If you think Paul's thorn is any type of illness, you need to read it again. Paul tells you in the same verse EXACTLY what it was, a messenger of satan. Paul was attacked by demonic persecution that dogged his ministry. God's grace was more than enough to remove it at the appropriate time.
To keep me from becoming conceited because of these surpassingly great revelations, there was given me a thorn in my flesh, a messenger of Satan, to torment me. 2 Corinthians 12:7 NIV (emphasis added)
Satan was determined, as he still is, to stop the spread of the surpassingly great revelations of the New Birth. That we are redeemed from the curse, spiritually reborn, the Body of Christ, children of God and more than conquerors. Satan doesn't mind if a few people get saved and just attend church on Sunday - that's not much of a threat to him. But he can't have thousands of "imitators of Christ" attacking his work all over the world. Imagine how large the Church would grow and quickly the Gospel would spread if ALL Christians were operating under a Christ-like anointing with all the spiritual gifts working - healing the sick, casting out devils, feeding the hungry miraculously, preaching the Good News to the poor. Satan's kingdom would melt like an ice cube on a Texas sidewalk in Summer.
I cited key verses in Job that show exactly what transpired. Note that God placed a hedge around Job. That was Satan's complaint to God. Satan attempted to provoke God to remove the hedge, but God did NOT remove it. He told satan behold, or look, he is in your hands because something else had removed the hedge. But he refrained the destroyer from touching Job's life.
At the end we are told Job was captive. By whom, if God "turned the captivity of Job" and "restored twice what he had before." Job's own fear was the culprit - "what I GREATLY feared came upon me." He was not only afraid, he was HIGHLY developed in it. Fear is the polar opposite of faith. I posted Ecclesiastes 10:8 as another clue that provides insight - I love how the Bible just keeps helping you along.
He that diggeth a pit shall fall into it; and whoso breaketh an hedge, a serpent shall bite him. Ecclesiastes 10:8 KJV -- Who broke the hedge and who is the serpent? This is a spiritual truth that provides much understanding throughout the Bible.
I encourage you to read Job, especially 1, 2, 6 and 42 carefully as if you have never read it before, without any bias. Maybe in two or three translations if that helps for a fresh perspective. That is what I did when the light finally went off removing religious tradition that had blinded and bound me for so very long. It also helped that I started seeing God as a GOOD GOD - my Heavenly Father that is Love and does not change.
The entrance of thy words giveth light; it giveth understanding unto the simple. Psalm 119:130 KJV
If I have seemed abrasive on any of these threads, please forgive me. I have been writing quickly and passionately about a subject that is near to my heart. My free time is quite limited and there is so much I want to share. I love God's Word and treasure it more and more every day. When I have time, I just start writing and things keep coming to my spirit to include. I truly hope someone is edified by these discussions
Regardless of whether or not you "covered" Job and Paul's afflictions, you are still giving your own understanding of what and why about those afflictions and if I do not accept that explanation it doesn't mean I have not also carefully read ALL of Scripture. I just do not agree with you, but I would never say you are calling God a liar just because of that. I can discuss why I differ and not be "abrasive" about it or take offense.
WRT Paul's thorn in the flesh, I do not agree that Paul's tormentor was attacks by demonic personages. Though Paul had his share of persecution and troubles because of the cause of the Gospel, there were others who experienced more if not worse than he. Rather than presume that Paul "didn't do it right" in how he dealt with this "thorn", why not see not only what this was but why God allowed it in Paul's life at all?
From http://www.blueletterbible.org/faq/thorn.cfm, I think this is a well reasoned explanation:
There have been many theories as to what exactly this thorn was—so many theories in fact, that it is impossible to diagnose Paul's situation with complete assurance. Some have suggested that Paul's thorn came in the form of Jewish persecution because of the surrounding context speaking of opponents. Even in Numbers 33:55 thorns are used as a metaphor for the enemies of the Israelites. Others have suggested that Paul's own remembrance of his past was his thorn; Paul's past included the persecution of the church (Acts 8:1-3; Gal 1:13; Phil 3:6) which may have continually haunted him and kept him humble. Some even propose that Paul dealt with either carnal temptation or depression.
