Posted on 11/24/2011 8:32:12 AM PST by Steelfish
11/23/2011 Will Catholic Mass Changes Cause Mass Confusion? Elizabeth Tenety
The Catholic Church, its religious authorities often remind its followers, is intentionally slow to change, if it ever changes at all. The ritual of Communion, where the priest consecrates the bread and wine for distribution to the faithful, for example, has been observed in similar fashion for thousands of years.
But this weekend, millions of English-speaking Catholics will experience some of the most profound change in their lifetime when the words of the Catholic liturgy are phased out in favor of a new translation.
As Michelle Boorstein reported this month, a summer survey showed that most Catholics were then unaware of the upcoming changes. In recent weeks, say church officials, priests and parishes have been preparing Catholics through instruction at religious services, direct mailings and communication campaigns.
The overhaul has been in the works for a decade, and “is aimed at unifying the more than 1 billion Catholics worldwide with a translation that is as close as possible to the original Latin version.” In some cases, the new language will more literally reflect the Scripture passages on which liturgical prayers were based.
One example of that shift is in a line familiar to Catholics at the height of the Mass, just before Communion. “Lord, I am not worthy to receive you, but only say the word and I shall be healed,” Catholics have said for decades. This weekend, those words change to, “Lord, I am not worthy that you should enter under my roof, but only say the word and my soul shall be healed.” This new translation borrows from a story in the Gospel of Matthew in which Jesus entered a man’s home and healed his servant.
If you’re attending Mass this weekend, here’s what you need to know:
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...
When we quote Scripture it's "WRITTEN, dead, repetitious, religious words over and over".
When you quote Scripture it's okey-dokey.
But that's not bashing, or bigotry, or irrational hatred, or anything like that.
Gotcha.
Jesus spoke Aramaic to his disciples. They understood that they needed to repeat his words in Greek or Latin when they preached to the world.
"Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language. And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these speak Galilaeans? And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?" Acts 2:6-8.
That was a miracle at Pentecost, one of many. However, you don’t believe that every Christian liturgy or gathering is miraculously translated, do you?
I laugh when I hear this, but as a Southerner I have beenb subjected to many a Baptist prayer. Seldom do they stick to scripture. Instead they open their mouths and let the words flow out, certain it is that the Spirit is speaking through them. Meanwhile the meal gets cold.
I would hope that all parishes are now supplied with proper missalettes and explanatory booklets and such. Those who do not favor this beautiful “translation” (hardly that, only about 10% of the Mass), are ignorant because they don’t realize its significance.
To improve understanding, if you want an excellent resource for yourself, a friend, a priest, or your parish, I researched quite a few and found this to be among the best:
Publisher: Magnificat (online)
Title: “Roman Missal Companion” (little booket)
Contains articulate commentary by the brilliant Anthony Esolen. Explains the complexity and method of doing good translations. Then the book goes thru each new change, with the reasoning for it.
"And these signs SHALL follow them THAT BELIEVE; In my name SHALL they cast out devils; they SHALL speak with new tongues; (verse17) they SHALL take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it SHALL not hurt them; they SHALL lay hands on the sick, and they SHALL recover. (verse18)".
And according to the verse right above that, verse 16: "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved..." and then goes on to verses 17 and 18, stating what those who believed and were baptized would be able to do.
Signs SHALL follow them that believe. Shall does not mean maybe, should, can, or only on the day of Pentecost. It says ALL who believe SHALL do these things, including speaking with new tongues.
Not rock, I guess. But pleasing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAo2iZ9vWHg
Music is such a matter of personal culture or taste. I prefer a Charles Wesley Hymn. As you probably know, Wesley’s hymns were dismissed at the time, because they aimed to popular taste. Psalms were prefered in NE churches. They didn’t even aim to sing in the same key or even the same. This is what Southers called “Cant.” Cacaphony.
I was raised Catholic, and have since left the church, and I consider myself to be a deist. But to that, I have no argument with anyone going to a church that is trying to better themselves and their community. I might not agree on theology, but if you are accomplishing the above, good by me.
I have my issues with the Catholic Church, mostly regarding the bureaucracy of it (which covered for many things, including the homosexual buggering of boys). But with that said, I have an appreciation of Mass and the special event it is for believers. I absolutely love and am awed by the churches that have been built across this country--mostly around 1900, that are absolutely beautiful. I frankly am unimpressed with the banner filled, hand holding, minimalist churches. I liked the communion rail, and big altar, and a solemn and serious service.
