[wmfights]

...Origen promoted a punitive supersessionist approach in which the people of Israel were forever “abandoned because of their sins.”[1] He also declared: “And we say with confidence that they [Jews] will never be restored to their former condition.

[wmfights]

Ping

[tbpiper]

For they committed a crime of the most unhallowed kind, in conspiring against the Saviour of the human race in that city

If only someone had stopped them, Jesus could have lived a long and productive life, dying at a ripe old age. Of course that would have left us holding the bag for our own sins. Instead, the Jews performed the function they were destined to do. They were the priests, Jesus was the Lamb, Rome was the knife. I think Origen missed it on this one.

[Mrs.Z]

“...Origen promoted a punitive supersessionist approach in which the people of Israel were forever “abandoned because of their sins.”[1] He also declared: “And we say with confidence that they [Jews] will never be restored to their former condition”

Origen, the first radical muslim.

[GreyFriar]

Origen ping. I’ll read later

[lurk]

Origen deserves our respect.

But on this issue, both he and our Covenant brothers are lost in the tall grass. Too much scripture promising great things for the nation of Israel in the future.

[Cicero]

On this issue he was wrong. The Magisterium has never backed him on this point.

[Colorado Cowgirl]

Well this Church father is wrong. And I say with confidence that God’s word says different: Hebrews 8:10-11 For this [is] the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: And they shall not teach every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

[Ancesthntr]

G-d made a covenant with the people of Israel forever. If Origen is right, then G-d is a liar...or maybe there’s another conclusion.

I am still mystified why so many people cannot accept the idea that G-d can make a separate covenant with 2 different peoples - one being the Jews/Israel, and the other being the Gentiles. After all, a covenant is like a contract or a promise, and if we mere mortals can enter into more than one contract or make more than one promise, why can’t the Creator?

FYI, it is my opinion (as a Jew) that Origen’s statements have led to more bloodshed in the name of his religion than just about anything else in all of history...and his soul still has a lot of time to suffer for that crime against humanity.

[1malumprohibitum]

“He taught that Israel was permanently rejected by God and that the church was the new Israel. Concerning Israel’s rejection, Origen promoted a punitive supersessionist approach in which the people of Israel were forever “abandoned because of their sins.”[1]”

I think he was partially right but for a different reason. Israel was not rejected by God, Israel rejected God by rejecting Christ. This is not a permanent situation. Israel, just like everyone else, may come to the Father through the Son. Many have done so and many more will.

Arguing that the nation of Israel is allowed to remain favored of God while rejecting his Son elevates the OT over the New, is in direct opposition to the plain meaning of Christs own words (John 14:6) and ignores the reason for Christ’s sacrifice which was for ALL mankind. ALL who believe in the Father are favored of him and none are more favored than others.

* Not to mention the Jews (mistakenly) believed in an earthly king and an earthly kingdom the last time around and look how that worked out for them. Christians believing that there will be an earthly kingdom and an earthly reign with the Jews at the apex make no sense whatsoever. I can see why Jews who continue to reject Christ as the Son of God would believe such but for Christians it is a rejection of their belief system.

[HarleyD]

Rom 9:6-8 But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For not all who are descended from Israel belong to Israel, and not all are children of Abraham because they are his offspring, but "Through Isaac shall your offspring be named." This means that it is not the children of the flesh who are the children of God, but the children of the promise are counted as offspring.

[count-your-change]

Origen my be fun to whip on but the opinion that counts is that of Jehovah or YHWH, Yahweh.
By inspiration he has informed us through the words of Scripture who He recognizes as the true Israel.

[boatbums]

but we understand that there exists a race of souls which is termed ‘Israel,’ as is indicated by the interpretation of the name itself: for Israel is interpreted to mean a ‘mind,’ or ‘man seeing God.’

Apparently, Origen missed Genesis 32:28

And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed.

The name "Israel", therefore, means "God prevails" and "contender" or "soldier of God". As it was used for Jacob and the twelve tribes that came from his twelve sons, it meant "Prince of God". Not sure where Origen got the idea that it meant "mind" OR "man seeing God", but his strange interpretation of the name Jehovah gave to Jacob and his descendants explains how he could then imagine that God would break His promises to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. To say that the Jews will never be restored to their former condition also distorts God's plans as He has clearly told us. An everlasting covenant is everlasting.