A physical ailment, however, seems more likely here, though the lack of details forbid a proper diagnosis. Physical infirmities that seem to fit the situation are malaria, Malta fever, epilepsy, convulsive attacks, and chronic ophthalmia.
Many of these physical disabilities also affect the eyesight and it seems probable that even Paul himself experienced difficulty with his vision—this could very well be caused by his thorn in the flesh. Paul took advantage of various amanuenses to do the actual writing of at least some of his epistles. A mentioned amanuensis of Paul is Tertius who wrote down the book of Romans and added his own greeting to the church in Rome (Rom 16:22). Other times we see Paul adding a salutation with his own hands (1 Cor 16:21; 2 Thess 3:17) as opposed to physically writing the entire epistles. Paul even wrote in large print as noted in Gal 6:11. Other evidences of poor vision can be found earlier in the epistle to the Galatians. Paul says that because of physical infirmity he preached the gospel to the Galatians at the first (Gal 4:13). Some have speculated that the physical infirmity was a disease which affected his eyesight and the higher altitude in Galatia would have been better for him, especially if the disease was malaria. And only two verses later Paul states that the Galatian church would have plucked out their own eyes and given them to him if it were possible (Gal 4:15). Another example of Paul's poor eyesight is found in Acts 23:3-5. Paul was in the Sanhedrin at this point and referred to the high priest as a "white-washed wall" and those who stood by him asked why he was insulting the high priest. Paul responded by telling them that he did not realize that the man was the high priest. Though Paul, previously being a Pharisee, would have been able to recognize the high priest quite easily. Yet at this point he seemed unable to identify the high priest, even though the high priest would have stood out because he wore special garments and accessories. For a former Pharisee to have not recognized him is likely explained through understanding that Paul was not able to see him properly—giving weight to theories of trouble with his vision.
Paul's thorn came by way of a messenger of Satan in order to torment him. Yet at the same time it was given to him in order that he would not become conceited. The present paradox can be compared to that of the story of Job. Satan was permitted to afflict God's servant, yet only within the parameters set by God (Job 2). Paul also wrote about handing an immoral brother to Satan so that his flesh may be destroyed and his spirit saved on the day of the Lord (1 Cor 5:5). Satan is used at times as an instrument to bolster the faith or prove the righteousness of believers.
The ambiguity of the thorn in the flesh is actually a positive thing. If Paul would have specifically stated the identity of his thorn, believers from following generations may have discarded his experience if they were not afflicted with the same affliction. However, Christians from many generations have benefited by his reference to the thorn while applying it to their specific problems (Murray J. Harris. The Expositors Bible Commentary: 2 Corinthians. Grand Rapids: Zondervan Publishing House, 1976. p. 396). The thorn of which Paul speaks gives us an understanding of God's perspective concerning physical infirmities. Sometimes God uses illnesses for his purposes. Paul experienced many sufferings outside of his thorn (2 Cor 11:22-28), yet God used him mightily for the furtherance and advancement of His Gospel. The existence of illness or suffering in a believer's life does not necessarily constitute a sinful life or a life that lacks faith. Paul pleaded with the Lord on three separate occasions for the Lord to remove the thorn, yet God's grace was enough for the apostle and His power is made perfect in Paul's weaknesses.
Great post, as usual.
In order to make some seek for themselves and see it for themselves, I suggested they are making an assumption in believing Paul’s thorn in his flesh was an illness.
Instead I received a harsh reply stating that it said FLESH!! They continued in their assumption and never searched it out. You can’t tell some anything. So now that you pointed it out to them, maybe some will say ‘thank you’ to you.
Your posts have been right on!! And you got harsh condemning replies in return. If you don’t believe as they do, then comes the insults - from we aren’t dividing the word properly to we are being like Job’s friends in condemning them. And that’s the results of posting TRUTH while they lean unto their own understanding.
THANK YOU!! God’s Word is true and every man a liar!