I don't think it was a Catholic Church, but a year or two ago there was a big youtube hit of a wedding party dancing UP the aisle. Again, I no longer consider myself of the Christian variety, but I found it disrespectful. If you want to jack around, do it in the banquet hall.
So not the same thing, and I don't know if as an ex-Catholic my opinion counts, but over the past couple years, when I go to a Mass for some family event, I am really disappointed on what a Mass has become. Maybe this new change is for the better.
It works for millions of Christians...
While you can find scripture that, although misunderstood, states that Jesus flesh is meat, you can not find in scripture where anyone is told to perform any function that turns bread into the flesh of Jesus...
Or, that Jesus comes back to earth...
You will find in scripture however, that Jesus is sitting at the right hand of God...And that is not on the earth...
Those folks that leave you cold know that Jesus is STILL sitting at the right hand of the Father and they are raising their hands to him in worship...
And those cheezy songs you don't like are glorifying God...Just listen to the words...
Thanks, I think I have heard that once or twice at services I have attended in the past.
My wife has been Catholic all her life. I was a late bloomer and didn`t find Christ until my mid 30`s. One of the reasons I didn`t turn away was because of a small church in St. Louis, MO ( Trinity Church of The Nazarene , in Florissant ).
The moment I stepped through those doors I knew it was a special place. The people, the pastor , the music, all made me want to come back again and again. I could feel the love and the passion, it was real. Finally, I started to understand; things made sense. My life took a massive turn and has never been the same.
I wish I could tell you the whole story but one driving force behind my road to Christ was music. It worked for me in many ways, but that was me. Others may need a different path and I can respect that.
Pass.
"And he took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to them, saying, "This is my body given for you; do this in remembrance of me."
Just thought I'd put that out there.
Liberal response?
I grew up in East Texas, a very Protestant area. My wife is Methodist, and I have nothing bad to say about them. I admire The Wesley Brothers. But that Church has tuned away from its founders.
John Wesley was not deep into theology: he equivocated between Calvinism and Arminianism and stressed a common morality. But he must be saddened by the way his successors have abandoned what he thought about sexual morality. Today;s morality is a kind of reversion to the morality that kept the common people of the 18th Century down spiritually and afflicted the upper classes as well.
Wesley exemplified evangelical moralism, a view that was adopted by William Wilberforce and the Clapham Section, who started the popular movement against slavery and who worked to effect the reform of manners and Morals that we associate with Victoria.
The movement had a similar effect in America. The second Great Awakening owed a lot to the Methodists, so much so that the great Catholic historian Christopher Dawson called Wesley a founder of the American Revolution. An ironic title for a man who was a political Tory and opponent of that revolution.
Just thought I'd put that out there.
And we are all familiar with that verse...
First of all, Jesus says do what in remembrance of me??? He tells us in the verse...BREAK THE BREAD...That's highly important...
Does Jesus tell anyone to turn the bread into his flesh in his absense??? NO...Does Jesus tell anyone how to turn the bread into his flesh??? NO...
You wrote:
“The mass verbiage I listed includes chanted responses to the priest.”
No, it doesn’t. The responses are not chanted. They are simply spoken.
“Asking God three times for the same thing, is very different than mumbling the same dead words (the Rosary) over and over for a lifetime.”
No one is mumbling any dead words in the rosary or at the Mass.
“but, that is certainly not the same as mumbling the same WRITTEN, dead, repetitious, religious, words over and over.”
So, if someone prays the Psalms he is “mumbling the same WRITTEN, dead, repetitious, religious, words over and over”?
Clearly the anti-Catholic mindset is not only idiotic, it is anti-biblical.
“The WaPo is dramatizing again.”
The WaPo is lying—still.
What do I mean by “lie?” I mean the premeditated, malicious communication of statements known to be false for the purpose of deceiving the listener (or reader).
That is their primary MO.
“What was wrong with the words Jesus said to his disciples?”
Nothing is wrong with His words. It is the misinterpretation of them that is the problem.
“Catholics. Sheesh.”
As Archbishop Fulton J. Sheen said, “There are not a hundred people in America who hate the Catholic Church—but there are millions who hate what they mistakenly think the Catholic Church teaches.”
Defamation, which is a very, very serious sin.
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