evangelical pedophiles)
Pastor Admits Guilt in Sexual Abuse Cases on Consecutive Days
Pastor in Puyallup charged with child molesting
Pastors: Homosexuality not a sin (100 ordained Christian ministers have signed the proclamation)
Pastor arrested on child molestation charges
Teen testifies of abuse by pastor
Humboldt pastor pleads guilty to sex abuse
Charlotte Presbytery, too, ends gay ban
Clergy Sex Abuse in the Southern Baptist Convention
Kingston, PA, youth minister accused of molesting teens
Pastor Arrested For Child Molestation (DeLand, FL)
Arizona pastor arrested, accused of molesting boys in 3 states
Fugitive pastor wanted on child sex charges found (raw video link) (Gaston Co NC)
Sacramento pastor Molesting Teen
Pastor settles with victim out of court
Kelso Pastor Charged With Multiple Rapes In Portland, OR
Pastor jailed for rape
Delray pastor gets no jail time for molestation
pastor pleads guilty to molesting boy, attempt on brother
pastor gets 4 year sentence for molesting teens
Jersey Pastor Forced Teens to Make Sex Tape at Motel,
Coral springs youth pastor arrested for 10 counts of lewd and lascivious molestation
Ada preacher charged with molesting young boys
New Life Christian Center vows to support accused pastor (accused of sex with 13 y/o)
Pastor Convicted Of Sex Assault Dies In Prison (Dogwood City, TX)
Former Gladewater, TX, pastor pleads guilty in sexual assault of a child trial
Pastor arrested on charges of solicitation (High Point, NC)
pastor faces hearing on sex charges
Child molesting case resurfaces, could cost First Baptist Church of Hesperia millions
Former Prestonwood, TX, pastor remains jailed, faces online solicitation charges
First Baptist Church deacon Stephen Edmonds pleaded guilty to molesting three boy
Watertown, SD, Pastor Arrested, Charged With Sex Crimes
pastor pleads to 9 counts of voyeurism
Suits allege clergy misconduct, Two Baptist ministers apologize after women bring forth accusations
Stafford minister jailed for sex with boy in '80s

bramps: Or again, abortion and homosexual agenda loving politicians being allowed to receive the Eucharist at Catholic mass?

Bramps: I simply would've expected the Pope to follow the bible and kindly show Giuliani the door prior to receiving the Eucharist. Could I seriously ask you to explain why you think he did not do this?

Firstly, does it say in the Bible that Giuliani should be shown the door prior to receiving the Eucharist?

Secondly, what's the use of him receiving the Eucharist after he's been shown the door?

Thirdly and to the point -- what makes you think the Pope even recognizes some mayor of some city far away? -- in a crowd at mass do you think the Pope knows who Guiliani is? Just another face in the crowd.

Why should the Pope know who Guiliani is and what he looks like? Do YOU know what the mayor of say Manchester looks like?

the number is very significant which says much about the church itself. -- you mean last time 51% and next time less?

What about the hordes of non-Catholics who voted for Obama? Catholics even those in name only are just 26% of the electorate, so with a split the non-Catholics are the ones who got Obama in.

I'm fairly certain that the number of Obama voters at my church will be 0 -- in a church of 1 you can be certain of the number of voters

nd you never answered my questions -- in your beautifully silly post 38 which says actually read the bible themselves rather than depend on flawed Catholic translations

to which I ask --> interesting - so do you read the original Aramaic, Hebrew and Koine Greek texts?

Or do you read in Shakespearean 17th century English or current Modern English?

You do know that the books of the Bible were not written in standard American in the 1st century, right?

and you never answered my questions -- in your beautifully silly post 34 which quotes Apocalypse saying if anyone takes words away from this scroll of prophecy and then mistakenly thinks this is for the entire collection of books that is the Bible -- do you then read the book of Maccabees? Or is this taken away from the scroll?

and you never answered my questions -- in your beautifully silly post 34 it forgets that Revelation was among the last books to be added to canon? And did you know that most of the Early Christian communities rejected it? Even to today the book of Revelation is not read in the Orthodox Divine Liturgy. The Addition of the Book of Revelation/Apocalypse shows how the Church under the grace of the Holy Spirit pulled together the Canon that is the Bible today. Church in scripture rejected the Shepherd of Hermas even though it was accepted as scripture by many Early Christians and put in Apocalypse even after objections by many

Syrian Christians in the 2nd century rejected it, Martin Luther initially considered it to be "neither apostolic nor prophetic" and stated that "Christ is neither taught nor known in it," and is not known of in the ancient church of the Georgians.

bramps: I'm fairly certain that the number of Obama voters at my church will be 0. We follow Christs word.

And yet bramps said on this postI have just connected to FR, saw your posting and read a few paragraphs of Mr Salza’s book. Let me tell you that I am a Freemason, have been for 41 years, I am also of the Catholic religion, converted 56 years ago, -- really?

bramps: I'm fairly certain that the number of Obama voters at my church will be 0. We follow Christs word.

And yet bramps said on this postI have just connected to FR, saw your posting and read a few paragraphs of Mr Salza’s book. Let me tell you that I am a Freemason, have been for 41 years, I am also of the Catholic religion, converted 56 years ago, -- so let's see you are saying that at your parish (since you said you are Catholic), the number of Obama voters will be 0. Good for your parish priest.