guilty as charged, i find it extremely difficult, if not impossible to have an actual exchange with someone who confuses the length of a post with actually dealing with the question asked ( it doesn’t fool anyone ) and someone who continually claims the Scriptures teach something they don’t.
exhibit A- the question was asked where does the Bible ever say Baptism is symbolic. the “answer” given once one gets past the pseudo intellectual nonsense, is 1 Peter 3:21.
the claim is made it says baptism is a “figure”, IT DOES NOT. the claim is made it says souls were purified by faith even before baptism, IT DOES NOT.
The verse teaches ONE BAPTISM and that we are SAVED BY BAPTISM.
for all the pseudo intellectual nonsense, it appears the poster does not understand “types” in the OT and the “antitypes” in the NT. I will try and help him.
the OT contains mant types that are symbolic or figurative that are then contrasted in the NT by the antitype, which is actually the REALITY that God wishes to show us.
some examples, Abraham willing to sacrifice Isaac is the OT type for the Father willing to sacrifice His Son as the antitype. the ark in the OT was a type of Jesus saving all those in Him as the antitype. get it? the antitype is the REALITY.
so in 1 Peter 3 we find Peter using the 8 people saved thru water in Noah’s day as the type AND BAPTISM IS THE ANTITYPE THAT SAVES US TODAY THRU WATER. it must be embarrassing to Baptist’s who understand type/antitypes in the Scriptures to see someone try and make the case that 1 Peter says Baptism is a “figure”
the Church has always rejected the false choice between faith and baptism. the two can’t be seperated.
so 1 Peter 3:21 teaches exactly what Paul wrote in Titus 3:5, he saved us , not because of any deeds done by is in righteousness, but in virtue of his own mercy, BY THE WASHING OF REGENERATION AND RENEWAL IN THE HOLY SPIRIT.
again, i invite anyone to answer the following questions:
why did Jesus command baptism?
where does the Bible teach two baptisms?
where does the Bible say baptism is symbolic?
where does the Bible teach baptism is to be done as a first act of obedience?
where does the Bible teach baptism is an outward sign of what has happened inwardly already?
Why not just be honest for a change? You are NOT "inviting" anyone to answer the questions you pose - seeing as they HAVE been answered satisfactorily, repeatedly and Biblically - it seems you only want the answers to be your own presupposed answers, aren't you? You pose these SAME questions across multiple threads whenever you start losing an argument about any other subject. Like Obama and his "race card", you pull this one out as a last resort in an attempt to stop all disagreements and present yourself and your chosen religion as THE authority. Every time you do this, you only make this more apparent than the last time you flipped the card out. You even made your SCREEN NAME the same as your "trump" card!
Like I asked earlier, why not just be honest? I believe you expect whatever you claim is your interpretation of what your religion says MUST be the truth and only the truth and anyone who attempts to prove something else is cast off as ignorant. Don't be surprised the next time you pull the same canard, that you are ignored completely - I know I will. You will only have yourself to blame.
why did Jesus command baptism?
Immersion in the Holy Spirit (baptism) is the means by which we are joined to Christ and made fellow-heirs. It is when God marks us as His own.
Water baptism is also important. Its value is in sanctification - separation from the world.
Some examples, not exhaustive:
Mark 1: 8 - 8 I have baptized you with water, but he will baptize you with the Holy Spirit.
Acts 10: “45 And the believers from among the circumcised who had come with Peter were amazed, because the gift of the Holy Spirit was poured out even on the Gentiles. 46 For they were hearing them speaking in tongues and extolling God. Then Peter declared, 47 “Can anyone withhold water for baptizing these people, who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?”
where does the Bible say baptism is symbolic?
That it is nothing more than a symbol? Nowhere. That it involves symbolism?
“3 Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4 We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life.” - Romans 10
1 Cor 10: “10 For I do not want you to be unaware, brothers, that our fathers were all under the cloud, and all passed through the sea, 2 and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea, 3 and all ate the same spiritual food, 4 and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank from the spiritual Rock that followed them, and the Rock was Christ. 5 Nevertheless, with most of them God was not pleased, for they were overthrown in the wilderness.
6 Now these things took place as examples for us, that we might not desire evil as they did.”
where does the Bible teach baptism is to be done as a first act of obedience?
It doesn’t, explicitly. However, it is obviously an act of obedience, and it obviously was done very promptly - unlike in the modern day:
“30 Then he brought them out and said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” 31 And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.” 32 And they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all who were in his house. 33 And he took them the same hour of the night and washed their wounds; and he was baptized at once, he and all his family.” - Acts 16
where does the Bible teach baptism is an outward sign of what has happened inwardly already?
Apart from the indwelling Holy Spirit, there is no reason to baptize. First comes faith, then immersion (baptism) in the Holy Spirit, and then water baptism follows. But it is the inward act that gives water baptism its value:
“In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, 14 who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory.” - Ephesians 1
Gal 3: “2 Let me ask you only this: Did you receive the Spirit by works of the law or by hearing with faith? 3 Are you so foolish? Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh? 4 Did you suffer so many things in vain—if indeed it was in vain? 5 Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith— 6 just as Abraham “believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness”?
7 Know then that it is those of faith who are the sons of Abraham.”
1 Cor 12: “12 For just as the body is one and has many members, and all the members of the body, though many, are one body, so it is with Christ. 13 For in one Spirit we were all baptized into one body— Jews or Greeks, slaves or free—and all were made to drink of one Spirit.”
Ephesians 4: “4 There is one body and one Spirit—just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call— 5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism, 6 one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.”
1 Peter 3: “...in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were brought safely through water. 21 Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ...”
There is no case in scripture of a non-believer being baptized. Nor is there any reason to do so. If baptism brought regeneration, we ought to forcibly baptize everyone in water, giving them life and repentance and the gift of the Holy Spirit. But you can sprinkle away until someone drowns without giving them faith or life...
You are indeed guilty as charged.
If you actually read responses last week you would have seen that your questions and the argument behind them were answered, including that “like figure” does NOT mean type and antitype, with baptism being the reality, as is the case in Heb. 9:24 (representative of the true - look it up) which is the only other place antitupon occurs, but that both are representatives.
And which was shown you and dismissed, as is your fringe Catholic contention that Cornelius and company were not forgiven and born again before baptism.
As for your protest over my laborious content which refutes you, do you know how to make paragraphs consistently?
Go find another RC that agrees with you on Cornelius, as for you, this is it. Bye.